TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

THERAPIST: Hi, come on in.

CLIENT: How are ya?

THERAPIST: Good, thank you.

CLIENT: And this is the check.

THERAPIST: Oh great, thank you. Great. And you just need to sign it over.

CLIENT: Oh yeah.

THERAPIST: Yeah, because it’s made out to you. So you just need to say like: “Pay to the Order of Helen Gregory.”

CLIENT: Okay.

THERAPIST: Thank you.

CLIENT: Thank you. Anyways, how was your weekend?

THERAPIST: The weekend was very nice.

CLIENT: It was nice?

THERAPIST: Yeah, it was very nice.

CLIENT: Good. Nothing really new with me. Just still like I feel like happier and more energetic. I can see like people picking up on that. I like have always had like a social anxiety, and I felt like others like wouldn’t approach me, and now I kinda just approach them and talk to them. You know, I’m just like more social than I’ve been. And I noticed that like I’m building more friendships than I did before. It’s weird. And like people can—people are more I guess like attracted to those that are happy than those that seem like they’re unhappy and like—I don’t know. I notice that, like people are more attracted to me, and like engaged.

THERAPIST: Hm. [2:00]

CLIENT: Is that just me? Isn’t that right, when you’re more positive and energetic people want to be around you?

THERAPIST: Sounds like you’re—that’s the way—that’s what you’re picking up on.

CLIENT: Yeah, it’s weird.

THERAPIST: Huh.

CLIENT: I’m getting like a lot of attention I’ve never gotten for like a year.

THERAPIST: Hm.

CLIENT: So. [pause]

THERAPIST: Okay, thank you. [unclear]

CLIENT: Yeah. I signed it too.

THERAPIST: Awesome.

CLIENT: Me and Steve have been fine. I just—I think I’m distancing myself more. So we’ll see what happens. More like [that I’m learning/wanting? 3:10] to like not push things, just like analyzing how he is with like a change in my behavior. It’s weird. I can see like where we’re more different, and how like I don’t know if something’s—I’m not sure if I think we should be together because of what we both want. I think he’s just like comfortable with who he is and he’s always going to be there. I don’t know, I just want more. And I’m just seeing if like either he gives me more, or I’m just going to move on. At this point I’m just tired. [4:00]

THERAPIST: Well, what would more look like?

CLIENT: Just more like attention. And like affection. Like last night we kissed and he was looking at the TV. And he was like, “Oh, it’s just a good movie.” And I’m like, that’s so wrong. Like got to be more like affection. He just was like in his own little world, and just like he’s okay with that. It’s weird. To me it’s weird. I didn’t notice it, I thought it was like—I thought it was because of me like he was that way. But it’s not, that’s just like who he is. So I’m not sure if that’s right for me.

THERAPIST: You’re taking it far less personally.

CLIENT: Yeah. Yeah, I thought it was something I did for him to be like that. And I’m like, “Nope, he’s just—that’s him.” And I never noticed it before. Like when we first started going out I think it was more me. Like I would call him, and I would do—you know, do things. I would be more to like go and try and kiss him, or comfort him, where it’s like not both. I mean, like he’d participate or whatever, but it was me that like always made the first move. And—I don’t know, I don’t want that anymore.

THERAPIST: Mm hm.

CLIENT: But he’s just—he’s seen a difference in me, he saw like I’m happier. And he thinks it’s weird, a little bit. He’s confused by like the change in my behavior. [6:00]

THERAPIST: He thinks it’s weird that you’re happier?

CLIENT: He’s confused by everything. He’s confused on how I react. Like I’m like I come home late, and I don’t call him if I’m at work. I had like four days of hell at work, and like I did doubles and I got mandated, and I probably did like 40 hours in like three days. So like I would go to work and I’d come home. And he was more the one where, “You said you were going to be home but you’re not home.” And it’s like that’s what I was like with him, and now I’m like—I’m just not focused on the relationship as much. I think he’s picking up on it. It’s taken him a while.

But he’s said like, oh, I usually will overact, and I don’t. And I’m able to like tell him how I’m feeling without like getting wicked emotional. And I told him, I’m like, it’s ten months, and we can’t just continue this relationship like this. And he’s like, “I understand why you’re saying that.” I was like, “Well, don’t you want more for us? Don’t you want more?” And he said he does. Like he wants more for like his self, and like his education and everything. But I just—I don’t see him doing anything. And that’s like what bothers me. Because I feel like we’re at different levels in our life. It doesn’t mean like we’re not going to be together, but I just think like in ten months that we should like move out and see if this is like really what we want. I haven’t told him I’m thinking like that, but I’ve like hinted at it. And it kinda—it makes me happy to feel like this doesn’t have to be my life. I feel like a relief. [8:10]

THERAPIST: That you have choices.

CLIENT: Mm hm.

THERAPIST: And it’s not so dire and doom laden.

CLIENT: Yeah. I just—I can’t my life with somebody that doesn’t try as hard as I’m trying. And I just—I really feel like neglected in this relationship. And I still do. And there’s reasons for it, you know. And I thought it was like me making it up in my head. But no. Like it’s just not working. And it’s okay. You know. But if he changes like in ten months, puts more effort, is more affectionate, like I guess I could change my mind. But right now I just don’t see it. I mean, that makes sense, right?

THERAPIST: Mm hm.

CLIENT: What do you think?

THERAPIST: You’re wanting my feedback on it?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Like you want my feedback like does it sound reasonable? Or…

CLIENT: Do I feel like—am I overreacting?

THERAPIST: I see, that’s the question, you’re worried you’re overreacting about his behavior?

CLIENT: About—yeah. Like if your needs aren’t met in a relationship, like are you really supposed to sacrifice this much? [10:00]

THERAPIST: Hm. So you’re sort of thinking or maybe concerned about are you asking for too much? Is this an okay reason to walk away from the relationship? Are you not compromising enough? Is that kind of what you’re concern— I see.

CLIENT: Yeah. Like if you’re not happy, you’re not happy, right? Or is just going happen like in every relationship I have?

THERAPIST: The thing that I feel—the way in which I could be most helpful to you is for you to have— [phone rings] Sorry about this. —for you to have confidence in your decision, whatever decision you make.

CLIENT: Mm hm.

THERAPIST: Because it’s certainly not up to me, or really to anyone, to tell you what you should or shouldn’t be able to tolerate, put up with, what it is that you ultimately need or want. You’re the only person who can determine that.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: And it sounds like you’re feeling—you’re certainly having clarity, but then a little bit of anxiety about what—you know, sort of whether the—sort of happy to have an end in terms and seeing if he’s going to change, and if not not to stay in it. Sort of you’re feeling a little bit insecure about that.

CLIENT: Yeah, I think that’s going to take time.

THERAPIST: Mm hm.

CLIENT: And I think like there’s still hope there, like that he will change, whatever. Like I just—I don’t want this to be a pattern if I like get in another relationship.

THERAPIST: When you say this could be a pattern, what’s this?

CLIENT: Like I did this in the last relationship. Like I gave everything to that person, and like instead of like, you know, just caring about myself I cared about them. You know. And I feel like I did this with Steve, like I just gave and gave and gave. And like he like that, that helped him, but there was nothing like going in my direction. Like am I going to do this again? Or like I just seem to like not take care of me, but I take care of them.

THERAPIST: In the hopes that they would take care of you? [12:30]

CLIENT: I just feel like it could be like a mutual thing, you know. So. And I feel like I’m like in the same relationship I was before. I mean, they’re different people, they have different personalities, but they’re both single, like the only child, broken home, pretty selbike. And like I would just financially help them, and emotionally help them. And if I felt like, you know, like that should have—it should go both ways, and I was never at the other end. So like Steve’s a much sweeter person than my last boyfriend, but I feel like it’s the same relationship. So. It’s like why do I keep going out with these people?

THERAPIST: Do you feel like you’ve been going to a dry well?

CLIENT: I don’t know. I don’t know, like after this I think I’ve learned. Like I don’t know. I guess I was like feeling like—I just always wanted to—like I’m very caring, and I care about the person, that person for like, you know, that they are, care for them. But like I just wasn’t caring about myself. I mean, giving everything to them in person and not taking care of yourself. Like I don’t know why I did that. Like I would sacrifice like my happiness for the other person. And that doesn’t work. Because then you just end up resenting them and being unhappy. Like I’m trying to find somebody that would do the same for me. I don’t know. That’s what I want. And I mean like Steve tries, he tries so hard. But he’s just in a situation where like he’s unhappy, and he like isn’t doing anything about it still. He like helps me, like he helps me with the house and stuff like that. Like I just don’t even care about that stuff anymore. I don’t know.

THERAPIST: That used to be really important to you.

CLIENT: Yeah, it’s not. [15:30]

THERAPIST: What changed do you think?

CLIENT: I don’t think the relationship’s as important to me. Or like having a home and like nesting I guess aren’t important to me anymore, because I’m not like all about the relationship a hundred percent. Like I was—it’s like I was playing house, I thought we were gonna like have home together, you know. And it didn’t work that way. So it’s like I just, I don’t care. I’m not going to force him to pick up. Like if I want it to be clean, I’ll clean it, you know. But I’m not going to put pressure on myself to, you know. I told him I was on strike. Like I already do the dishes. Like he’s going to help me. So. Everybody else in the world would do dishes together. But like I’m not going to do all the work anymore, it’s just not going to happen.

And I just—I don’t—I used to like, I don’t know, freak out about all this little stuff, and I was just so concerned like things wouldn’t— It’s more like when you’re not happy in a relationship you’re like—I kind of like fought to make things better, or I didn’t like allow him to do it, you know what I mean? So it was like I was pushing, and I knew what I needed. And I kept telling him and it never made anything better. So it’s like I still had fight in me. Now I just like don’t care, and I just care about myself, and little stuff doesn’t bother me, I guess I don’t care as much about them.

And I don’t know if I’m just like putting up a wall. I’m just kind of distancing myself. And spending more time with friends, and more time with school and stuff, and working a little more. Like I don’t want to try so hard if he’s not around. Like I just don’t get how somebody can sit in front of the TV so much, and he would have like [unclear 18:20] fighting him. And you’d rather watch TV. It’s odd. I don’t like that, I don’t want that for myself. I don’t understand why he is the way he is. And he tried to blame it like on our relationship and us fighting, but he’s always been this way. So. [pause]

THERAPIST: So you’ve been doing a lot of thinking about this. [19:00]

CLIENT: Not really.

THERAPIST: No?

CLIENT: No. I’ve just been doing a lot of, you know… I haven’t been home like thinking about it, being upset. I’m upset right now because I’m talking about it, but I haven’t been thinking about it. And it’s not like… because I would like dwell on this. But I’ve got too much to like do anyhow. And I’ve got to take care of myself, you know, study, there’s things and goals that I want and I’m not giving up because I’m not happy in the relationship. And that’s what I was doing. And it was depressing having this relationship. My whole focus was like trying to mend it and fix it so I could be happy. And I like stopped like hanging out with people, I stopped doing things that I liked to do. Like I just did it for us, because I wanted things to be better. And that’s why like I resented him, because I was working so hard for us, and like—I don’t know. I just didn’t—I didn’t see any changes. Now like he is, he’s like more affectionate, but I don’t think that’s enough. Like I don’t know. I don’t… I really don’t know how to react. Like I just let him do his thing and I do my thing. Sometimes he’s nice and like affectionate, and that confuses me. [21:00]

THERAPIST: And that?

CLIENT: Confuses me. Because like when he wants to be, and that could be like once every few days. But he’s always just so tired. Or he’s— Like it’s just like all slow stuff, like he’s tired or his stomach hurts, or he has a headache. And I’m like, okay. And I could be waiting for you forever, because there’s always an excuse. It’s just how we’ve been. And then I’ve been like hanging out with my friend a lot more, that I told you about.

THERAPIST: The guy from school?

CLIENT: Yeah. He’s not from school, I actually work with him.

THERAPIST: Oh, I see. Uh huh.

CLIENT: He’s in school.

THERAPIST: Okay.

CLIENT: And like he helps me with school a lot. He’s just—he’s a nice guy. And he’s very like, you know, he understands I’m in a relationship and he’s like—he hasn’t like overstepped at all, or made me feel uncomfortable.

THERAPIST: What do you like about spending time with him?

CLIENT: That I can talk to him. He’s like chatty like me. And like that’s something I’m missing in my relationship. Like I have no clue what to talk to Steve about. He is not like an open person. And he always is just like, “Oh yeah, I have to work on that.” And it’s like, are you really like—is there like nothing in there that you’re thinking about? Or like do you have no [patrons/patience? 22:58]? Can somebody be that simple? Like do you only think about sleeping and eating? That’s all I hear about. He works, he sleeps, he eats, he watches TV. Like I just—I don’t understand.

THERAPIST: Do you not understand like you think there’s something more? Or what do you—

CLIENT: I would love more. Like I just—I want more. Like I don’t understand how you can live your life and not speak, or like be sexual and make love, or—like it’s weird. It’s like a friendship, and we’re comfortable. Like after you’re in a relationship for a long time I feel like being like so young like you should still be like sexually interested in each other. Right? Or does that die right off? [24:00]

THERAPIST: It depends on the couple.

CLIENT: Well, that’s like what we’re missing, like we’re missing that in the relationship. And it’s not me, it’s like him. He just like—I don’t understand him.

THERAPIST: You’re wondering how things are supposed to be it seems like.

CLIENT: Well, yeah.

THERAPIST: And I guess what I’m thinking as you’re talking is, I’m not sure if there’s a supposed to, it’s simply a matter of what you need and what you want.

CLIENT: I think that’s selbike, right?

THERAPIST: What do you mean?

CLIENT: Like if you only cared about what you need and what you want out of a relationship.

THERAPIST: As opposed to?

CLIENT: Like a little of what they need and a little of what you need. You know, like [I think that can be better? 25:05], like 50/50, but like a mutual… You know.

THERAPIST: But that’s when you think about what you think about staying in a relationship.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: That’s not as much what you think about when you think about not staying.

CLIENT: No, I mean like if we had like a relationship with each other I’d stay. It’s like not—it’s not even a relationship. And I’m able to like look at that and see that now. And I was blaming it on myself. And he was blaming it on me. So. Like I want to be able to like talk, and like trust the person I’m with. Someone that’s like open. Like I can’t—Steve’s just not an open person. I’ve told him that, and he’s like tried. I don’t get—I don’t get him. I don’t get why he’s so like shut off. I don’t know. I don’t know why I didn’t see it before. I think when you get in a relationship with somebody when you’re younger you don’t think about this kind of stuff. I didn’t. [27:00]

THERAPIST: So are you worried that if you leave it’s being selbike?

CLIENT: I’m worried if I’m making the right decision by leaving. I worry about him. He says to me that he looks at me like he did the first time he looked at me. He still feels the same way. And I’m like, “Well, why don’t you act the same way? How can you say that?” And what can cause people to be like that?

THERAPIST: Like?

CLIENT: Just closed off, like not emotional, not affectionate.

THERAPIST: It sounds like you think that something went wrong that he would be like that.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: There’s so many different kinds of people in the world, there’s so many different kinds of needs.

CLIENT: I know, but he wasn’t always like that.

THERAPIST: It does seem like you’re trying to figure out what’s wrong with him.

CLIENT: I am trying to figure out what’s wrong with him. It’s not like that, it’s like—like to function in a relationship you have to have some like chemistry, you have to have something that like it’s there, that like—you can’t—that like you’re together. You can’t just date anybody, you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Do you think that that’s how he views you?

CLIENT: No, I just feel like… I don’t know. I don’t think that’s how he views—I don’t know how he views me. I just feel like— By the way, you were saying like there’s all different types of people in this world. But I mean, so you can date anybody if you deal with all their—

THERAPIST: No, I’m not saying you—but I’m just saying there are people with different kinds of needs and different kinds of wants. I’m actually saying the opposite of that.

CLIENT: I just—I don’t understand his needs. There is no needs, he’s just there. And he’s just always, every day, you know. And it’s like I don’t understand that. And like if that—well, you can live with anybody if that’s all you need is like a place to stay, somebody to talk to. [30:00]

THERAPIST: That’s what it feel like on his end, if that’s all that—he just wants—he’ll just take anyone who’s there?

CLIENT: That’s what it feels like.

THERAPIST: Mm hm.

CLIENT: It feels [like it is?]. I don’t know. We just come home from work and go to bed and watch TV. Like that’s not a relationship to me. Like we don’t have quality time together. And like he—it doesn’t seem to bother him.

THERAPIST: And somehow you’re connecting that with feeling like anyone could be there and he would—it wouldn’t matter to him.

CLIENT: Yeah. Because like all he talks to me about is, “Are you hungry? Are you tired? I’m tired. I’m going to take the trash out. Yeah, I had a bad day.” But like that’s like it. Like that’s our conversation. This is like our life.

THERAPIST: Do you feel it’s superficial?

CLIENT: Yeah, and it was never like that before.

THERAPIST: What did it used to be like?

CLIENT: He was like interested in me. He was interested in everything. And like we’d take walks, we’d look at the stars. We’d talk about what we wanted in life. You know. He would tell me like how much he loves me, and like he was so, so emotional. Like so affectionate. He was always there. And I mean, like any girl would like that. And he was like—he was kind of a little clingy. Like whenever we went out he’d always be like all over me. And just like couldn’t—which I didn’t really like that much. I don’t know. But like always very affectionate, and my mother always said that. Like he always was like touching me or holding me. But then like I don’t know, I don’t know what happened. [bursting out crying]

I don’t get it. You know, I don’t understand, we moved in with each other and things are different. Like he totally stopped being him after his dad died, and he just shut off. He used to be an athlete, he used to run. He used to care about like eating healthy, and like sometimes he doesn’t even eat. It’s like you have to bring up the food. He like will sit and watch TV or sleep. Like on his day off he doesn’t even take care of his self. And he doesn’t [shower?]. He used to shower, he used to like looking good for me and stuff, he doesn’t even do that anymore. He just like survives, and like he works, and that’s it. And like he likes his car. And this was the guy that I spent like, I don’t know, seven or eight years of my life through my last relationship pining over because like he was amazing to me. And he treated me so good. And it’s like now he’s just not there. That’s hard. [34:30]

THERAPIST: It sounds like whatever you decide to do about this relationship that you feel you’ve already lost him.

CLIENT: [pause] Yeah, I don’t know what happened. And I can’t—like I just don’t get it.

THERAPIST: Mm hm.

CLIENT: And I’d like—I was just so upset about all this little stuff that like he did like throughout the relationship, and when we started fighting. I don’t know. I really blame it on his dad dying, because everything was so good before. And he just like went through a depression and lost his job. Like so he was—you know, I’ve said this to you, he just better come back. I don’t get how one person can like on his day off go out and bike for six hours and be by his self. And like not want to spend time with somebody socially, because we don’t have any time together. I don’t know. It’s sad.

THERAPIST: Mm hm.

CLIENT: And it’s sad because like—I don’t know. I can’t change it, I can’t help him. And I don’t think he’ll ever like help his self. And his father was kinda like that too. His father smoked weed and like seemed to give up on life. That’s why his mother like left him. He just was so laid back, or didn’t have like any care for anything. He did his own thing. He was interested in computers, and videogames, and cars, and that’s it. So like it sounds like he’s his father. [37:00]

THERAPIST: It’s too bad.

CLIENT: I know.

THERAPIST: It’s like you’re grieving him.

CLIENT: Well, yeah, I had a relationship for a couple years and everything was great. [pause] I don’t know.

THERAPIST: Well, it sounds like you have some good theories as to what may have happened.

CLIENT: [It’s just that? 37:53], yup. I don’t know, does that mean I should give up? I just don’t know what to do.

THERAPIST: Give up because you feel like this is kind of how it’s gonna be.

CLIENT: Yeah. This morning he surprised me though when I was like—he watching TV, so I went in the bathroom and I just played my music and I was just singing and dancing. And it took him about like, I don’t know, an hour to like notice I was even there. And then he came over. He does like he’d come over to the bathroom, say something, and like, “Oh, there’s no cream,” or something, I don’t know. It was stupid stuff. But he finally tried to like—grabbed me and pulled me to him, and he like ended up hitting my knee on the door. And I was just like, okay. And he felt so bad. And then like later on he was like—when I was leaving he was affectionate, he said, “You can’t go.” And I said, “Well, I have to go.” And he’s like, “Well, this is our day off together.” I said, “Well, you wait too long. Like I was here all day for like, I don’t know, five hours before I had to leave and you just started seeing me then.” It’s weird. [39:30]

THERAPIST: Hm. Like it’s too late?

CLIENT: No, like we could have spent time with each other. And now before I’m leaving you want to spend time with me. It makes no sense. [pause] I don’t know. I know I’m not perfect, you know. At least I’m trying. [40:00]

THERAPIST: It just seems like your grieving something so deep.

CLIENT: No, it’s just hard. You know, you spend your life with somebody for like five years. And you [like have belonged to that? 40:17] for like eleven or twelve. And like I don’t [have anyone?]. And you feel like you can’t connect with them. And I don’t know if it’s just because he’s working so much, and I’m working so much. But like all it does is take like two seconds. And he could text me the most loveliest things, the sweetest things in the world, and then when he got home he doesn’t act like that. It’s like he can tell me how he feels in a text, but he can’t tell me how he feels like when I’m next to him. So it’s very confusing.

THERAPIST: But the text would have been enough?

CLIENT: No. Like I want him to spend time with me and actually like be there. In a text you’re like not there. It’s weird. He like sort of disconnected.

THERAPIST: And it leaves you feeling very deprived.

CLIENT: Yeah, I feel wicked neglected. And it’s like—I don’t know. I’m pretty blunt. I’m pretty straightforward. Like I will tell him like, “This is what’s upsetting me, this is what I need. Can you do this?” And he’ll say, “Yeah.” But he’ll never do it. And I’m like, okay. So that gives me hope, and then I get disappointed. So it’s like this is just like a cycle. I don’t know. I feel strong enough—like this relationship has beaten—like beat me down. Where like I felt insecure because like he wasn’t attracted to me. And I felt like I was working for us, and giving like myself to this. So I wasn’t taking care of myself, I didn’t even care about myself anymore. Now I feel like I care about myself, I love myself. I want to do what’s right for myself and make the right decision.

THERAPIST: Mm hm. Well, we’re going to need to stop in a moment, but it does seem like you’re trying very hard to figure things out for yourself, and I think that’s a very good thing. [43:00]

CLIENT: Thanks.

THERAPIST: Okay. So I will see you next week then.

CLIENT: Yup.

THERAPIST: Okay, great.

CLIENT: And we’ll figure out about the holiday too?

THERAPIST: I’m here on those Tuesdays.

CLIENT: Okay. I might not be able to come.

THERAPIST: The holidays. Oh, you mean in December?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Okay. Yeah, you can let me know. I should be here those—well, I guess the Tuesdays were like Christmas Eve and so forth.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Okay. Well, we can touch base about that.

CLIENT: Okay.

THERAPIST: Okay, bye bye.

END TRANSCRIPT