TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: All right, I went home and took a nap which may or may not have been the best idea. I'm so tired. So there's the four younger librarians (inaudible at 0:00:33) who were hired on.

THERAPIST: Yea. (inaudible at 0:00:36).

CLIENT: Yea. So one of them is [somehow part in my] (ph)… partially in my department. I don't know why but she is. And she has Chet (ph) for her manager which is also confusing but because she's… I don't know. [0:01:00] So when she interviewed when I saw her resume I actually mercilessly mocked it to all of my friends because she had listed on it… she was like, "I went to (inaudible at 0:01:12) but like this is fine. And then she has a Pinterest. And I was like, "Really?"

THERAPIST: Wait, what?

CLIENT: Pinterest.

THERAPIST: That's like a…

CLIENT: That's the Web site.

THERAPIST:…special post… like picture posting Web site?

CLIENT: Yea. And I was like, this is ridiculous. This is the most ludicrous, horrible thing I've seen in my life. How could you use that in your resume?

THERAPIST: Well, was it on her resume?

CLIENT: It was under the sort of like where you would put like, "Can use Microsoft Office."

THERAPIST: Or, "Can use Pinterest."

CLIENT: Yes, she's very young. I think she made mention like Web 2.0, the social media something. But she listed like Facebook and Pinterest. And I was just going Pinterest? This is a librarian job. [0:02:01] And in the interview, no one else ever knew what Pinterest was. And oh my God, it's just really annoying.

THERAPIST: I know what Pinterest is.

CLIENT: I know. Like, c'mon it's in the stupid magazines.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: And so I asked her about it. And then she managed to come up with a really cogent reason for using Pinterest which made me not really mad but I was like, "Oh, I feel guilty for mocking you." She had worked at an architectural library. And they had… she had basically… the library was sorting some its images in Pinterest. And encouraged architectural students to take inspirational images and (inaudible at 0:02:46) in Pinterest. I was like, "Oh, dang that's actually really good." And then she should a really quick video clip that she actually edited it successfully and had inserted captions. [0:03:00] And was like, "Oh yea, of course we caption everything for ADA." I was like, "What? Really? That's so exciting."

But I hadn't talked to her much until recently. And so when she was hired, various hired (ph) librarians were like, "Yes, she does media and technology and nah." And I'm just like, "What? I think you mean she uses the computer. I don't know where we're going with this." And I talked to her briefly and she's like, "Someone asked me if I was a programmer?" I'm like, "No, baby. You're not. It's OK."

So I thought I would have a little meeting with her to kind of talk to her about various things. Because it seems like part of what they hired her to do is to do is technology… new technology and librarians, something like that. [0:04:05] So they wanted to hire someone young and savvy. And unfortunately the people who hired her, I don't think anyone really had a good sense of what they meant by wanting a tech savvy librarian. And people who just (inaudible at 0:04:27) and throwing out words are like, "I think it's techy something." So people who asked her questions where she's like, "I'm a librarian, not a DBA. I'm not an [Assistant Admin] (ph). I'm not a programmer. What's going on?"

And I've been trying to think of a way to let her know that doing technology in the library was a little fraught due to Will (ph) due to a whole bunch of other things. Because I'm pretty sure that when she was hired, no one said, "By the way, there is this flaming pit where Will (ph) used to be." [0:05:10] And people are a little bit cranky about that. Mostly it's just like a money pit because he spent so much money.

THERAPIST: Oh, I didn't know there were general bad feelings about that. I knew there was a lot of…

CLIENT: Yea, it was interesting. And so when I first started having problems with him, I talked to the union. My union is like, "Oh, we've heard so much about him. Everyone… all of these people are complaining that we can't do anything. Yet you should try to go through HR but we'll support it." And we went to HR no one had really talked to them yet. I was the first person who did. And then HR was like, "Oh, that was awkward." [0:06:00] And what had happened is he'd been hired to do this very big emergent technologies librarian big thing.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And he had this very confusing seemingly amalgamated (ph) potluck money. And so he was buying things during layoffs yea, the expensive things. It just… I mean, I think at one point… I forgot. I think he had at least probably $15,000 or $25,000 of just tech and what he called this Sandbox program. And so his idea was that people should play with technology and just take a laptop home and play with it and figure it out and so he flat out refused to give anyone instruction or a guide or whatever. [0:07:06] He was like, "No, just play with it." And this upset a lot of people because they're like, "But I want… I don't…" Not everyone learns through doing. People are like, "Well, can I play with it but can you give me an idea what it does?"

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: "Where is this going? Why do I have to do this on my own time?" And so… and then also dropping like… a couple of months after we had this first round of like nonconsensual layoffs of the economy just tanked. Holy crap. He bought $3000 worth of books that replicated books in the collection. And the department that was processing them had lost several staff members. So they were really pissed and no one wanted them. And they were just like, "This is dumb." [0:08:00] And then he also dropped $5000 or $7000 of the touch screen monitors. And that doesn't equal a staff person but…

THERAPIST: Yea, it doesn't look good.

CLIENT: Yea. And he'd never… he would talk a lot about the shiny technology and how to play with it. But he never really explained why this was a good investment. I get why you have to invest money in technology and I… whatever. I just… I think he did it really poorly. I think he was a jackass. I think he's really insensitive. And so all of this (inaudible at 0:08:46) librarians. Staff were pissed and the librarians were getting annoyed because they were like, "Why are we being asked to do all this stuff?" And then he got suddenly promoted to the head of reference librarians leapfrogging over everyone. [0:09:04] That didn't go over well especially since he had never worked as a reference librarian.

THERAPIST: Did he have an MLS?

CLIENT: He was finishing it when he got hired. So it's that sort of thing where he got the job and had two classes to go or something. So I think he'd been at Cambridge for a year and a half, maybe, and got this promotion. And the reference librarians all lost their shit. Especially since he kept on talking about the department was now called Reference Teaching Learning Technology something, something. And all he would ever talk about is new learning technology. All of the reference librarians were pissed because they're like, "But reference…" [0:10:02]

So yea, a lot of… he managed to make a lot of people angry in amazing ways. He also was really good at… especially kind of techno babbled his way into the job. And all these various people don't… didn't or don't understand technology very well. And he would buzzword and they were like, "I don't know. I guess he knows stuff." So he was sort of the guy big stud. (pause) A very bad choice was made in terms of who they picked. They were like… they picked him as the tech guy and they defer… and he was deferred to on all technology, Web everything. Even though he wasn't really…

THERAPIST: Right, the technology.

CLIENT: Yea.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: No, it was actually… it was like… yea. And there were several people with more seniority who knew more about technology who were getting passed over. [0:11:08] And they all left which is… So when he left, the higher managerial levels of librarians were sad. And no one else was. And after she talked around the higher librarians about him very favorably at one point and she was shocked. Because she thought that everyone was like… she had no idea people don't want to talk about that because… whatever. So new librarian, Christy (ph), is kind of like walking into that.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And I was trying to think of a way… I wanted to take a way to sort of describe it without seeming crazy or without like… I don't want to crush all of her hopes and dreams. [0:12:01] But I just want to let her know like, "By the way, here are some pitfalls." And so I thought I would just… and I was kind of like I won't really mention Will (ph), I'll just talk vaguely about some initiatives that didn't go well. Don't use the word "sandbox." Don't use the word "play" and a few other things.

So we ended up meeting. And we were talking and sort of… but 15 minutes in, she's like, "Oh my God. Thank you so much. I've been completely freaked out because people wander by my desk and are like, ‘So we hear that you're doing…'" And they'd kind of like throw random tech words at her. And she's like, "What?" Or someone is like, "Oh, we want you to go to the digital repository for blah, blah, blah." And she's like, "What? What?" And so she's kind of had people trying to dump poorly planned projects that they don't understand in her lap. [0:13:03]

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: And it's just been she does technology and Chet (ph) had been trying to get her to basically edit video clips. He took some crappy film and he wants to edit it and a final cut and put it up. So we had a two hour bitch fest which was amazing.

THERAPIST: Oh, that's great.

CLIENT: It was great and she… I mean, it was kind of just funny because I think that she's like, "Oh, this is all making much more sense." I'm like, "Yes." And she looked at me at one point. She's like, "I just don't… I worry that about this and that." Yea, I just… I don't that anyone really knows why quite why you were hired. I think… but I'm not so sure. I don't think anyone has a good grasp at… they're just like, "You do technology and libraries." [0:14:03]

And so we were kind of… so we ended up talking about things that she probably could actually do that weren't too huge. And I suggested that she maybe do a couple of small projects with where you create a thing something that's deliverable that's nothing like Will (ph).

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And then she'd be like, "Look, I did this thing. Isn't that nice?"

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And kind of separate her from all of that because Will (ph) had also hired this woman, Jackie (ph), as his assistant.

THERAPIST: Right. I remember Jackie (ph).

CLIENT: And then kind of tossed her overboard when he became…

THERAPIST: Oh, really?

CLIENT: …promoted. Yea, I feel terrible for her in some ways. [0:15:00] I find it very frustrating. But she was also hired for a job that she couldn't succeed at because she didn't know how to do it. And then was just sort of got no support, got no help, flailed a lot. And has been mostly dumped back into reference which she actually knows how to do which is good. But people still try to throw things at her that she can't do like the whole digital repository when actually she does library pedagogy and is very nervous about technology. So yea, the conversation was really great and she… because she's only been there for a month and I wasn't quite sure what she'd picked up on. [0:16:03] I didn't really want to…

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: …tell her my views as how to do everything. But she had already picked… she's like, "Yea, the morale here is really bad. Karl (ph) just… your… the meetings (ph) about you're horrible. You just toss it. You put in 45 minutes." Yep. And just kind of running through everything, I was like, "Yes, that is… those perceptions are pretty accurate."

And this was funny. It seemed like such a relief for her because she had felt like, "Am I crazy? What's going on?" So that was nice. And then what was also nice to have someone else be like, "Yea, this is dumb." And she totally like… well, this was great. She agreed with me on several… these videos of people… because these… that's… what were produced are really crappy. [0:17:01] I know. Blah, blah, blah.

THERAPIST: Yea, this is one of the best conversations you're talking about having at work, I think.

CLIENT: Pretty much.

THERAPIST: I'm not saying it was the most awesome conversation in the world. But…

CLIENT: It was very heartening especially in the face of the last couple of months of things being crappy. I was just really excited to be like, oh my God, someone else, A, knows what I'm talking about. B, knows what she doesn't know and C, is like I don't know interested in doing some of the things that I would like to do as well. So yea, it was really great.

THERAPIST: Good.

CLIENT: We kind of brainstormed a few things that we might do that were small, low key, some brown bagging bunch of things. [0:18:00] (pause) Yea, it was just like a little… it was a great conversation. Just a little overwhelming to me. I was like, "That was so awesome." And I'm like… it felt really great and I was all excited. And then I thought to myself, well, in some ways that was like… that really shouldn't be the workplace conversation highlight over the last two years.

THERAPIST: Right. (pause) Yea, I guess (inaudible at 0:18:35) in bad way.

CLIENT: Yea, and…

THERAPIST: It was a good conversation to be on the same page and seeing things the same way which it happened maybe every week or in a few weeks or so.

CLIENT: Yea. And it was also like I'd try reaching out to a couple of librarians and not really gotten anywhere. [0:19:03] Because they're just really busy or just whatever. And so it was also nice to be like, "Oh, you can talk about things. Great." But the other thing about it is for any new employee be there for a month and sort of see all these and [can I see fairly] (ph) with a lot of problems made me think, yea, this is… it makes me feel, I guess, a little more affirmed in my perception of work or at least aspects of it which is nice.

THERAPIST: Absolutely. [0:20:01] No, I mean, in so many conversations you've had the opposite effect.

CLIENT: Yea. And the… I don't know if I've ever told you but the (inaudible at 0:20:16), we had the follow-up conversation of…

THERAPIST: Oh, no you didn't.

CLIENT: Oh, we had a follow-up conversation that was not helpful. She's also… I just sent her an e-mail that was like, "This is my summary of what I think we've talked about. Is this accurate?" And she didn't reply to it. OK. And then she had me on the phone and she was just like, "Well, hand wave, hand wave. Those weren't diversity jobs but certainly your concerns were appreciated, blah, blah, blah."

THERAPIST: Oh my God.

CLIENT: And she said that my library HR person would really like to see if we can meet again and start anew or start afresh or whatever. [0:21:08] It's like the library HR person I've had… I had two crappy interactions with. One of which was, "I don't care about your work or your past problems or discrimination or my involvement or anything. I'm really busy with other things." And I was like, "OK, well…"

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: I know. (inaudible at 0:21:31). I guess I don't know. Because it was just very… it was very… it was just like… it was like super disconnected. I was… it was so disconcerting, I almost wasn't upset because I came in and she's like… basically it was like I was telling her about something. And she's like… well, because I've been volunteered to participate in a Library Institute discussion and I didn't want to do it if the content was going to be predetermined. [0:22:06] And it sounded like Karl (ph) knew what he wanted us to say. And I didn't want to be a sock puppet.

And so he's trying… and it's hard to explain a little bit. And she's was just like, "Don't care. Library transition. Don't care. Too busy." And I was like, "But you're HR. You're supposed to be subtle about that." Or nod and shake your head for a while. Like, "Oh, yea." (pause) And let me see, of course the last thing was to say, "And of course we definitely if you experience cases and we're definitely here for you to talk about if you experience factual cases of discrimination."

THERAPIST: That's pretty awesome (ph).

CLIENT: I know. I was like, "Factual. Hmm. What do you… are sort of one of those like you suck? What do you even mean? Wow." [0:23:12] (pause) So that was also super depressing. (pause)

THERAPIST: I mean, honestly my association was (inaudible at 0:23:30) this to like really?

CLIENT: Yea. That's how I felt. I was like, "I'm pretty sure all those things factually happened. So yea, I basically felt very much like you're blaming the victim. And are you really sure that you said no really clearly? [0:24:00] You weren't X, Y, Z? And I also made me really think, so what would someone have to do to get reprimanded for discrimination?

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And the answer is, I don't even know. But… and then the library checkers e-mailed me and was like, "I'd love to start a new (inaudible at 0:24:30)." And I've just been sitting on that e-mail because I don't know how I feel about it.

THERAPIST: So who's that?

CLIENT: HR.

THERAPIST: Oh, HR.

CLIENT: HR.

THERAPIST: Oh, OK. I'm sorry. That's why I was…

CLIENT: Sorry. Yea, no it's…

THERAPIST: …no, that's… yea.

CLIENT: Yea, that of the library human resources or what was a library… because… yea. [0:25:04] (pause) And then unfortunately I also asked like, "Is there anyone else I can talk to but don't… because I don't want to talk to her because I don't feel comfortable with it?" Her response was pretty much no. I mean, I could jump to her boss but… except I don't think I really could in a practical way.

THERAPIST: Didn't you do that at some point during the Will (ph) stuff? You talked to a person in HR (inaudible at 0:25:37).

CLIENT: I talked to a different HR person. That was… let's see… but she was still in my department.

THERAPIST: OK. I thought it was somebody's manager. You're right. (inaudible at 0:25:44).

CLIENT: No it was this woman, who was the only woman with color in the department. And she wasn't the person I was supposed to talk to. [0:26:00] But she was still part of the library human resources. So it wasn't… yea.

THERAPIST: That's awful.

CLIENT: It was like just a little weird. I still is. So… and then on Sunday I was at this… with some friends of mine and Ashby's (ph). And they were talking about a mutual friend who they're really annoyed that she was complaining about something about her job. But like yea, but she's had the same job for 10 years or 15 year and blah, blah, blah. I'm just sort of sitting here being awkward. Thinking to myself, this is really awkward because I have worked for the same for 15 years. I haven't really had the same job. [0:27:00] And they were like, "Yea, she's… she had a high level promotion but not a money promotion. She should just leave and do this. She should do that."

THERAPIST: I see, yea.

CLIENT: And to me that two or three people have said was that if you're in the same job for that long, it makes people think that you're not qualified. Or I guess sort of like have I only been doing one job for 15 years and not gotten promoted or moved or changed or something which I am a little sensitive about working for Cambridge for a while. [0:28:00] And so that was really kind of I don't know sort of poking at something that I've been… I think about and have been thinking about which is that I've worked for Cambridge for 15 years and they've been my only employer which… I don't know. My thoughts usually are well, yes, but I've changed jobs. I've changed colleges.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: (inaudible at 0:28:41).

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: So it's not the same job. But… and then I just also feel like, God, you're right. I have been in the same job or in the same place. Why haven't I… I don't know. Not what is wrong with me but if I'm so mad, why don't I do something about it?

THERAPIST: I see. [0:29:06] (pause)

CLIENT: Except that I have changed jobs when they've really sucked. So I'm sort of like just very conflicted about it.

THERAPIST: Yea. (pause) Is… or part of the issue is that when we've talked about it, you sounded very worried and pessimistic about finding other jobs that you'd like. And so I wonder if you feel as though it's not that you have chosen not to leave but you kind of haven't had a choice. [0:30:08] Or…

CLIENT: I feel that way right now. I've been thinking about other Harvard jobs I've had. And I don't know. (pause) The job I had… so when I was working at an (inaudible at 0:30:42) a basic computer help desk I really enjoyed that job and would have stayed except for a harassing coworker. And I felt forced out kind of quickly. I wasn't literally being forced out. But it was (inaudible at 0:31:05) tuition and the manager is like it's getting it's getting along fairly sticky that if want to fire him right now, it would take me at least a year.

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: And I just couldn't take it. And so in that situation I felt like the only way I could find another job really quickly is to go within Cambridge.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: So then I went to work in the [economic office] (ph) department.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 0:31:34) do that.

CLIENT: Yea.

THERAPIST: Right. I remember what happened with that.

CLIENT: Yea. And so… but going from economics to the library felt good. I was like, "Oh, library." (pause) [0:32:00] And so there are basically two jobs that I feel like I almost had to… or that I couldn't have gotten without being there which was my first IT job at Cambridge and stumbling into the library job just because with my first IT job, I had no work experience in IT. And they're basically going on your friends are good with computers. And the library job was a little bit, "Oh my God we want somebody who does IT for cheap." While I was thinking I want to be in a library.

THERAPIST: Right. (pause)

CLIENT: But right now I feel more trapped. I don't… now I feel more like I don't have that choice if it's not… there's nowhere else I could go.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: All of that.

THERAPIST: Right. (pause) Right, and I'm more (inaudible at 0:33:14) that than you. And think that part of… I remember hearing myself, I think, a couple of weeks ago saying that rather than ways you've been badly treated at the library and making you feel like, "Oh, this sucks. I should find something better. I'll get out of here." I mean, clearly that's not the way you feel. But there's also the like, "Oh, this is… this keeps happening to me. I suck. Nobody else is going to want me."

CLIENT: Yea. (pause) Yea, that's not… I mean, I think that feeling of like, "I suck and no one will want me," is new to this job in this job situation. [0:34:11]

THERAPIST: Well, that's terrible.

CLIENT: Yea. It's also weird. It's like I mean, the entire time I've worked there, I've felt a little weird about it. Just I'm like, "Oh, let's…" I feel a little weird in like that I went here and then worked here. So…

THERAPIST: It's like moving to the time you grew up inertia thing?

CLIENT: Sort of. It's more like most staff jobs that I've worked in are nonprofessional jobs. And usually Cambridge… they usually don't have Cambridge grads in them. So people are really surprised that I was a Cambridge student. Or also will talk about students and I'm like… in a negative way and I'm like, "Oh."

THERAPIST: Easy, yes.

CLIENT: Yes, awkward. [0:35:04] (pause) And then I had very much pride (ph) in head meant to work for Cambridge for a shorter time. And in my head I was like, "Oh, and then go to grad school." And then I said, "No I'm not going to grad school." (pause) So I guess when I was like in my 20s I never thought I would still be working for Cambridge.

THERAPIST: Got it.

CLIENT: I never (inaudible at 0:35:39) it. I had no idea what I would be doing. But I was like, "Oh, yea. I'll probably be off by then." So there's that. It's just like that feeling.

THERAPIST: And that is that a feeling of like, "Oh, I'm going to go to bigger and better things," sort of feeling? Or moving away from home base kind of feeling? [0:35:59] Or…

CLIENT: It's been like a bunch of stuff. For a while it was kind of about I'm going to be… I'm going to grad school. I'm going to do this other cool thing. For a little while, I was like, oh, maybe like I'll… and for a while, I was like, no, I'll do really cool IT stuff. And this is like I'm going to do this to get whatever, work experience and then I'll… something else. So it's been more like… not like ick, Cambridge. I knew it wasn't going to be super fantastic. But it's been more like, well, this is all right and everything but long term, why would I stay here?

THERAPIST: I see. [0:37:01] (pause)

CLIENT: So yea, and some of it has also been just I guess thinking more about what do I actually want to do for a job and having a better sense of that which I didn't really… I was kind of like, I don't know. Do things? (pause) So for a while I was like, oh yea. And then when I am 35 I'll be that person wearing a suit with a briefcase or something in my head. And now I'm like, no, I would never do that job. What the hell? So there's been a lot of that of kind of like, oh, right, that's not what I want to do. [0:38:00]

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: Yea. And I did have a… upset at Cambridge applying with the IT job. Sort of, wow, there's a lot of IT jobs I don't want to do which was weird. I just didn't… I don't know. After I realized that like 50 jobs in IT do things I might be interested in. I don't want to program. I don't want to be an [Assistant Admin] (ph). And then I was like, well, I'm sure there's a lot of like help desk-y, I go over to your computer and fix it and whatever-y jobs which there are. But there's also a lot of moderating people's Internet usage. [0:39:08] And things like that where I'm like, oh, I don't think I want to be the person that blocks all those Web sites. Or that e-mails you saying, "I've noticed that."

THERAPIST: Right. You've been on Pinterest too much.

CLIENT: Yea, exactly. I mean…

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: So yea. And then also at some point I had this… I don't want to say revelation but I had this… I don't think I really want a big fancy pants job. I would like… it would be OK if I had a job that I did that was kind of interesting and then I left it. [0:40:00] And it's partially just there was a couple of people actually one of them at Cambridge with a (inaudible at 0:40:11) who I'm like, "Oh, you just do your little job thing but all this sort of… really you, like your passionate interests. You do your job to find all the other interesting that you do. And so it doesn't really… but it really doesn't matter. but you don't feel as driven to spend all this time at work because that's not the point.

THERAPIST: Where your passions lie.

CLIENT: Yea. (pause) So sort of having that moment of being like, "Oh yea, I think that's kind of what I want to do." And then I kind of migrated into that's kind of what I want to do but I also want to be in a library, not in… I don't even know. [0:41:05] I had a period of thinking I wanted to be an executive assistant because I'm good at wrangling people in some ways. And then I thought the chances are the person I'd be wrangling would be an asshole and that would suck. (chuckling) So…

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And I actually hate doing other people (ph) like expense reports a lot. So there is that. (pause) [0:42:00] I think the other thing is that my friends have such diverse, I guess, career concepts of how the workplace works. So my father or, I think, my parents I think a little bit my brother are like you go to this company. You work for them for a long time. Or maybe you work at (inaudible at 0:42:26) for a long time.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And then I have crazy startup friends who are like, "No, you go to a startup for two years and then fuck them." And OK. And academics which is a just completely different type of job and with my crazy nonprofit people and now I know program managers who are just a very confusing job to me in that I'm like I don't really understand what you do. You get paid a lot of money for it but…

THERAPIST: Just like at companies? [0:43:02]

CLIENT: Yea.

THERAPIST: Program managers?

CLIENT: Yea. No, program? That's not the word.

THERAPIST: Project managers?

CLIENT: Yes, project managers. Sorry, it's all…

THERAPIST: It's all right.

CLIENT: …gibberish in my head. I'm like…

THERAPIST: Sure.

CLIENT: …jobs I don't know what you do. (chuckling) Yea. And that's one of those jobs where I have no idea what you're doing. You're certainly getting paid a lot of money. But…

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And I know that you're supposed to move around. But that's it. (pause)

THERAPIST: We should stop.

CLIENT: Yea. I don't know. It's just like there's so many… I guess when I get with my friends, there's somebody there, I'm like, "This is how you're supposed to have your job."

THERAPIST: Right, right. It's not like the structure is the same but the function is different. Maybe you work in technology. Or maybe you're a doctor. Or maybe you're a business person. But get a job and you do these things. And you go and you come home. It's like (inaudible at 0:44:05).

CLIENT: Yea, exactly.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: I will see you on Thursday.

THERAPIST: Yes.

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