TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: I have a bit of a tension headache or estrogen headache. It's kind of six of one.

THERAPIST: Do you want some ibuprofen? I happen to have some.

CLIENT: Yes. That would be amazing. Thank you.

THERAPIST: I don't have water.

CLIENT: I can take it dry. (pause) [00:01:04]

THERAPIST: I think I have Aleve.

CLIENT: Do you have ibuprofen or Advil? There's a big window out by my desk and I don't know if it's the air plus being on the computer or a lot of tension or both. (pause) I talked to my brother last night. We played phone tag a little bit over the weekend and Sunday my parents called and I just didn't pick up the phone because I just didn't want to talk to them. I also I had a headache, but mostly I didn't want to talk to them. [00:02:11] My brother called me back and we talked a little bit and I mentioned that I was really upset with our mom for blowing me off and I didn't want to talk to her right now. He could see that I was upset about it. My parents were visiting my brother and his wife this weekend and Seth said that our mom brought it up that she felt bad or something for not calling. [00:03:07] It was a little unclear about what. Seth said that he felt bad for not initiating a phone call.

THERAPIST: Not calling you.

CLIENT: Yeah. I texted an e-mail to him first. [...] (inaudible at 00:03:26) He called me later. Weirdly, his thought on it was actually [obviously much] (ph?) my mom's, which was it's some sporting thing, so Karen wouldn't be there anyway. There are all these reasons why people go to sporting events, watch the marathon. I've watched the marathon a couple of times. [00:04:02] Also I just think it's kind of a shitty excuse. I don't know. A big, scary bombing in someone's city is scary and maybe I was trying to use the library. I don't know. I totally understand not being freaked out, like not thinking that I was injured, but wouldn't you still want to call just to be like, "Hi. I hope that by some freakish accident, everything is fine. How are you doing?" [00:05:01]

THERAPIST: Or, "Gosh. Is anybody you know affected?"

CLIENT: Right. One of the things that I found frustrating and upsetting with my mom is that she sounded more concerned once I told her that my roommate worked downtown. I had given her some of the reasons why I might... At first I said, "You know, I went to watch the marathon." And she said, "No, it's a sporting event. I knew you were fine." And then I mentioned that Ashby worked downtown and she was like, "Oh! Is she okay?" It was just like I wanted her to ask how I was doing and she asked how other people are doing. I don't know. [00:06:02] I felt like I was using Ashby as a way to see what will get a response. My brother said that he felt bad that she didn't call and he said, "Mom, [...] (inaudible at 00:06:21) had been locked down on that Friday. I kind of want to see your perspective because you obviously live here. I was kind of like, "Really? Okay." (sighs) (pause) I don't know how else this was reported, but I also feel like Manchester remains where your sister lives. Maybe you would read more about it. [00:07:05] When Hurricane Sandy came I read more local coverage about it, particularly in cases where I knew friends were or had been. That was kind of weird, too. [...] (inaudible at 00:07:33) And then he kind of ran through the reasons why. His response was that our mom isn't very expressive, which I knew and I know. It wouldn't be like a tearful, Hallmark-card conversation. I just thought there would be interest or something. [00:08:08] We discussed how my mom tends to worry. He was like, "I know if she couldn't have gotten a hold of you, obviously she would have been worried." I was like, "She didn't try." She couldn't get a hold of me several times that day because the cell tower was down." He kind of came up with more other things and she had called me for computer support two more times that week and it just was not helping. So it was a really frustrating conversation. [00:08:59] Seth said he felt bad about it, but my brother is not always expressive either. He tries. Sometimes he can [...] (inaudible at 00:09:14) a little bit. His wife teases him about that sometimes. She says his man cave is just in his mind, like he'll just retreat mentally, which is totally true. He also called me while cooking dinner, not paying close attention maybe, but... (sighs) I don't know. He didn't really apologize. He said that he felt bad and the excuses he was giving for my mom, I think, were also his reasons. [00:10:10] And the end cap was that "Well, but you're fine, so it all worked out in the end." I just told him I wasn't actually feeling bad about it and how P.S. there was a man near where I live and where I work and blah, blah, blah. His response was, "I didn't know that." I don't feel like he heard me on the "I'm feeling really upset" actually. [00:11:03] This thing with why I didn't feel like calling my mom, he was like, "I'm just saying you take a break sometimes." My brother and his wife had spent three hours trying to get my parents to use Dropbox. It is true that I refused to take on that task. That's not really why I'm pissed. (pause) I also said to him that if I call mom she won't really apologize. She'll be super defensive and then she'll give me the things he said were given. He didn't have a reply, which (sighs) (pause) [00:12:15] I don't think he's going to fix it, but I thought he might have, I guess, more sympathy or something or to connect that – I sometimes want my mom to act like a different person. I kind of just want to act like my mom. I wanted her to be concerned, much as like her worrying sometimes drives me crazy... [00:13:10]

THERAPIST: It feels caring.

CLIENT: Yeah. It's completely what I was expecting her to be, to worry. I wanted her to express some worry or concern or something about my safety, how was I doing, something like that. (pause) There are ways in which I think I wanted her to be expressive, comforting, supportive, which I knew wasn't going to happen. [00:14:08] I did want that, but what I expected was more sort of the "I'm going to express myself through being worried and anxious and not talk about feelings." But I didn't get any of that. My dad called me on that Friday.

THERAPIST: Sorry – back up for a minute. The thought of her actually being sort of comforting and warm and understanding about it was not what you expected. [00:15:02] Something about that possibility really struck you. You were wanting that. You knew you weren't going to get it from her?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: You wish you had a mom who was like that sometimes?

CLIENT: It's sort of a combination of things. Always having friends express at times concern and comforting and et cetera that I would like my mom to express. Also having this mom and dad, I want my theoretical mom to say everything is okay, say something comforting. [00:16:08] I don't know. It's kind of like I wanted to talk to her and her say, "No, this really sucks, but it's going to get better. Don't worry. Things will improve." Something. (pause) It's one of those things that's hard to talk about. Everyone in the Manchester area, I felt like we were all freaked out. I've been calling my old friends and that helped because I think they want the same thing, too, [are answering the problem.] (ph?) I then thought about calling Jamie or maybe Zoe – but mostly Jamie. She worked in a variety of hotels so I was pretty sure it's fine, but I would just like to know that there is no way to contact you because cell phone towers blah, blah, blah... [00:17:55] I was vividly remembering that and I didn't want to talk to her because it just reminded me so much of how scary that was – not just Jamie, the tons of friends that I have there. I don't know. I really wanted someone to be kind of calm and metaphorically bring me some tea and talk with me or something, which my mom doesn't do. [00:19:04] (pause) I think she actually doesn't do it more so than she did when I was a kid.

THERAPIST: She does it less now?

CLIENT: She does it less now. Yeah. Yeah. (pause) Also Ashby was kind of frustrated with her parents. They were worried. That's not why she was frustrated. She was trying to explain what was going on and where things were in terms of geography and other things, and her parents were sort of like. "What? I don't know the city." [00:20:14] I guess I felt very much like my roommate is getting this response from her parents that I'm not getting and she normally gets...

THERAPIST: This is your roommate?

CLIENT: My roommate, Ashby. She is getting this response, which I wanted and she gets along with her parents less than I do, so that was also frustrating. (pause) I was looking for my brother to, I guess, sympathize with me or – I don't know – run interference between me and my parents. [00:21:11] I feel like what I got from him was defensiveness and excuses for it. (pause) I feel like he hadn't really asked how I was doing, which (pause) – I don't know. [00:22:03] I guess I wanted him to say something that was "I care and think about you," and he didn't. (pause)

THERAPIST: You were not feeling particularly loved.

CLIENT: No. I ended up a little bit later texting with Jamie and I was like, "I'm really mad at my mom I don't want to talk to her right now and you have a lot of experience with that. Can we talk about it?" We're going to phone tag until it happens. [00:23:02] (pause) (sighs) I'm really frustrated with my parents, but I still feel like they really love and care about me and they just can't express it. With this, I didn't feel that I really wasn't feeling solid in the idea that they didn't care about me. (pause) I really just felt rejected. [00:23:54] (pause) It's like a difference now. I think about them and it's really sucky. I do wish that I could talk to them about it, especially my mom. (pause) Part of me thinks I'm being a little bit unfair since she did tell my brother that she felt kind of bad, but she hasn't done anything. [00:25:09] She sent me a bunch of little e-mails which I know are her attempts to... If I don't call her for a long period of time she'll start sending me little e-mails every couple of days with "Factoid. Something you may find interesting." Then she'll be ending basically in "Call me so I don't have to send you these e-mails." She has sent me a bunch and was going on in the e-mail about several [relays and mentioning Rue Chet] (ph?) which she knows I like, but none of them have been about me. [00:26:14] (pause) I didn't think writing in my e-mail, "So, are you over that horrible cold?" [...] (inaudible at 00:26:25) (sniffling) (long pause) [00:27:33] So I could tell that Tuesday night [...] (inaudible at 00:27:35) and then this morning I had a meeting with one of the associate librarian that I had requested a 45-minute meeting with her.

THERAPIST: Is that one of the new librarians?

CLIENT: No. The associate librarian is someone who has been here for a couple of years. She actually hired Will (sp?). She's sort of in charge of new technology, learning initiatives, for all the libraries.

THERAPIST: She's sort of a higher-up? [00:28:05]

CLIENT: I think she is the layer below head of all Cambridge libraries. My plan was to have a talk about how I feel like people dump technology in the library and then ignore it and never do an assessment or ask people about it. It was a little weird in that I was telling her whatever and then she (pause) had these wordy responses, which were not off-putting, but I didn't feel like she was really necessarily getting what I was saying and was just saying things that she would say to any critique of a project. [00:29:39] So that was frustrating. And then I didn't get the time right and so we had 20 minutes. She was like, "Come on in." We only had 10 minutes – five really. [00:30:04] I told her how I had been really frustrated about trying to do various things and her response was, "Oh, especially within the last four years or so," which is about how long Will (sp?) has been here. I said, "Yes." We said a little bit more and I actually said, "I know Will has left." Her response was to not say anything, which was weird.

THERAPIST: [...] (inaudible at 00:30:39)

CLIENT: Yeah, it was kind of like that's how I feel about it in general, so it was just weird to have her say that. I was like wait, I didn't think you knew it, too. I tried to convey that it was really shitty and sucky and that things I wanted to do that I'm really good at, he said no to all of them. I said myself and some of the other people at the library would like to start a blog about the library. She said, "Anyone can start a blog." Yes, that's nice except for we were told we were not allowed to talk about work online without communication's approval. She sort of walked it back a little bit and was like, "Well, yeah, blah, blah." [00:31:53] But she seemed to actually support it. She seemed surprised that when I told her that staff people like myself and others who had just been told flat out "no." I had the experience of getting a little further and being told you can only do it if everything was fine with Will, but other staffers have just been told flat out no, and that seemed to surprise her which shouldn't be surprising but [...] (inaudible at 00:32:37). I understand that at her level she doesn't get to see common folk all the time, but [I know it's a secret.] (ph?) I also feel like a lot of higher-level administrators have this idea that staff all hate technology and don't want to do anything new and our agents have changed, blah, blah. [00:33:14] Some people are, yes, total [...] (inaudible at 00:33:16) and are like, "Fuck computers." But we're in Cambridge, for God's sake. People are... (pause) (sighs) [00:33:37] I was kind of unclear if she... I found myself wondering, "Do you just not want to talk about Will and what happened? He's gone so – whatever. Do you not want to admit that he was an asshole? Do you think he's so awesome that he's left so many fucking [...] (inaudible at 00:34:05)? and I thought there's no point to it. So you think he was a total asshole fuck-up and now we're like ‘I don't want to admit that happened' and that I gave him a huge pile of money and nothing happened out of it?" I really would like someone to say to me, "That was a crappy experience," which I didn't get that. [00:34:41]

THERAPIST: It keeps coming up through what you're talking about, you know?

CLIENT: Yeah. I feel like...

THERAPIST: You feel like you have gotten through to somebody how you feel about what happened and what went on and actually have them sort of take that in and have a reasonable sense of where you're coming from, rather than push you back and tell you you're wrong and it doesn't make sense and not say anything. [00:35:43]

CLIENT: Yeah. Last week I was sort of...

THERAPIST: You feel like they don't really care about what's going on with you and it doesn't matter much to them.

CLIENT: Yeah. And I don't want that to be true, so I end up feeling like a lot of fucked-up – like did that really just happen that way?

THERAPIST: You do a lot of blaming yourself.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Because it hurts too much to say what it's like and have had that happened to you.

CLIENT: Yeah. And sort of the idea that maybe I could have done something that, even if I wanted to have the control, they would say if I did differently I could have gotten a response or whatever. Maybe I just didn't understand what I was saying, as opposed to things that I'm saying but they don't really care. [00:37:19] (pause) For whatever reason, that brings me back to the class of "let's do some ‘I' statements." Like "I feel this way." I should have said this when you said this.

THERAPIST: Wanting to tell them?

CLIENT: Or wanting to have...

THERAPIST: [...] (inaudible at 00:37:49)

CLIENT: Yeah, but in some ways I feel like I would like to just to make Christy, plus the associate or Chet [...] (inaudible at 00:38:04) and be like okay, we're just going to say "I" statements, like we have in therapy exercise. For whatever reason I'm really stuck on this idea of "I want you to sit here and I'm going to tell you things and then you're going to say, ‘I hear that you're saying this,'" and do this until – whatever. (pause) I don't [...] (inaudible at 00:38:49) (pause) [00:39:04] With Chet, part of me thinks that I could probably back him into a corner with "I" statements or whatever until – actually, I'm pretty confident I could rhetorically back him into a corner because I don't think he's ever been subjected to this kind of fun experiment and – I don't know. So they've been involved with people passive-aggressively [...] (inaudible at 00:39:34). I can't make an associate librarian listen to me and do that in any way, shape or form. But I would like to, in part because I would like to not talk in buzz words. I would like to just use words. [00:40:04] I would really like my mom to (pause) acknowledge that I have feelings about things and that it's okay that I have feelings or that maybe I would like her to have feelings. (pause) I'm even more sure that would [...] (inaudible at 00:40:49). Yeah, I guess with both conversations I feel very much upset and hurt and I feel I'm not heard on that or acknowledged. (long pause) [00:42:15]

THERAPIST: I think the what's quite important about this is that everything you're talking about, I think, is sort of a frustration with being stuck at stage one, like the conversations with the dean is stage one. Stage two is you actually wanting to make more of a contribution at work. In other words, it's not just that in general on some topics she is not listening to what you have to say and that's rude of her. It's that you're actually wanting her to hear you out about is really putting more of yourself into work and making more of a contribution in the first place. [00:43:52] In some sense it's like she's not hearing you out about what you have to say, but also keeping you out of your workplace in some important way.

CLIENT: Yeah. (pause) One of the things that makes me feel stuck in that stage one, from my point of view I feel like I know a lot of stuff about the Internet I would like to use that at work. I could help. It's like when I'm saying I know a lot about the Internet, it's like "wah-wah-wah."

THERAPIST: Right. They turn you down.

CLIENT: Right. Totally. Part of it is that there are a lot of things that I'm just like, "Oh, yeah. Sure. I can do that," which isn't... [00:45:25] But another part of me feels like if I put together a dossier of my awesomeness, is it possible that that would make you listen and let me do things? I still feel like I'm very much trying to bring up something with the assistant librarian, like actual points. The stupid tables that we have, no one else uses them this way and [...] (inaudible at 00:46:08). Her response was, "That can't be true. Other people must be using them." "Nope." And then, "Well, the company should fix it and [...]." I was like, "Yes. Part of the problem is that that fundamentally just doesn't work." That's the problem and she just didn't, couldn't, wouldn't hear that other people aren't doing this. I don't know. I guess part of what I found out is that some even fancier dean had gone to a conference and seen these tables and was like, "Oh, it's the future." [00:47:09] I was kind of like yeah, okay, she doesn't work in libraries. She works with the university at large. Did she actually see how it worked and see who came up with the stupid idea to network these together? It doesn't work. She asked me these super basic questions and I'm like, "Yes, I did make a list. Yes, I did call them. Yes, I did." I found myself repeating myself that I had done all this stuff and the problem isn't that. That, to me, is so frustrating I don't know what to do now.

THERAPIST: We have to stop for now.

CLIENT: Okay. I also think (sighs) maybe in a couple of weeks going back to two times a week.

THERAPIST: Sure.

CLIENT: Is it possible?

THERAPIST: I'm going to have something open either Monday or Wednesday at 5:15.

CLIENT: Okay.

THERAPIST: Are either of those good?

CLIENT: Yeah. They would be the same.

THERAPIST: Okay. Is there something that may be better?

CLIENT: End of the day is better and I would say Mondays I'd rather not stay.

THERAPIST: Okay. I can hang onto this for a week. Do you think you'd know by next week?

CLIENT: Yes. Have a nice week.

THERAPIST: Sure.

END TRANSCRIPT