TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

NO VOICE UNTIL 00:01:47

THERAPIST: Hello. Come on back.

FATHER: Were you checking on me to see if I was asleep? [00:02:04]

THERAPIST: (chuckles) No. I thought I heard everybody out there and I wanted to be sure you guys knew that it was at 4:30, but then I got out there and realized it was still just you, so I figured you knew that. I heard you talking on the phone so ...

FATHER: I knew that once I came here. I forgot it was 4:30. I thought it was 4:00.

THERAPIST: Oh, you actually thought it was 4:00? Okay, so I should have phoned you.

FATHER: No, she told me.

THERAPIST: I see. I'm going to have you turn the blinds there since it gets kind of a glare behind you. (pause) [00:03:15] Hang on a second. I'm having connection issues. Oh, I'm on the wrong network. You have to be on the right network in order to pick up my clients. There's a public network and a secret network that you guys can't see. (chuckles) This thing flipped over to the public network which, fortunately, doesn't allow me to access work files. We met on the 24^th and what have you guys discussed about your correspondence to me? [00:04:05]

FATHER: We have not had a chance to discuss. You just got it, she e-mailed it to me and I've read it; that's all we've done.

THERAPIST: So Kevin is not aware that you've corresponded with me.

MOTHER: He knows just from driving up that I sent the letter to you.

THERAPIST: Where do you guys want to begin? I'm full of thoughts. Hop in there, Wes. (pause)

FATHER: I think it's the anger issue that I'd like to address as one. I think that Maggie mentioned that when he gets his way he's great; but there are times that he gets very, very angry and over-the-top, uncontrollable-type angry. [00:05:04] And even though we try to keep our calm, sometimes it gets past that point. It's almost like Kevin you feel like we're against you, but we're not. We're all on the same team.

THERAPIST: Your letter definitely read that way.

FATHER: Yeah. And I can't stress enough that he's a great kid.

MOTHER: And I mentioned in there, too, I've read books. I've done all of this and still, when we get into the heat of it, I still resort back to the primal instinct.

THERAPIST: (chuckles) Which is what for you?

MOTHER: Not the right thing sometimes. We try to do the right thing, but then it doesn't always happen and the way I handle it is not, I'm sure, the correct way. [00:06:08] I can get to yelling and that kind of stuff, too, even though I know that is not the course of action.

FATHER: Kevin certainly is receptive to certain ways of reacting.

THERAPIST: You mean receptive like he actually gets better?

FATHER: I think if I were to get angry, that would make him angrier; so try to stay calm.

CLIENT: It seems when he handles the situation — I'm not being ...

MOTHER: Go ahead.

CLIENT: When he handles the situation I seem to be a bit calmer, but it seems like when my mom does it she has a lot of sarcasm and she'll repeat something that you say in a high-ear pitch. [00:07:03] She'll make you sound like you're doing a whole lot worse than you really are. Sometimes I'll answer the phone and I'll say, "Yeah?" and she goes, "Don't answer the phone like that." I ask her how I said it and she goes, (sarcastically) "Yeah." She sometimes resorts to that.

THERAPIST: Do you think this other thing was a little more serious than that?

CLIENT: Yeah, I do. I don't know how it gets that bad. The next day I'll be fine with her. I'll be kind of angry at her for how she handled it, but mostly I'll be angry at myself because of how I handled it.

FATHER: There are times, too, that right afterwards he'll come down and apologize or "I'm sorry, I was wrong." [00:08:04] After the fact, he realizes that he was wrong. I don't know that he realizes during because no matter how much you try to calm him down, it will not work.

THERAPIST: I said something to you in the e-mail and I apologize because I can't find anything anywhere that verifies this, so if I'm forgetting ... I have a number of intakes recently and so you are adopted or not? You are the guy that's adopted.

CLIENT: Yes.

THERAPIST: Okay, so I was right about that. I was totally pulling that out of my unconscious mind today because it just seemed right and then I didn't think so. So this, of course, enters us into a whole different set of circumstances. [00:09:00] He was adopted when?

MOTHER: As an infant; he was still in the hospital.

THERAPIST: Under what circumstances?

MOTHER: His birth mother was 15, being raised by her grandparents. Her mother abandoned her, so she had been raised for the last three years by her grandparents. She was going to keep the child for eight months of the pregnancy, but was towards the end of it the grandparents said — you know — she changed her mind. They were not going to be able to supportive. They couldn't raise great-grandchildren also.

THERAPIST: And she realized that she was 15.

MOTHER: Yeah.

CLIENT: She was 15 when she had me.

MOTHER: Yeah, she had several friends that had babies. Some had given them up and some had kept them.

THERAPIST: I've been down that path. My [brother] (ph?) had a foster daughter who had a child at 14, so I understand how difficult that can be. [00:10:01]

MOTHER: What's cool, though, is that we are still in contact with his birth family, not the birth mother. She's gone off to a d different part of the state.

THERAPIST: Do you know what has become of her mentally, et cetera?

MOTHER: She is married and she has a couple of other children, obviously younger, but it's rocky. It sounds as if there are a lot of ups and a lot of downs and rocky in that way, too.

THERAPIST: You don't have any allergic people, do we? Okay, good.

FATHER: Just to cats.

THERAPIST: When I get to know you, I remember. Go ahead.

MOTHER: He's allergic, but he loves cats.

THERAPIST: I have a number of those people and it's kind of nice because they enjoy the cat while they're here and then they don't have ... And I have good filters and things. Sorry, Wes. I just saw her jump up there and I thought I hadn't asked you that.

MOTHER: We love cats.

THERAPIST: Go ahead.

FATHER: I think what you're alluding to is she was a little bit of a handful growing up. [00:11:08]

MOTHER: There's some family background that you probably need to know. (laughs)

CLIENT: I know that — my cousin, right?

MOTHER: My second cousin, if it matters.

CLIENT: Yeah, my second cousin has really bad anger issues.

THERAPIST: He's how old?

MOTHER: I think he's ODD.

CLIENT: He's a year older than me.

MOTHER: A couple of years older than you, I think. He's being treated for ADD plus ODD and he's been institutionalized for years.

THERAPIST: Ohh. You said the age; say it again.

MOTHER: I think he's probably in his mid-teens.

THERAPIST: Explain to me the relationship again. He's a cousin? The mother's?

MOTHER: This is his birth mother's aunt, her son. [00:12:00]

THERAPIST: Let me talk about something for a second here. I don't know that there is a literature to prove this, but I literally wrote the book on foster care and adoption about the therapy they are in. I've done this a lot and I can tell you I met with a neurologist one time who was working with a kid and he said, "If I see someone is adopted I just assume they have either bi-polar disorder or ADD." And here is why: because in our society it is not reinforced to give children up for adoption. It's looked down upon. So if you decide not to have a child, you have an abortion — that's why a third of those teen pregnancies end in abortion — or you keep the child. [00:12:59] Rarely do people give children up for adoption. This is why there are so few children to adopt. The people who tend to do that tend to be people with ADD or bi-polar disorder because they can't, they just can't. It's easier for them. I think that's why the signal went on for me, so we have to be thinking about biological issues here, as well as behavioral issues. You're describing some family history and there is an old thing called a genogram that people used to sit down and do and build this giant chart of the family. That's super interesting and really expensive and tedious. If you would like to do that, that might be fascinating; but I don't know that we even have enough data. I'm a little concerned that you're starting to see some of that because this is the age where that urge is. Your explosiveness is not fully consistent with ADD. [00:14:00] Let me be clear, Kevin, I'm not just throwing you under the bus here. I understand that we need to make changes in the whole system, but we also have to understand sort of what goes on with your brain chemistry beyond what you may be aware of.

FATHER: And this is not the first time. So it's not right now, once he's become 13, that this is starting.

MOTHER: But it has gotten bigger as he's gotten bigger.

THERAPIST: Yeah, go back. You've seen this in childhood, you're saying, also, Wes?

FATHER: Not so much in childhood but ...

MOTHER: I would say the last year-and-a-half or so it has escalated to him putting holes in the wall.

FATHER: Well he did that before, though, kicked a hole in the wall upstairs.

CLIENT: That was because another person was making me really mad and was throwing rocks and hitting us with rocks and stuff.

MOTHER: That was fourth grade then. That would have been the first time that that happened. [00:15:04]

THERAPIST: If somebody is being attacked and they get angry and violent, that's different.

MOTHER: But he came home and was violent and angry.

THERAPIST: In response to an incident.

MOTHER: In response.

FATHER: I couldn't have told you what that was for.

CLIENT: That was because of those guys throwing rocks at us.

MOTHER: Right, but it has gotten bigger as he's gotten older, definitely. And the situation that just happened recently, that was a really bad one. The one before that, the anger was towards him that time. You remember that one?

FATHER: The one up in the room?

MOTHER: Yeah.

CLIENT: But that was because you sent him up get [ ] (inaudible at 00:15:52)

MOTHER: My only point in that being it's whoever delivers the news that you don't like to hear is the one who gets the brunt of what's coming out. [00:16:09]

THERAPIST: Do you think that's a fair assessment?

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. Definitely.

THERAPIST: And that's mostly true at home or it happens at school, too, sometimes?

CLIENT: Never at school, except when somebody is attacking me. Like the other day — did I tell you about this?

(laughter)

THERAPIST: That's a great way to open.

CLIENT: This kid came up to me and he gave me a nipple twister. He's always acting really weird. He's into a lot of drugs. He's into pot. So he came up and he gave me a nipple twister and said, "Why? Don't you like it?" I had my Social Studies book and I hit him with my Social Studies book and he started cussing at me and stuff. The principal called me up. You know who I'm talking about? Right? [00:17:03] We've been at the lake with one of my friends and I've seen him smoking, drinking, chewing, just everything that he's accessible to. The new principal called me up and asked me, "So what's the situation?" because he's brand new; he's never done this before. I told him what happened and he said, "I want you to try to avoid this kid." I told him about everything that he does and he said, "Just keep doing what you're doing."

THERAPIST: Keep hitting him with books.

CLIENT: (sniggers) Yeah.

THERAPIST: That's a good example of a fairly normal junior-high person's interaction. I don't know about your dad, but I can imagine hitting someone with a book in that situation myself. We shall not ask your dad, (laughter) but it doesn't mean that's not a good idea. But it's not like what we saw in the breakdown the other day so it's important to kind of look at each of those situations. [00:18:05] Had he done that and you took a desk and threw it at him and then chased him down the hall when he was trying to escape — these are not ideas I'm giving you, by the way.

CLIENT: Yeah, and I've seen that happen before in fourth grade.

THERAPIST: That would be over the top, but you were still kind of within the zone. It's interesting how you were able to stay really normal in that situation, but you got so far out of hand with your mom the other day. When you went and wrote the letter, because it was quite a detailed letter ...

FATHER: It was well written.

THERAPIST: It was like a dissertation, yeah. What was happening to you during that time? What was happening and how long did it take you?

CLIENT: It probably took me about 15 minutes to do that whole thing because I was writing everything that came to my head and really everything I said just came off the top of my head. [00:19:03] It probably took me 15 to 20 minutes to do that.

THERAPIST: How do you sleep? Do you sleep pretty well?

CLIENT: Really well, yeah. Sometimes I wake up around 3:00 and then I just go back to bed and I'll wake up about 5:50.

THERAPIST: And did you just feel really energetic when you were writing that letter, because that's a lot of letter to write in 15 minutes.

MOTHER: It was well written.

FATHER: I think it was done that quick, too, because I was aware of the situation and he e-mailed the letter to me.

CLIENT: I called you and I read it to you.

FATHER: That's right.

THERAPIST: I'm kind of torn on this because I've got to give you credit. If we have the choice between storming around the house breaking things and writing an energetic letter, I'm going to go with the letter every time.

CLIENT: I think that would be a good way to handle it, too, just go upstairs.

THERAPIST: Well, yeah, except it was pretty hateful. (laughs) If you really feel that way, I appreciate you sharing it in a way that is not destructive; but words are kind of important, too. Let's try and troubleshoot this school issue. I'm not going to tell you that's going to solve everything, but I think if we will work on it we will learn more about the case. School is — what — not going very well right now?

CLIENT: Since my dad has started to help me with homework, I think things have been going a lot smoother, don't you think? Considering anger and everything like that, don't you think?

FATHER: (pause) Yeah, but I don't know that things are still getting ... [00:21:02] I think you're handling it better, but you're still not turning everything in.

MOTHER: Can I do a back story? I'm the one that's around and so I'm the one the teachers call, I'm the one who is there to maintain him doing homework and that kind of stuff, and I'm the one that he tells it's completed and then find out it actually wasn't the next day; so there is anger on my side and distrust on my side.

CLIENT: A lot of it.

MOTHER: Well, for a reason.

THERAPIST: What did you say, Kevin?

CLIENT: I said a lot of it. That's what makes me angry because there is no trust and I get angry and then I just don't want to do anymore of my homework because I'm so angry and that's all I'm focused on.

THERAPIST: What do you mean — that's a big word; and let's dwell upon it before we move through the story. What do you mean "trust"? What does that mean? [00:22:03]

CLIENT: When I do have things done she won't trust me. She wants notes from the teachers. I will legitimately have these signatures, even from subs, and when I get home she one time asked me, "Are you sure these aren't forged by friends?" and stuff like that.

THERAPIST: Has anything ever happened to give her that idea?

CLIENT: No. Not once.

THERAPIST: Because normally I don't let anyone talk about trust because it's silly. I really don't know any trustworthy teenagers. I met one who said she was trustworthy one time and then she went away to college and came back and I was kind of kidding her about it. I go, "Back when you were 16 and you were telling me you were so trustworthy," and she goes, "Oh, I just lied about that." (chuckles) They're not usually trustworthy. You guys are not wired to be trustworthy. If you were you'd just move out and get a job and get a car and everything would be great. [00:23:05] I can't quite figure it out. That word doesn't usually show up in this discussion about homework, so let me ask her what I've never asked any parent. Why don't you trust him? That didn't even sound right coming out of my mouth. It was weird.

MOTHER: History. It's things like "Do you have any homework tonight?" "No." "Okay, then you can go fish," and then the next day you find out he didn't turn in an assignment that he didn't do.

THERAPIST: And do you think that's happened, Kevin?

CLIENT: Oh, yeah.

THERAPIST: Oh. Do you think that impeaches your trustworthiness in any way?

CLIENT: Yeah, but sometimes — I know it sounds like I'm saying I'm an adult, but I'm not and I know that I'm not — but I think just a little bit more respect than I'm given.

THERAPIST: Uh — you used the second word I don't let anybody use. Can you find a third one? Maybe the duck will come down. (laughter) [00:24:04] Maybe your parents know what the duck is. Do you know what the duck comes down means?

CLIENT: Oh, yeah.

THERAPIST: Yeah, your dad does. On Groucho Marx's show, What's My Line?, there was a secret word that nobody knew what it was until somebody accidentally says it and then a rubber duck falls down from the ceiling. I'll find you a YouTube of that sometime. It's pretty funny. (laughter) So, yeah, you used the second one, but you used it in reverse of what people usually do. What does this mean, respect?

CLIENT: This all happened when I was writing it and I just wrote it so fast that I don't really remember what I was talking about.

THERAPIST: I believe you.

CLIENT: I'm really not too sure, but I know there's (pause) ... I know what it is in my head; I just can't put it into words. [00:24:59]

CLIENT: That's because it's not really a useful word because usually parents say "he doesn't respect me." Now to your mother's credit, I don't know if she's read my column or my books — I think it's not even in here — let me search and see if she used the "respect" word in here. She didn't. There's no "respect" in here. It doesn't usually come from the teenage boy, it comes from the parent and they go "He just has no respect for us," and I say, "Oh, just don't ever say that again," because teenagers aren't really wired to be respectful — but parents are. So if they were respectful to you, what would they be doing? What would they appear to be . . ?

CLIENT: (pause) Giving me more credit for what I'm doing. Like in schoolwork, I'll finish my work, I'll have everything done, and then we'll look at my grades. I'll have good grades and then I'll have an F in something, just in an actual assignment ... [00:26:00]

THERAPIST: So they would notice the good grades, not just the bad ones. That would be a sign of respect.

CLIENT: They notice the bad ones more than the good ones.

THERAPIST: Correct. I didn't say that very well. Showing you respect would be they would note the good grades, not just the bad ones?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Okay. Anything else?

CLIENT: No. (pause)

THERAPIST: Okay. So I would just call that "noticing." That's a better word for it, that you would like them to be noticing these things.

MOTHER: As we're going through the grades we'll be like, "Oh, you got an A+ on that. Great. See what happens when you turn your stuff in? Look at that. That's great," so he does get credit for that. But where he is correct is that the majority of the time we'd be talking about what he didn't get turned in.

CLIENT: No.

MOTHER: So he does get credit. I don't know if he doesn't remember. [00:27:01]

THERAPIST: Do you want to just — this sounds like I'm making a joke and I'm not, but do you just want to be in charge of this for a semester and see how it goes?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Oh, okay. Maybe we'll [ ] (inaudible at 00:27:14).

CLIENT: I think learning from the mistakes would be a lot better than being told what to do and then having a day to make it up.

THERAPIST: Let's just be clear. What would the mistakes be?

CLIENT: Not turning things in. My dad, to use this example, we used to have this pitching coach. I used to be a pitcher and I was pretty good at it. But every time I would mess up, like I would pitch one and maybe it was just a bad throw, maybe it just slipped off my fingers and I wouldn't throw it perfectly, and then the guy would go off on you and start yelling at you. He wouldn't give you enough time to learn from your mistakes. He would give you enough time to be yelled at pretty much.

THERAPIST: Just so we're clear, in that case you just don't learn to pitch very well. [00:28:01] What will happen if you are wrong about your ability to be in charge? Because I'm really, seriously headed this direction, so be careful what you wish for.

CLIENT: (pause) I'm thinking that if it doesn't work, just every other day we have a check-up on it.

THERAPIST: I think if you're in charge, you have to be in charge — and I'm not, I really am not being tricky here. If you're going to be in charge, you have to be in charge. I have something I want them to do, which I shall get to in a minute; but you can't have it both ways where they check on you a little, because that's just going to start the same thing up again, except it's going to be on Tuesday and Thursday instead of Monday, Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday. That's going to be the same thing. Do you really think you can self-regulate?

CLIENT: I think if I work as hard as I can . . [00:29:04]

THERAPIST: Well that's a true statement.

CLIENT: ... then I can get it done.

THERAPIST: That's true.

CLIENT: One of my best friends has been doing so much work and she's getting really stressed out and she lost 15 pounds. That's how stressed out she's getting.

THERAPIST: Well you don't have 15 pounds to lose, do you?

CLIENT: No.

THERAPIST: That is an interesting example. I'm going to give you a similar one which, weirdly enough, originally came to me because that person lost a lot of weight. I was going to give you this example anyhow, but it's funny that you mentioned it that way. Many years ago I had this girl come in who was referred by the doctor because of low weight. That really wasn't the problem. The problem was she had, not only ADD, but anxiety and, to be honest with you, she wasn't very smart. We did all this testing on her and I had to sit her down one day and say, "You're not very smart," which was a very hard thing to say. [00:30:05] She said, "I know that. I'm aware of that." I said, "Thankfully, you're very sweet and a good person." Recently I went to her wedding and just before that I went to her college graduation, which is a real school. She took seven years, but she got through college with a Bachelor's degree and then — I'm going to change this a little to protect her confidentiality — let's say it was in nursing. Then she had to pass this exam and it took her three tries. It was just horrible. Every time she would take it she would fail. She would be in here sobbing that it was horrible. The last time she was like, "I'm not going to take it again." I said, "Yeah, you are. You sure are." "Why? You just want to make me suffer." [00:31:02] I said, "No. It's because you've come as far as you did." And then one day I get a text that she passed it. She didn't tell anybody she was going to take it again, she just went and did it and passed it. So here is this person — and she has a good job now; she does really important work. So what do you suppose this person who has an 87 IQ, [under it is average] (ph?), ADD and anxiety, how do you suppose she ever did this? I'll give it to you again. There was no cheating involved. What do you suppose allowed her to do this?

CLIENT: She's probably going to college, so she's probably on her own.

THERAPIST: She was self-regulating. Actually some of the opposite. She knew how to get help from everybody, her friend, her roommates, She would go up to the college and get special study skills and study groups. She actually knew how to use other people's help. What else do you suppose made it possible for her to succeed? [00:32:05] I'm amazed that you cannot figure this out because you actually mentioned it a minute ago on your own self. You said this was what it would take for you to succeed.

CLIENT: I don't know.

THERAPIST: She was the hardest working student I've ever met in my life. She never gave up. She wanted to lot, but she never gave up and she kept at it. Now if you can marshal that kind of energy in yourself, you'll be fine. Now she flunked a bunch of classes and had to retake them and it was hard at times, but she was a hard worker.

MOTHER: She had the desire.

FATHER: He's a really smart kid.

THERAPIST: Well then you have one point in your favor, huh?

FATHER: When he turns stuff in, it's all A's. It's the fact of not turning things in or forgetting to study for something. [00:33:01]

THERAPIST: What he hast to try hard at is not those things ...

FATHER: It's not that he's dumb.

THERAPIST: It's to be able to self-regulate.

FATHER: Correct.

THERAPIST: It all still comes in. I know. I have two or three kids that are in ivy league schools and one of them totally bombed out because he wasn't getting up and doing what needed to be done every day. It's easy to decide to go to college. It's hard to decide to get up every day and get it done or turn in your work. That's the hard part. And you're saying, though, that you understand this, that you would have to work, be self-regulating, and work hard. And who will be damaged if you do not do those?

CLIENT: Me. And my parents.

THERAPIST: Well, they will feel sad, but really you will bear the weight of this. Very interesting. So what if you guys changed and only structured his effort, not the outcomes? [00:34:02] You don't know what I mean yet, but I will be telling you. What if you guys did nothing but structured his effort? (pause)

FATHER: I think that's kind of what we do now.

THERAPIST: I think that you're halfway there. He and I do not think you have reached the high point of that yet. (pause)

CLIENT: You called me while I was mowing yesterday to ask me if I had gotten everything turned in and what my grades were.

THERAPIST: Kevin understands my point. That was my point. What I would do, and this is the part you may not see coming and I shall see what you think, Kevin. What I would do is decide that you are in middle school?

CLIENT: Yeah.

MOTHER: He's a little young for his year.

CLIENT: My birthday is in the summer, so I'm going to be the youngest all through the year. [00:35:05]

THERAPIST: Oh, lord. I think I commented on this last time, didn't I? Okay. So in your year people are expected to have 80-minutes worth of homework per day and rather than have a discussion about your phone or whether it's on or off or blah, blah, blah, you just need to decide to do 80 minutes of studying per day. And if you don't have homework, that's where they structure your effort. There are many fine things for you to work on in enriching your education. I want to be clear — in no way am I suggesting they punish you for not having homework. I'm saying that a young person of your age should be able to do about 80 minutes of homework a day; and if you're not, you're not being challenged enough. So your mom can find [ ] (inaudible at 00:35:59) school that provides some additional work for you to do. [00:36:02] Now if you have homework, if it were me I would do the homework during the study time because wouldn't that be a good way to get that done? I'm going to give you [ ] (inaudible at 00:36:18) on this; talk to the teachers and anything that he can turn in by e-mail, you guys need to switch over to e-mail. They will do it because they don't want to get him in IEP. He's not on an IEP, is he? They don't want to do it so they'll do any accommodation you want if they don't have to put it down and have him sign off on it; so try to get everything turned in by e-mail that you can get. And I mean get a scanner and put it on your computer and when he fills out a paper form, scan it and send it in. My daughter has an iPad and 100% of her homework is turned in on e-mail. [00:36:59]

MOTHER: I'm sorry. I'm not very smart. How does that help?

THERAPIST: Because he won't lose it then. The minute he hits send, then it's gone and he doesn't have to get between here and school.

CLIENT: And I wouldn't have to remember it when I get there.

THERAPIST: That's exactly right. You are with my, Kevin. We are down. I know I just combined two issues in the same picture, but make it easy as it can be. It's wrong to take the easy path and not the right one, but there's nothing wrong with making the right path easier. Any technology can help with that. If it weren't for that I don't know how my daughter would ever get homework in; and she has like a 3.4 GPA because she can do stuff like this. She has an iPad, so she can take pictures of the document for posterity in case it is lost. In fact, an iPad would be really useful. [00:38:01]

CLIENT: We have one and that's what I wrote the note on.

THERAPIST: Really? Does it have a camera on it?

CLIENT: Yep.

THERAPIST: Well your world is going to get a lot easier, boy. Use all that. Set him up; five days, 80 minutes a day. When you're done with 80 minutes, you're done. If you have something to carry over for the next day, carry it over. Do it.

MOTHER: Do you recommend that this 80 minutes is at the kitchen table, downstairs or up in his ...

THERAPIST: It needs to be roughly supervised, but not snoopervised.

FATHER: But it can't be in his room with the door locked?

THERAPIST: Sorry, Kevin. No.

FATHER: Or in the bathroom with the door locked.

THERAPIST: Not because I do not trust you, not because you're a psychopath, but because you're like a 13-year-old boy. It's just not a good study environment in one's room. There are too many other distractions, especially if we need him to use electronic devices to do things. [00:39:00] I know you don't realize this, but there are lots of other things you can do with electronic devices (laughs) that are not as helpful. You typed that whole thing out on your iPad? Wow. I have iPads and that's so ...

FATHER: With a keyboard? You didn't have a keyboard? You used the virtual keyboard?

CLIENT: Yes.

THERAPIST: He's not going to have any trouble following my idea. The 80 minutes, what I would do for a while is I would do that five days a week until he gets clearly underway; and if he gets clearly underway, you probably can let him off one of those days. I just don't know yet because we haven't tried it. That would be your goal is to make it so you only have four days a week for your homework. I'm not sure how that will interface with your school yet. And then your job — we're going to try to make it easier — your job is to use that plan productively. [00:39:59] Now until you're done with that 80 minutes, you don't have any other devices or any other games or whatever it is you do. What is it that you spend your time doing?

CLIENT: Texting.

THERAPIST: Yes. And girls like that quite a bit when boys text.

CLIENT: I have a girlfriend and she lives 45 minutes away.

THERAPIST: Well if you're a good texting boy, I bet she is really happy to be with you because girls, that's their number one complaint about boys is they don't text enough. Go ahead, Wes. We had to talk about texting in the framework.

FATHER: A lot of times (pause) he will want to use the phone for homework and I don't know if that needs to be.

THERAPIST: Why do you need the phone for homework?

CLIENT: Google drive. I'm a lot faster texter than I am typer, and so I can get things done faster on Google drive and I can save it to that account. [00:41:00]

THERAPIST: You can pull it off of Google drive on your iPad.

CLIENT: I know, but the things are further away; it's just in my thumbs, so I don't have to use all of my fingers. I don't have to memorize each key with each finger.

THERAPIST: It seems strangely like bullshit. (laughter) It has the unmistakable odor of bullshit and I know it's not Ruth's box because I cleaned it today; so I know that isn't it. I cleaned it just a few minutes ago. It was so weird. I looked over there just a few seconds ago and literally your dad and your mom and Ruth were all exactly looking at you the same way. It was the weirdest thing. (laughter) I didn't want to stop in the middle to mention that, but that's funny. And Ruth was almost looking over your mom's knee so she could actually see that; and you didn't notice. I thought, "God, you must really be [on stage] (ph?)." I think that is a really not-believable story. [00:41:59] And if you're doing it, you're just going to have to work around it because you can go onto Google docs. Google docs is where I find things are much easier than your iPad. And your girlfriend, you just need to tell her that this is my study time and I will pine away for you throughout the entire time. And you will find that when you miss her for an hour-and-a-half it's going to be way better when you get back on texting again. Doesn't she have study time? They don't have study time at her school? Where does she go to school?

FATHER: Doesn't she have to study at home?

CLIENT: Yeah.

MOTHER: That's our new term for homework.

CLIENT: Oh, yeah. Since she was gone, she had six hours of regular homework and then she still had make-up homework.

THERAPIST: Terribly painful. Yeah, I would think that she'll have plenty. Why don't you tell each other that's what you're going to do during that time because one of your generation's bad ideas is texting while you ... fill in the blank; do everything, go to the bathroom, drive, do study time, make out. [00:43:12] (laughter) You think I'm kidding. They really do. You don't want to do that, though; that's really a bad thing. So don't text during study time. You have to be focused. We're on which — Focalin or something? What are we on? Or are we on the patch now?

MOTHER: We went to the patch.

THERAPIST: We didn't get a chance to talk about that.

MOTHER: It seems to be decent. The only problem is — and here I am sort of micromanaging again — he has access to pulling it off when he shouldn't.

THERAPIST: Well, so does my 10-year-old. Do you pull it off wisely? When are you pulling it off?

CLIENT: When it starts to fall off.

THERAPIST: Whoops. (laughs) That's not supposed to happen.

CLIENT: Yeah, it will half come off. Sometimes that's when I pull it off. And then at the very end of the day it starts to itch a bit.

THERAPIST: Yeah, that's plausible. [00:44:07] What's the end of the day? What do you mean, what time?

CLIENT: Like seventh hour around 2:00. It gets out at 2:50.

THERAPIST: That's a little early.

CLIENT: But then I go to study hall until 3:19.

THERAPIST: Okay, so when are you going to do study time? Because you want to do it early enough that you have the rest of the evening to text pictures of different hairstyles to your girlfriend and stuff. (pause)

FATHER: I think that needs to be done when you get home. The more you delay, the less chance it's going to get done.

THERAPIST: Amen, brother, because the other thing is we need to rethink when you're pulling the patch off because it's okay if you're two hours away from the last important thing you're going to do. [00:45:06] Then you can pull it. I understand it feels weird and itchy because the ADD people don't like to be uncomfortable and that's the only down side to the patch. I don't know quite what to do unless you put something over it.

FATHER: Yeah, we've tried tape.

MOTHER: Yeah, we don't remember that all the time, but it works when we do remember it.

THERAPIST: If you can keep it on until — study time starts at what time do you think, Wes?

FATHER: 4:00.

MOTHER: I think it's usually about 4:30 that he gets home and has a snack.

THERAPIST: Yeah, you want a snack for sure. I'm all about that. 4:30 and then that means you'd be done at about 6:00 at the latest. You need a break. I forgot to mention that. You need to go about 35 minutes and then take a ten-minute break; maybe 40 minutes, take a ten-minute break, and you probably, if you need to, text your girlfriend during the ten-minute break. [00:46:10] Personally, I would go outside and run around, but whatever excites you; then the phone is out of commission again.

FATHER: Yeah, I think if you bring the phone in and let him text in between, then it's going to be harder to get it away.

THERAPIST: Well, I hope that you're wrong, but you're probably right. What do you think?

CLIENT: Probably not because ... Well yes and no because it's going to ...

THERAPIST: No.

CLIENT: Wait ... (laughter)

THERAPIST: Your dad's point is that it's unwise for you to take a ten-minute texting break.

CLIENT: Probably.

THERAPIST: Okay, thank you for your mature wisdom in that regard. So go outside and run around and just doing something outdoors is better for a break. Thankfully, you do not smoke cigarettes, so don't do that.

FATHER: Yeah, but do come back in, though. [00:47:02]

THERAPIST: Yeah, it needs to be just a ten-minute break. I know time management is not your thing, but whatever it takes, because you've still got to do the next 40 minutes. So you come in and then you do your second 40 minutes. This whole business of working and hour and taking a break, you need to grow into because it's the only way you're going to stay on target. So you're done by about 6:00. If you take the patch off at the beginning of study time, you'll be fine.

MOTHER: At the risk of sounding pessimistic — that's not what I mean, I'm realistic ...

THERAPIST: If you choose one it's going to be pessimistic, don't you think?

MOTHER: It's tough monitoring this. So let's say the 80 minutes was not utilized well. What are consequences to that then?

THERAPIST: What is the consequence of that, Kevin?

CLIENT: Making me work another ...

THERAPIST: Oh, I don't think so. You think, really? That's the consequence that you have to do another 80 minutes? [00:48:07]

CLIENT: If I'm going to be independent, then ...

THERAPIST: Ahh, now we're headed down the road. What do you think about that?

CLIENT: I think if I was independent I could handle it by myself. It makes me feel a lot better about myself knowing that my parents — because in everything else my parents are always right there with me. Like with my shooting, my dad is the coach now for the shooting thing.

THERAPIST: You like shooting, don't you?

CLIENT: Oh, yeah.

THERAPIST: Do you like homework?

CLIENT: No.

THERAPIST: Well there you go.

FATHER: It's not homework. It's study time.

CLIENT: It seems like I'm more responsible with the things that can kill somebody.

THERAPIST: But it's different, Kevin. I bet you're responsible with a video game, too, aren't you? Like you could play a video game without their help at all, can't you? [00:49:00]

CLIENT: Probably.

THERAPIST: This is the difference. You can't equate any of those things. Homework sucks and study time is the time to do it, so all I'm telling them to do is manage the study time so you are working during that time. You need that part. I do not think you're ready to handle it. The rest of it, I am willing to see you be in charge of. Here is the problem: It would be tempting to make you do additional time, but I think there's just a lot of diminishing return. I think that the real consequence is you're screwed. You're going to flunk out of school and be a loser. Does that worry you any?

CLIENT: Yes.

THERAPIST: Well I believe you. That's what it's going to come down to and, instead, the power struggle at this point is whether you're obedient to your mother or whether she's a crappy parent. Isn't that kind of a stupid discussion? Wouldn't it be more important to have the discussion about whether or not you are a giant failure? [00:50:03] And I don't really think you want to be a giant failure, so their job is to define the 80 minutes and shut off all of your distractions and your job is to use it to your best advantage. I have this thing where a person hits "Send" and their document is gone. That makes the ADD people so happy. You can't believe how happy they are. They're like, "Oh — it's gone forever. I don't ever have to see it again." They get more done that way.

CLIENT: That's kind of how I feel. When I turn something in I know that I'm never going to see it again and then it's off my chest.

THERAPIST: I know what I speak of, do I not? You say such nasty things about me in the paper. [ ] (inaudible at 00:50:45) and you told your mother that I said she didn't understand you. I don't remember saying that. It may be true, but I don't remember saying it. (laughing) Did I say that? [00:50:57]

MOTHER: I didn't remember it and he didn't remember it, but something you said ...

THERAPIST: I think it was "we can't understand somebody that has ADD." You don't understand them.

CLIENT: Yeah, that's how I interpreted it.

THERAPIST: Well, okay. The way you made it sound in your dissertation — I think it was you said it to her, actually. You made it sound like I was like, "You don't understand your son." Let me rock him on my lap. (laughter)

CLIENT: I think she has a good idea of how to handle things, but not the best in the world.

THERAPIST: And I saw that. That was in your dissertation where you said she has no idea how to raise an ADD child. Might that be because they've never had one before? (chuckles) Do you think we could help them learn how to do that better?

CLIENT: And that's exaction what they said, too. [00:51:58]

THERAPIST: Okay. Well that's pretty [fair.] (ph?) This is probably a better way to do that, but the bottom line is you can lead this horse to water, but you are the one who is going to have to drink it and, if you want to be educated and to go to college and to be something in life, that is what you'll do. Now I will say they have an investment in that because what happens to you if you end up working at Burger King and nothing else? Where are you going to end up living?

CLIENT: With my parents. (chuckles)

THERAPIST: Yes. So everyone in the room has an investment in that not being the outcome because therapists and parents are supposed to be fired by their best customers; and so if they're successful raising you, then you go off and are like, "I'm going to my dorm room now. I'm leaving you." And they're all like, "Oh, we're going to miss you so much. Come back at Thanksgiving." [00:53:00] None of that is every going to happen if you don't realize every day when you get up that you have to make a decision to do what needs to be done. Do you feel me?

CLIENT: Yes.

THERAPIST: All right. So now your mom has another thing on her list about pessimism. What is it? (laughs) No? There's no more pessimism? Or did I not really answer that one? You make the time and he is going to have to show us that he can make the effort.

FATHER: It will have to be in a place that he is not being disturbed, because I know it can't be down at the kitchen table.

CLIENT: No, it can't. No.

THERAPIST: You guys have got to find it and you understand, Kevin, it has to be monitored, but not snoopervised. I don't think I ever quite clarified that. Be sure he's not surfing the Internet for cat videos.

CLIENT: Those are pretty funny, though. [00:54:02]

THERAPIST: Right. (laughter) And if you wish to do that after study time is over, feel free. You can forward them to your girlfriend.

FATHER: Make it a day trip.

THERAPIST: That's you and Ruth for your girlfriend. But she's going to make the time and you're going to make the effort. Now if this doesn't work by the end of this semester — I mean if it works kind of okay, then we should try it another semester. If it's not working at all, then we have to start thinking how to crush the light out of you until you do what you're supposed to do.

CLIENT: I think we should start it next semester because this semester only has about ...

MOTHER: But we have a new quarter starting.

CLIENT: Oh, yeah. That's right.

THERAPIST: These are the big ones. Let's start it and we'll figure the second quarter out this fall because your quarter ends at Christmas break, does it not?

FATHER: Yes.

THERAPIST: And that will give us a really good picture. [00:55:02] Let's make sure this e-mail submission system works. I can't tell you how much that fits with what they do.

MOTHER: Are teachers pretty good about accepting that, because I've not really heard about it?

THERAPIST: You will be seeking it as an accommodation and, if they need to do a little student improvement plan or whatever, if they buck at all — your school historically has had a tendency to buck. But once the staff changed a couple of years ago, that got better. If they don't want to do that then we're going to start talking about having him tested for an IEP. My bet is they will be happy to do it.

FATHER: If worse comes to worse, we can e-mail it.

THERAPIST: Oh. Now I should know who that is because that's a ...

FATHER: She's a secretary there. Front desk. She is a good gal.

THERAPIST: I think the day will come in the next three or four or five or six years when this will be the system that they all use. If I were a teacher, I would much prefer to have it all just come to my computer and I can ...

FATHER: Can't lose it. [00:56:11]

THERAPIST: Yeah. Absolutely.

MOTHER: You know they do so much on the computer now. I should know with Power School and homework and then the teachers e-mail us and say there is a test on Monday so you're right, there is already a lot of it.

THERAPIST: If you have any trouble I will help you make that correction. In fact, the other day we were in an IEP meeting for my kiddo. She is a junior and one of her teachers said something to her about turning in an assignment. She said, "Oh. Well I just usually e-mail those in." (laughs) The teacher was like, "You do?" and she was like, "Yeah, I'll make sure they talk to you about it," and her gifted teacher made sure that was taken care of. But yeah, we've had no problems. She's at [ ] (inaudible at 00:56:55). That's a pretty good sized school. We don't have any trouble with that. [00:57:01] I don't know how much we've tested the system of taking a picture of it, but we have a program that converts the picture to a scan.

FATHER: I'm wondering, you take a picture and maybe you can't see it as well.

THERAPIST: It's pretty amazingly high resolution. (laughs) Give it a try. It's really high res. The main thing is if there is any problem with it, you have the document on file. If you check on there — I can't think what she uses, but I don't think we've actually converted one lately.

FATHER: You could probably just do it on the iPad and then just take a screen shot.

THERAPIST: You can. You can actually shoot the picture and if you want to do it within this document scanner, it will actually turn it into a paper document, make it not as large for a larger file. Any technology assist you can do, if he's open to that, will make it a lot easier and more able to be accounted for. [00:58:08] I just wrote this chapter in my book this weekend for ADD people, so I'm really at the top of thinking about that.

FATHER: Do you sleep?

THERAPIST: Do I sleep? That's an excellent question. (laughs) I do, but talk about having to fit things in.

MOTHER: Can you finish that book quickly?

THERAPIST: It is closing in. I have a focus group, ironically named Focus Group, coming up. We're going to meet and they're going to give me feedback on it so, hopefully, it will be out no later than March. We're trying to get it a little sooner than that.

MOTHER: I have a book on executive skills. Is that a good thing for me to continue looking into?

THERAPIST: What are they recommending in there?

MOTHER: I haven't actually picked it up for a while. I started reading it and then got sidetracked, but it's the organization and do you just have some ideas about how ... [00:58:59]

THERAPIST: Yeah, I hit that in one chapter but I'm looking, actually, for some good resources to add to that. You might send me the link to that.

MOTHER: I will. Our school psychologist offered those to me. I will because it's been very interesting but, like I said, I put it down and I've been reading other stuff.

CLIENT: The one problem with reading a book is it's not personalized for that person.

THERAPIST: That is such a good point, Kevin.

CLIENT: This is going to help a lot more than a book.

THERAPIST: Actually, if you don't say mean things in your dissertations about me. (laughs) You can say whatever you want.

FATHER: And you're right, I know exactly what you're saying. Sometimes it gives us ideas to pick up something that we may not have thought of.

THERAPIST: I guess that is true and you're both right, but I actually have said in talks I give that you can't really get a manual for how to parent. I know there are bunches of them because every kid deserves their own manual; and so I think your point is well taken, Kevin. [01:00:02] It's interesting because I was almost formulating the same point when Kevin said it. Those books are just as good as they can be if you pick out what works well strategically with the kid and some of that is trial and error. This particular organizational system I've had a lot of luck with in terms of getting out of the power struggle and into appropriate levels of self-regulation and oversight. We may have to tweak it a little bit. The other version of this is where we follow you around, drive you around like a little boat all the time and you wish to not go that route. I'm going to respect that until proven otherwise because I think if he doesn't start learning that now it ends up getting harder and harder. [01:01:02] We want to militate against that.

FATHER: So it's his responsibility ...

THERAPIST: Except for the time allotment. That is yours.

FATHER: Otherwise he's getting online and checking grades and homework assignments.

CLIENT: That one time where I really did have my phone, I was doing my homework and I was really focused on it just knowing that I wasn't pressured to finish it, knowing that if I didn't you would have taken my phone away.

THERAPIST: Say that again. I got lost.

CLIENT: Like if I knew that if I didn't get my things done ... like if I had one thing that wasn't turned in, my phone would be gone; for a long time. It's never gone for two hours, it's gone for weeks to months. [01:02:02] You may not understand this, but it makes me mad that I'm not going to be able to get it back for a while and then ... I don't know.

THERAPIST: I do understand why that would make you mad. Yes.

CLIENT: And then it makes me want to focus more on ...

THERAPIST: Being mad.

CLIENT: Yeah. Rather than doing my homework.

THERAPIST: Probably, that is a true statement; but they're trying to figure out how to not have you live at home and work at Burger King, so maybe they're overly worried about that. But who really does ultimately have the power to put their minds at ease? Who really does? Me? Jesus? Who has the power to put their minds at ease about your ability to succeed?

CLIENT: I think I do.

THERAPIST: That would be you. Amen. [01:03:00] One thing is I don't think teenagers are very trustworthy, but some have better judgment than others. If you want to prove that you have good judgment, you will run this plan well. Now one other thing I would do if I were you guys, is I would set up a payment system for him on his grades. I'm sure [ ] (inaudible at 01:03:23), Kevin. I almost forgot; how to set up a healthy payment system. I'll tell you what works best, but it's kind of impractical issue because you can't trust Power School. You can't trust it. If it were working accurately on a week-to-week basis, I would tell you to pay off on a week-to-week basis because the ADD people need pretty recent reinforcement.

CLIENT: It takes them a good two or three days to get the things turned in. Unless they're doing it for a completion grade, it's not going to get in for two or three days.

THERAPIST: I would not trust it.

FATHER: I guess you would owe less money then.

MOTHER: I like that. [01:04:01]

THERAPIST: Actually, that's sometimes done. You have two choices and I'm interested in — you may want to ponder this until we get together again, each of you, because each has a different implication. You either pay him for the grades themselves, which is outcome based, or you pay him for the effort. Since Kevin is a smart guy, he's capable of achieving the outcomes. I just don't know which is better in this case. Do you understand the difference, Kevin?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: And you need to pay him pretty well. My kids don't know anything about people getting stuff for free. They've never, ever heard of this before. They think everyone works hard for the money they earn. In fact, that's my daughter in the front office working right now doing billing this evening. I believe if Kevin's job is going to school, then pay him to go to school. You don't need to buy him a bunch of other stuff. [01:05:04] Sorry Kevin. Then that's his money. That's what he has for his economy and then when he wants an XBox or whatever crap you do, then he buys that from his money. I know right now how much money they have in their accounts. I just transferred it today.

FATHER: That's so interesting. I never thought that would have come out of your mouth.

THERAPIST: Make everything an economy. (pause)

FATHER: Because ... yeah ... well.

THERAPIST: And let me tell you how well this works. Ruth had kittens. I did not know she was pregnant when we found her. She had these four kittens and they really are the most amazing kittens I've ever had. We gave three of them away and we kept one. This is the nicest kitten and he's funny and plays catch, plays fetch, and plays all these games. The agreement was that Evan had to take care of this cat, blah, blah, blah. [01:06:01] Recently Evan came to me in the summer and he said, "Dad, I'm not going to be able to do my summer camp." I said, "Oh. Why?" He said, "I have to get him neutered." I said, "You're right, Evan. How much is that going to cost?" He said, "I have to get him declawed, too." I said, "Yeah, that's true, but here's how this works. We're your insurance company and you have a co-pay. You will have to pay the co-pay and we will cover the rest of it." He was taking this into account; and he was nine at the time. If you go this route from day one and they understand there is an economy here that they have to participate in, then just pay them for whatever you want them to do. I want Evan to clean my office, so he comes and cleans my office on the weekends and he gets paid. I don't care about grades because he does that without any problem. So if you really want to reinforce Kevin and give him salary for something that you think is important, go that route; but then don't also give him free money. [01:07:06] Do you get free money for stuff? Do your parents throw money at you?

CLIENT: No. I work at my dad's a store for $7 and hour and I work from 9:00 to 5:00.

THERAPIST: There you go, man. Your dad and I know about the tax benefit of employing our children. (laughs) Do they let you put him on payroll?

FATHER: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Because my accountant said I couldn't do that.

FATHER: They didn't think it was a good idea if it was full time, but he does it part time every once in a while. My accountant kind of suggested, she didn't think it was a great idea, but if he's not making a lot of money then it wouldn't be a bad thing.

THERAPIST: You and I will talk further about this.

CLIENT: And then I make even less with my grandpa. I like working with my grandpa.

THERAPIST: So you understand this idea that people earn a living? So your parents do not suck as much as you implied they do in your dissertation because if they've taught you that lesson, you are ahead by about a mile at this point. [01:08:05] They'll just add to your salary then. Figure out how they want to do that. That makes it way easier when you guys understand that. Too many people in this town rain money on their children.

CLIENT: Exactly. I know.

FATHER: And I know who you're talking about.

THERAPIST: There is an endless supply here of people who do this and then they wonder. I get frustrated with them because they wonder why their kids won't do anything, why they're entitled, why they expect things that they can't provide; and I'm like, "I wonder."

CLIENT: This person I'm talking about has six cars and it's a three-person family.

MOTHER: He has a job and he pays for his own stuff.

CLIENT: He gets to ride around on a mower, which he loves cars and stuff. [01:09:02]

THERAPIST: Now that's work, buddy. Just because you get to ride around on a mower (laughs). I've got a big old diesel mower I'll put you on. (laughter) Almost the biggest diesel mower you can get; not quite.

FATHER: I didn't even know they made them.

CLIENT: Yeah, that's pretty much a tractor with a big blade on it.

THERAPIST: That's a [grasshopper] (ph?). It's a big diesel. So that is what I would do. That will also incentivize him, but you'll have to think about which way you want to incentivize him; whether you want to do the effort or the outcome. It's the difference between whether his floor sweeping is good or his store hours are at present.

MOTHER: Yeah, we've never done allowance or anything like that.

FATHER: I just thought that was a no-no. [01:10:00]

THERAPIST: Here is the deal on that. Don't ever reinforce something that people have internal motivation to do. So if Kevin was in here and he was like, "Golly, I really can't wait to get to school. I love it so much. God, it's fun. I want to take AP classes," then we would not be having this conversation. You wouldn't pay him to fish, although I guess if the catfish were ...

FATHER: Oh, God. I'd be broke. (chuckles)

THERAPIST: There you go. So you wouldn't pay him to fish because he likes that, but school is not that exciting for him so you raise the stake. My dad did this when I was in high school because I needed to get a scholarship to go to college and I had to raise my grade point average. I had to get a 4.0 my senior year and little does my dad know — he's dead, so I never will tell him —he didn't need to pay me. (laughs) I understood the importance of this to the family. I totally got it.

FATHER: Trust.

THERAPIST: Well I was not about to tell him, "No, I don't want your filthy money." (laughter)

FATHER: And smart. [01:11:04]

THERAPIST: Yeah. I was happy to collect it. And I appreciated him. It was a good investment for him because that was thousands of dollars against his little few hundred. I was glad it happened. I don't think I ever told him. You know I may have eventually and he told me, "You know what? That's okay. It was worth it." I think we actually did have that conversation before he died. All right. You have plenty to work on. We didn't do as much on anger management this time, but I'm going to just say this. Kevin, try not to act crazy for the next couple of weeks and when you see yourself starting to act crazy, be like "oh-oh, there it is" and go into a calm place to do some meditation or something.

CLIENT: How about walking upstairs, writing another one of those letters and then deleting it right after? [01:11:59]

THERAPIST: I like that idea quite a bit. It's not even that you were wrong in any way to write the letter, I think it was healthy to do. I think the deleting or the saving privately may be the better way to handle that. Harry Truman actually used to do that. He would write these letters and then put them in a box and not send them. The one time he couldn't control himself he got into all sorts of trouble. (chuckles) His daughter had played this concert and she wasn't really that good a pianist, but she was the daughter of the President. Some critic in New York wrote how terrible the concert was and Harry Truman (laughing) wrote this horrible letter. Of course, I think he actually sent it to the New York Times and it was terrible. People made fun of him. When you read his biography you find out that he did this all the time, but he just didn't send the letters.

FATHER: Yeah, I like that.

CLIENT: When I wrote this one I looked over it and I looked over it again and I just felt like a total jerk. [01:12:59]

THERAPIST: I appreciate ... I think you're a person of good moral character. I think, as is common with the ADD people, your actions and words get ahead of your brain. We shall help you with that. I do not believe that is who you are in your heart.

FATHER: He is extremely a good kid because we noticed it this weekend. We went to a party that was outdoors. There were a lot of kids. He was around a kid there who had Down's Syndrome who Kevin took care of the whole time. People were walking through the woods. Kevin's friends were walking ahead. Kevin was having them wait for him because he had the child that had Down's Syndrome with him. They all took off and Kevin stayed with him the whole time and Weaver also commented about how he had to cleanest mouth of the kids that were out there.

MOTHER: We get a lot of good reports back for him, teachers ...

FATHER: There's a lot of good in him. [01:14:03]

THERAPIST: I think it's not going to be too difficult to get beyond that. I think that the other thing we're going to have to do, once we get this sort of settled and you're operating well with it, we're going to have to figure out whether your temper issues are simply outbursts from ADD or if you've got a little bit of a mood disorder going on there; but I'd like us to calm the world down a little bit and see how you respond to it first. Does that sound fair?

CLIENT: Yes.

THERAPIST: All right. Okay, guys. Let's make an appointment. There's that release document for you to sign out there. I think either of you can sign it. I just modified it. They sent us a generic one and I modified it to make it more specific so the release is only for the transcription usage. They had kind of a broad release and I didn't think that was necessary. [01:15:02]

MOTHER: Now would you mind — and I forgot this time — but would you mind if I tape the sessions because I have a bad memory and I'm a bad note taker? (chuckles)

THERAPIST: Or, since we happen to be recording them, why don't I just send you the file? That will be easy enough to do.

MOTHER: That would be great. You have a lot of good information, but I think I'm ADD myself which is why I understand him more than he thinks I do.

THERAPIST: Well the book will be pretty helpful because I cited a few of those ideas in here today. And actually, dear Kevin, buddy, if you're interested, you guys are going to have enough credit on your bill that I'll have to pay you. But if you're interested in reading my book and giving feedback, I will pay you a little credit on your bill for that because it's really designed for people with ADD. Now it's for teens and adults, but I'd be interested in your feedback; so it talks about dating and marriage and it talks about school and work and all sorts of things. [01:16:06] It's intended to be readable enough for ADD people because none of the other books ... I don't want to bring it up so ... Do you like to read at all?

CLIENT: Not really.

FATHER: I think that would be something that you would be interested in.

THERAPIST: That is my goal because I need someone who is not naturally trying to read everything; like my daughter will read the back of toothpaste if she can. She likes to read.

MOTHER: (laughs) He does not.

CLIENT: Yeah I try to stay away from reading as much as possible.

THERAPIST: But you're actually the right kind of person, I think, for that. So here are our options. The 26^th is a Saturday and I could see you on the 2^nd at 2:00.

MOTHER: We actually have one set up in two weeks from today, actually.

THERAPIST: That would really be better, wouldn't it? (laughs)

MOTHER: We made a couple there.

THERAPIST: Oh, yeah. You're in at 4:30. Great. Do you have another one after that? [01:17:03]

MOTHER: We don't.

THERAPIST: Let's just put one in.

FATHER: Bring it.

THERAPIST: Shall we just do two weeks after that on Wednesday at the same time?

MOTHER: That would be good.

FATHER: Those are good.

MOTHER: Is 4:30 good or 5:00?

FATHER: It's fine with me.

THERAPIST: I can't do 5:00, but I can do 4:30 or 5:30.

MOTHER: Okay. 4:30 would be great then.

THERAPIST: Wes was so happy to be here he showed up at 4:00.

MOTHER: I know.

THERAPIST: I think I have your t-shirt. I might have one in Ruth's office.

FATHER: I'm going to have to bribe you and bring you another one.

THERAPIST: Well I think if I don't have it, the one that I had here had reached the point where I used it to paint in, so that wouldn't be as good. I was somewhere and had it on and somebody commented to me that they worked for you.

FATHER: Oh.

MOTHER: Well thank you very much.

THERAPIST: All right. Kevin, I appreciate your participation today.

CLIENT: Thank you.

THERAPIST: Take care, guys. Thank you. See you later. That document; tell her it's in the printer.

END TRANSCRIPT