TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: I feel like I have a buzzing inside of my head. I've had a cold for the past week and so now I just feel congested and I feel like there's sort of that post-cold feeling and also it's warm today so maybe I'm just feeling this weird sort of droning like I can't ear correctly or something. It feels like a blah day. It's one of those days where I just don't want to come here, I don't want to go to class. I just don't have much motivation and I just feel like sleeping, you know? So I'm here. [00:01:05]

THERAPIST: You didn't want to come, huh?

CLIENT: Well, I didn't want to come here or go to go to class. I lacked the enthusiasm. So I don't know. I'm here. (sniggers) The whole thing with Barbara was resolved. It turns out she was this guessing game trying to figure out what the hell is going on so she was mad because she actually wanted to go out to dinner because she thinks we never go out. Since I was at the concert, we couldn't go out. It was sort of a last-minute thing anyway, so I didn't fight it. I thought that if that's what it is and she seems to have been satisfied with me being on the futon for two nights or three nights I forget how many being banished for a bit, if that seems to have been my penance, then fine. [00:02:14] So I still feel, or at the time, now I don't feel much of anything, but at the time I felt like I'm not sure if it's satisfactory and I kind of miss the little room because it was like having a little studio (chuckles) for a bit, where I could sort of be away for a bit. Then I thought, "Oh, it's over. I guess I have to go back."

THERAPIST: Move back to the old place?

CLIENT: It's done. Exactly. It's done. Rather than protract it, though, and have it escalate, instead of saying it's not really solved, I said I'll just remember this not in a grudge way, not in a not-forgive way, but just sort of notched away as a trigger and a reaction and her traditions in this instance and just be mindful. [00:03:26] So when we had another because this is like a week later it was Saturday originally. We wanted the air conditioner out of the bedroom so she was gone and I just took the air conditioner out and set it on some stools in the kitchen because I need her help actually navigating down the spiral staircase to get to the basement so I don't fall over; so I need her at the end to guide me to make sure my feet don't because I can't see my feet with the air conditioner in my hands. Anyway. So we're getting down there and somehow there was a contretemps and I (chuckles)... all right. Let's just nip this in the bud. You are mad at me for some reason. Let's not let it escalate. Just tell me what it is right now and I will tell you why I'm mad at you. Let's just be very clear about this so it doesn't escalate. And I forget why she was mad at me and I forget why I was mad at her. [00:04:36]

THERAPIST: But it cleared the air?

CLIENT: It cleared the air. She's mad at a thing but she takes it out on me, which I'm always very careful. You can't generalize. You can't take something up there and put it on me. You can't fight and start speaking globally like "we never do anything." We never do anything? In the course of a month we went and saw a concert and a play.

THERAPIST: Yeah, that's what I kind of recall you guys going out. [00:05:28]

CLIENT: Yeah, so things are amicable now and that's good. But I see things a bit differently now just because of that experience, so I'm looking for things beneath the surface more than usual in an effort to prevent her going off the handle.

THERAPIST: What did you make of our talk last week and bringing up the whole kind of...?

CLIENT: Yeah, I think it's absolutely accurate. I think that's all underneath the surface and that's very real; but she seems quite happy to just sort of pin it on looking forward to going out and then us not going out and then being mad and then saying "we never go out." [00:06:44] So it's like, "All right. We'll try to go out more," (chuckles) even though... Okay. That's fine. I will try to correct her internal source of [...] (inaudible at 00:07:06). Today she's off with this woman, who's visiting from Europe and staying with Stephanie. Stephanie is in meltdown mode because she was head over heels for this guy. They'd been seeing each other non-stop for four months and then she broke up with him, which is unusual because she usually gets broken up with. That's sort of the rule. [00:07:39] It's like she burns people out. She's so into it and she's outgoing, so she just talks and talks and talks. I can see a person getting exhausted. But apparently this guy kind of passed out on his boat because he was drinking. Apparently he's been in rehab five times so she's like, "I can't deal with someone who's an inveterate alcoholic. So she said teary, teary, teary this is Barbara because they went out on Friday night and the woman is staying there so, apparently, the woman is upset because Stephanie is not being a good host and is quite upset. So Barbara is just sort of babysitting the woman so she can get out of the house. Barbara told her she has no chutzpah. [00:08:37]

THERAPIST: Picking up the slack.

CLIENT: Picking up the slack. I went and picked her up at noon from Stephanie's, took her back. They took off. I feel like today has just been a total waste. That's how I feel. I woke up, I did some math, but I was feeling kind of foggy. It's a nice day. I thought that it shouldn't have anything to do with it being a nice day, but I haven't been working out because I've been sick, so I thought about going to the gym. Normally you go to the gym and, no matter how your day has been going, you go and you feel that satisfaction having ridden a bike for a half-hour, lifted weights or something; and there's a routine. [00:09:32] You know what you're going to do when you go to the gym because, when you go six days a week, you have a system. So today is the chest or the triceps or it's the back or arms. Biking today or running or jogging today. Whatever. So I feel out of that. It's Katie's birthday, so yesterday we went and found a present and that had to be wrapped up and mailed, so then we wrapped this thing up and that's no big deal, but even that's sort of out of the usual. (sniggers) All of a sudden it's like I have to wrap this thing and take it to the post office. It's like I don't want to wrap it and I don't want to go to the post office, but it has to be done so I feel like I haven't studied, haven't done much of anything. Patriots lost abysmally. That probably affects me in some way because usually you can count on... [00:10:40]

THERAPIST: Out of the routine, right?

CLIENT: Yeah, that's totally out of the routine. It's like Brady's not playing well in the fourth quarter? The secondary is really that bad? Are you kidding me? It's weird. It's strange seeing the team not being the best for the first time in ten years. (pause)

THERAPIST: I was thinking, though, that the place that felt the best would be at home or in bed or something like that. Is that right?

CLIENT: Well, I don't know. It's not that I don't want to be home necessarily. I guess so. But then you get bummed out if you're at home, especially if it's really nice out, and I didn't want to be in bed I just wanted to be... I don't know what I want. I simply want to have energy is what I want. [00:11:39] And I got plenty of sleep last night, so I'm chalking some of this up to just getting over a cold and being sort of laid out from that. (pause) My mom's birthday is on the 19th. Katie's is on the 25rd, so I got mom a card and that's already sent. I don't know. I did that on Thursday or Friday, so that's fine. [00:12:39] We sent Katie's thing today and that's good, so that will arrive there long before her birthday. There is a feeling that I didn't get my mom anything. I usually don't, I just send her a card. But then Katie is getting a present because she's turning 15. That's a bummer. I should get my mom something. Well then I think that it's too late unless I go to Amazon and have it sent today, you know? So there's that feeling of like, "Huh. That's a bummer. Why didn't I get my mom anything? Why don't I ever get them anything? I just get them cards." It's going to be Christmas when I get back. I have a feeling like I'm never there for their birthdays ever. It's just an effort. If you're there it seems like a natural thing to do, right? They're there so you get something. But when you live far away it's like everything takes forethought because you have to send it, as opposed to being spontaneous or genuine. [00:13:44] It's not as fun. Of course it's genuine, but you know. I'm never there for birthday cake on the day never. So all this sending things is always like it's doing the right thing, even if you don't feel it at the time you have to feel it ahead of time. You have to be feeling their birthdays a week before. I guess I don't like going to the post office; (sniggers) and I don't know why that is. (pause) [00:14:43]

THERAPIST: I think it's an important thing, though, to look at because what's coming to mind is the times that you've talked about the days when you feel less up for coming in or actually days when I find that you're more tired or feeling a bit off or maybe down in some way. And I wonder if this is the case today, too, but I was thinking in some way you don't have the right energy for this. I was thinking that sometimes you feel like when we follow that out there's something about you feeling that it would be a drag on me, too, that in some way you would think, "Hey, what are we doing here with this time?" And you're not putting in the effort or energy or something. I'm just hearing that thread and, "I can't come up with the right energy and the feeling to come up with the birthday, the gift or the card. I'm not in that mood. I don't want to do it." [00:15:44]

CLIENT: That's interesting because here the point is I come in and talk, whereas if this were not a Monday then I would think, "I don't really have to talk to anybody and as long as I'm pleasant enough to Barbara and do what I need to do..." be it making cuscus or whatever for dinner tonight, I can just slow down. I can just do math more slowly, I can just listen to sports radio, I can sort of think, "Well, it's one of those days. I can..." You know. [00:16:42] But coming here, there's a sense of, "Well, whether I want to or not, I have to somehow think about something." And I'm aware of the fact that it's taking place in real time you're here so it's not like you can sort of fast-forward and [...] (inaudible at 00:17:06) or fast forward this whole thing and then when I have more energy next time, it will be fine. No, this is in real time so I have the sense of, "I don't know what I'm doing. I'm not really bringing much to the table. I'm boring myself." (pause) [00:17:45] It's one of those things where if I had to go to class, I would just sort of sit there and think, "Well, I'm not totally engaged right now. I'll just sort of sit and whatever happens will stick in my brain. It will stick and I'll try to write down a few notes just so I have a memory of what's going on and then I'll read it tomorrow when I'm feeling more energetic and I'll figure it out then." because you can't not go to class. You can't not come here or anything, so it's really... but in here, you can't sit in the back of the class because I'm sitting on this couch. If you were lecturing I would just sit and listen to it. I don't have to respond to it. I have to lecture myself; I'm doing the talking. [00:18:35]

if I had to teach today I would get it together. That's actually a trigger for being happy in a way because I enjoy it. I'd never not enjoy it because I like connecting with people in that way and it's an opportunity to connect. I know I do that well. People are always really impressed and happy and they often say, "This is the best class we've ever had," and that makes me feel good. Last week I went out and was teaching and this one woman was like, "You're so good. You're so good. You're such a good teacher. This is absolutely the best class. I really feel like I learned not just about this, but just about how to think about things." And I thought, "Wow." [00:19:43] You know, that's amazing when all you're doing is just teaching CPR, right? Someone actually feels like they learned to think differently. That feels good. So I feel like for doing that I can rise to the occasion because I know what I'm doing and I have a track record for having success at it; whereas here I feel like, "Well, it's new every time in a way because it's whatever just pops into my brain." (pause) Math is something like ugh. It's never easy, even though I've studied ahead and I know what he's going to talk about tonight. I've already done... (chuckles) I've already worked ahead two chapters. I know what he's going to do. I get it. I'm still prepared for the fact that I'm going to be sitting there going, "Huh?" even though I already know it. So I'm like, "Oh, brother." I'm looking at two hours of feeling like, "I get it," and I'm going to be sitting there. [00:21:08]

THERAPIST: You're going to be sitting there and...?

CLIENT: With a group of people who also already know it not because they studied ahead, but because they teach math. (chuckles) They have degrees in mathematics, right? So I'm the guy who doesn't have the math background and I keep putting myself in these classes where I'm trying to learn more. Half of my class is engineers, so they already have in them from deep down this math bias and this math training, which is fine. [00:22:00] That's good, but it means I can't sort of show up and feel like, "All right. I know a little bit more," or somehow I just feel like I'm always the one who's playing catch-up because, intellectually, other people in the class really do know more. That's a fact regarding math; and there's a reason I didn't do math earlier on and there's a reason that they did do math. So I feel like, "Okay, I'm in a class with math people; but I'm not a math person and yet I want to do math for some reason." Anyway, I do well and I'm motivated and I do math my own way and so my homework is almost three times because I write out everything longhand and I have paragraphs for something that other people just write in a simple sort of math statement. I explain it, so I feel like I'm a verbal person doing mathematics so I can kind of picture this and I don't just see a math statement as being at all satisfactory. [00:23:10] It's true, I get it; but just to write it down doesn't help me or it doesn't help the person who is trying to learn it if I'm teaching a class. All my homework is as if I am teaching a class how to do all the work, so I always give many examples. It could be in this way. It could have been done that way. And my teacher is like, "You've got to be more concise." And I'm like, "Well, I can't because I'm teaching it to myself (chuckles) and I'm redoing it as if I was teaching it to somebody else; and I'm not happy just doing it out efficiently in symbols." It's like every step of the logic has to be explained. [00:23:56]

THERAPIST: It does seem that what you're pursuing is I was thinking both the math and then teaching that you're pursuing a way of feeling good. As you said, it sounds like what kind of rallies you if you were teaching a class today would be that you're going to walk out of there feeling like, "God, yeah. I feel exactly in one way exactly what I want to feel good about myself. I feel like I'm doing something right." You won't have that feeling in the math class sometimes. I was thinking though, too, last time you were here we were talking about some way I think we got pretty deep into it some way in which you feel like you're not doing that at all with Barbara; some way in which we were talking about how much you're providing and all that stuff, and it makes you feel the exact opposite of that. [00:25:14]

CLIENT: Yeah. It is.

THERAPIST: And the energy I was imagining, too, would just go with it.

(long pause) [00:26:55]

CLIENT: Last week this just popped into my head. I'm thinking (pause) there is this distinction when I'm teaching I'm really out there in the world. I'm taking knowledge and verbalizing it. When I'm doing math I'm confronted with my own way of thinking, and it's entirely interior; and yet every Saturday Sarah, Carrie (sp?) and I meet. We usually meet from 9:00 to 4:00, so it's a full day at the science center. We just go through our homework. Even though we've already done it, we just go through it. We write every problem on the board. [00:27:51] When you're on your own, when you get bored or you start losing interest, you just stop and do something different. When you're with a group and just go on and on, it takes energy to sort of see how they go about doing things. It takes energy actually being with people. Also I feel like when I'm on my own, I'm doing reading, I'm doing thinking, I'm doing problems, I'm sort of crafting things; but now I'm doing it there and I find it really valuable because it's a good thing to do, to be able to verbalize this stuff. But there is a sense, too, that if were on my own and they weren't here I would just stop and do something different. But they're there so what that means is that there are periods of time where I'm just sort of not fully with it and they are working. I'm sure it must happen for them where I'm just more into it and they're less into it. [00:28:57]

When I'm not fully into it, then it becomes me as a sort of observer and it's easier to get confused when they're writing a proof on the board because I'm not totally committed to it. Then there's that feeling like, "I did this problem. I know how to do it, but right now I don't know how to do it. I'm watching Carrie write it up on the board but I don't get it because I'm losing interest." I'm thinking about what I can do next. I'm tired of talking about math. There's that interior feeling of doing stuff and there's doing it in public with people. And it goes on and on. You're in a small room and dealing with a chalkboard. There's no dry-erase board. There's something unpleasant in some way about chalk. We have all this great colored chalk because I believe in colors on the board, but dry erase is better. (pause) [00:30:14]

I'm thinking about Whole Foods yesterday. We went to Whole Foods. There's someone at the gym who I've always taken notice of because she's really attractive and because she's really good. She's a really good athlete and she's just "there." She in great shape, really attractive and she has this thing that she does. You can tell that she must have been an athlete or is an athlete. So yesterday at Whole Foods, she's not wearing her tights and her running top and she's wearing her glasses. I didn't know she needed glasses. She's wearing glasses and she's wearing these maroon sweatpants and she's wearing a cast one of those walking boots on one leg. [00:31:12] She's wearing this big, blue sweatshirt and she has her grocery cart full of vegetables and fruit and so forth. I'd expect nothing less. Of course she'd have fruit and vegetables. It would have surprised me greatly if she had Oreos in there or the food equivalent. I'm with Barbara. Normally I would be very social and be like, "Wow. What happened?" but I was deliberately not making eye contact or saying anything to her. I've never spoken with her. Here I am at Whole Foods and we have to recognize each other because we're always at the gym at the same time. Anyway, that's sort of an inner-life, outer-world sort of thing. Barbara has no idea who this person is because Barbara often has no clue who people are, which is amazing to me. [00:32:16]

THERAPIST: What did you say?

CLIENT: Barbara often has no idea who people are, in the sense that she doesn't recognize people.

THERAPIST: Like if she were in the same situation she wouldn't recognize a person from the gym. Is that it?

CLIENT: She must recognize this person because she's also there, but Barbara didn't say anything.

THERAPIST: Barbara goes, too, is that what you're saying?

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. No, no, no. This woman, whoever she is, is often at the gym when I'm at the gym, but sometimes that means when Barbara and I are also at the gym. What I'm saying is that Barbara is likely to recognize this person or should.

THERAPIST: Just as easily as you would?

CLIENT: Just as easily, almost as easily.

THERAPIST: I got it. But she wouldn't...?

CLIENT: She doesn't. That's just going to create weirdness if I'm like, "Hey," so I'm like, "Oh, brother." So I have to go around Whole Foods pretending I don't know this person; and I know she knows who I am because I'm a pleasant enough guy and I'm there and we're sharing the same space eight hours a week. [00:33:36]

THERAPIST: What if you had said "hi" to her? What's the fantasy of what would happen?

CLIENT: Because Barbara is always on a mission, right? So things that are off the mission seem like a distraction and she often finds me being social or something as like, "Who's that?" Or just being neighbors like I know everybody on the street. I talk about this person or that person and she goes, "Huh?" or I wave at somebody and she goes, "Who's that?" It's like she's in her own little world and I don't know if she cares to be connected with the many people around us, whether it be at the gym or on our street. Anyway. So there is that thinking "mystery woman" and there you go. [00:34:32]

THERAPIST: Because to her she'd be like, "Who are you talking to?" that kind of thing.

CLIENT: Right. That's right, not in a judging sort of way, just genuinely like, "Who is this person?" I just didn't feel like dealing with that. If I were by myself it would be easy to do, to start talking to her. So there is that. (pause) I don't know. What else is going on? Things are just sort of odd. Going to the post office is odd; being at Whole Foods with mystery woman is odd; having to talk about math every Saturday and going in and out of math consciousness is sort of like, "Ehh."; anticipating going to class and feeling "not on"; the needing to get tires for the car and tires aren't cheap. I just learned that. [00:35:41]

You hear these things, right? If you listen to sports radio you know all about tires, because they advertise a lot, right? So I go to the auto shop because I need a break light, and that's $12, which is well spent because they're very nice. They will actually put it in for you, unlike others. It's like they have to drive the car back and they charge you for a half-hour of labor. It's like give me a break. You drive in; they offer you a coffee; you buy the bulb; some guy in a white coat; "No problem, sir;" pop it in. Free, very nice. [00:36:54] So I looked at tires and it was like $850. I was like, "You've got to be kidding me." I said, "Well all right, thanks."

I'm driving along and there's a tire shop so I go in. This was Friday. So I go and they're busy. I'm sitting in the car and I'm doing my math waiting for the guy to come out. He comes out and says, "You need new tires?" and I said, "Yep," so I get out of the car. He said, "Yep. Pretty old. You can almost see the air in them." I thought, "That's pretty funny." So he's looking around and he says, "Well, I tell you, Michelin is made in heaven. You need to get Michelins. You have Michelins, you need to get Michelins." I said, "All right. Fine." [00:38:02] He goes, "We don't have these. They don't make them anymore, but now the new version of this, which is better, is called the Primus, Michelin Primus." I said, "Very good." I don't know anything about tires. (chuckles) All right, fine, whatever. We go in. Da-da-da-da. He prints this whole thing out $8200. I'm looking at it $12 disposal fee, $15 installation fee each tire comes to $60 and I'm like, "You're advertising on the radio, because this is the weekend, you buy two, you get four. This is like $50 less than the dealer. What's the big savings?" I didn't say this to him. I wasn't feeling like being [...] (inaudible at 00:38:49) so I just thought, "Well, whatever. If that's what he says it is, that's what it is." I said, "All right. Just schedule it for tomorrow morning. What time do you open?" and he said, "7:00," and I said, "Fine," all the while realizing I'm probably going to cancel this but whatever at least it's there. It's set, which I can cancel. I go down the road one block and it's BJ's. I go into BJ's; they have a tire center. [00:39:18] I go in and say, "I need some Michelin Primuses." Du-du-du-du-du. $600. I'm like, "What? What about an alignment," because the other guy said it's an extra $250 and apparently the front two tires are toed in a bit, whatever that means. I mean I know what it means but I don't know why they are. I'm not sure why things have gotten out of alignment. I guess cars will do that, even though it drives fine. He goes, "Yeah, we don't do alignment here, but at the other branch they do and that's an extra $100." I said, "Okay. Great." I drive down the road thinking, "Huh. Here I'm thinking why are they charging $200 more? For what?" So I'm driving along thinking, "What a racket. How irritating." I've got to have new tires, though. I have to have new tires. [00:40:18]

I'm driving along and I'm thinking, "I'll go to the Greek market on the way home and buy some Mizithra." I like that Greek cheese on pasta. I'm planning on going to the Greek market and then, as I'm pulling into the Greek market, I notice something right next to it that says Tires. I'm thinking, Well, that will be nice, because why do I want to go to these massive companies? I can go to an independent operative," right? Support the local economy. So I talk to the guy and I said that I need four Primuses. He said, "Okay. That's $600." I said, "All right. I also need to get an alignment. What would that run?" [00:41:19] He goes, "No, no, no. You come here to get the tire and we'll just do that," so I said, "Perfect." And I thought, "There you go. Local guy..." Anyway, that's on my mind, thinking I've got to get tires. There's no clear-cut price or rationale to why the tires cost what they cost. And then I'm thinking that I'd like to support the local guy yet the local guy had one of these crew cuts like State Troopers have like nearly bald but a little bit of tuft, a little bit of hair right there and he has tattoos? And I'm thinking that the local guy might be some Romney-supporting neo-Nazi, because he has that look. He's the local guy, but maybe I don't like the local guy. (chuckles) [00:42:23] So then I'm thinking, "Maybe I should go to somebody so they have the right politics; so I'm supporting a business that actually I'm happy for them to have the money." (chuckles) (pause) Anyway, I'm driving around in the thinking, "I know it needs new tires. It's not urgent, but before the winter comes, for sure. I'm not happy about having to buy tires." He said, "That's how it should be. It rides really well, but you can get B.F. Goodrich or Bridgestone." I forget what it is. He goes, "Those are $50 less per tire, but you'll notice the ride." I'm like, "I don't know if I'd notice it at all." I have no idea. In a Formula One, you notice the tires. They make changes per lap and that's a big part of the strategy. Yeah, tires matter in a Formula One car, but I'm thinking, "On my car really? Would I notice if it I didn't have Michelins? I don't know." He goes, "It's the same company. You have to think of it as a Toyota versus Lexus. Michelin is the Lexus and Bridgestones are of the Toyota." [00:43:55]

THERAPIST: Wait, say that again?

CLIENT: He says it's all one company, apparently; Bridgestone and Michelin or B.F. Goodrich. I forget. It's a "B" tire, but the Michelin is the Lexus and the other is the Toyota. Anyway, part of me just sort of feels like it's just another thing I don't know about. I don't have experience knowing about tires and I feel like I should know about tires, but I don't.

THERAPIST: I see, yeah.

CLIENT: Because when I went out and bought tires in the past, I don't even remember it. I just went to the mechanic I've always gone to and he'd say, "You need new tires." I'd be like, "All right, fine," then I'd be on my way home. It was like, (sniggers) "Gee, I've probably only had to buy tires once in my life." [00:44:51]

THERAPIST: But it put you in this kind of state where you're like, "I don't know who to listen to. I don't know whom to trust here. Who am I taking advice from?" And feeling yourself, I guess in some way, out of sorts because you don't know. You don't know the material yourself.

CLIENT: Yeah, I don't know it. I don't know about tread. I don't know about brands. Should I go online print off prices and then show up at someplace and say, "This is what it costs. This is what I want it done for," because this thing is irritating. So after I found out that, in fact, I could get it done for $600 four new tires and an alignment through Mr. Crew Cut, I then later in the day called the other and said, "I have an appointment for 7:00 in the morning but I'm going to cancel that. I was surprised. I was shopping around and three other people said you could do it for $600 or less." [00:45:57] They said, "Oh, we beat any price. Just come on in and we'll do it for that price." I said, "But what's the advantage? Why should I come to you? I came to you and you saw me as a mark and you said, ‘$850,' so, sure, you'll do it for $600 but why would I want to come to you?" He goes, "We'll do it for $600." I said, "Yeah, but what's the advantage? What are you offering that these other people don't?" So I'm getting into this thing.

They don't care, right? (chuckles) They sell gazillions of tires per year, right? Why is it there are two different prices? It's like, "We charge this, but oh if you see a better deal somewhere else, then fine." It's like come on. I don't know. Maybe in the rest of the world, in bazaars in Africa for instance, it's all about bartering and making a deal and driving the price down, and that's what you do. Here I guess I'm used to the price is the price; and all of a sudden, here, it's sort of like (chuckles) it seems very flexible when it comes to tires, which seems like they're a product like anything else. It's not like you go into Nordstrom's and say, "Well, I really like this shirt, but here, I'll give you $15 for it." It's peculiar to me. And also I don't feel like I have the knowledge to begin trying to I don't feel like I had the upper hand saying, "No, no, no. Not good enough," because I don't know what their bottom line is. Maybe there's someone who will do it for $550. I don't know what their mark-up is. Bottom line is I don't want to spend anything, but I don't want to be driving around with tires that aren't going to work in the wintertime. [00:48:11]

THERAPIST: Yeah, there's something about this kind of story that's really important because it seems to me like it's getting at another dimension of this issue of what it's like to not I was thinking about the matter of what it feels like when you don't know something in math and what kind of feeling comes over you if you're struggling to understand something and get something. And it seems to me like knowing something in math has meant a lot to you in terms of it can be an aspect or a facet of your intellect; but it also seems to me that there's something about you wondering it can make you feel kind of vulnerable in a subtle way. [00:49:19] In a subtle way like, "Yeah, I could get a job. They could screw me over. I could get hosed. There might be a much better deal out there somewhere."

CLIENT: And there is a sense, too as you're talking I'm thinking about this, too thinking there's a right way to do something, right? There is a right way when a receiver is running down the right sideline and if you're a quarterback, you turn your head so you're not called for pass interference. I'm like, "How do they not know that?" I'm not fast enough to play quarter. But if I were fast enough, I would turn my head because it seems it has to be clear, it has to be obvious in some way that if you're that talented to know when a receiver is about to catch the ball, that you have a fraction of a second where, when the person does that, just turn your head as well, just mimic it. [00:50:28] Why does the player stand there and he's like it really does. It's like they're learning-disabled in some way and I'm like, "Boy, is that strange." Every other cornerback in the NFL turns their head. Why aren't the players turning their heads? How odd. What's going on here?" and I can't understand it. Again, I don't know football. So I'm thinking, "Okay, I don't know the price of tires and I don't understand why these cornerbacks don't turn their head and why safeties are five yards from where they should be." They've been playing football their entire lives and how is it that the cornie doesn't turn his head? It's like they wait for the receiver to catch the ball and then they try to get the ball away and tackle him. [00:51:35]

They practice and practice and practice and practice. I'm thinking, "Am I missing something?" It can't be that hard. You run fast, you look at their hips, you know where they're going to turn that takes talent but if you're right with the receiver step for step, turn your head. (chuckles) And I think, "What am I missing in this equation?" I must be missing something because either it's far more complicated or something deliberate in the coaching saying, "Well, we're going to get burnt on occasion but this, in the long term, is better if they just try to keep up. Given the towel that they have, it's better just to run fast and keep up with them than try to turn and get faked out for the long pass." And yet, Seattle yesterday what seven big plays? Twenty yards or more? [00:52:35] Somehow that and tires are at the same level for me. I'm thinking, "I don't have all the information." I don't have all the information about tires. I don't have all the information about what the hell Belichick is doing with corners if they can't play corner when they're drafted in the first and second rounds. You know Pete Carroll was in the fifth and sixth round and they do admirably.

THERAPIST: They're not doing their job right or something. [00:53:22]

CLIENT: Yeah, and there has to be an explanation why tire companies do what they do and it's not transparent. There must be some rationale in terms of coaching why they aren't doing what they need to do or Belichick is scratching his head as well and is like, "I keep telling them to turn their head and they're not turning their head." It seems to me that if Belichick says, "Turn your head," they would turn their head because he doesn't tolerate people not doing their job. So I'm thinking, "What's happening here?" It's such a glaring error. Tire people know what they're doing, Belichick knows what he's doing, who am I? I'm not a tire guy. I'm not a football player. Who am I to criticize? [00:54:17] I'm just on the outside. I'm not there at the practices. I don't know. I don't know. There must be some logic in this, like in playing chess. You have to sacrifice pawns periodically for ultimately winning. Even the long term, a sixteen game season, he's teaching them how to play. For right now in the first half of the season, just keep up with the receivers. In the second half of the season, we'll deal with the turning-your-head issue. I don't know. Maybe it's a whole teaching thing. I don't know. (pause)

THERAPIST: I know we've got to stop in a minute, but I know one of the I'll just say it because it's just in the air for me and you might expand on this in some way but I was thinking about your dad and my image of him, the way you described him, it's not the complete story of your father. [00:55:16] There's like an element of your father that he's always doing the thing he's supposed to be doing, always doing the thing and the certain kind of sense that he knows what he's doing and he's doing it the right way. I was just thinking about that as an important kind of reference point for you and what it means to be a man in some way, I think. I also think about the fact that some way he kept a learning disability, kind of a possible learning disability, in the shadows. And you've mentioned sometimes you noting that sometimes he says a lot of things he claims to know but you sort of wonder if he doesn't seem to know anything about this, in particular about it. [00:56:05]

CLIENT: Then you discover later that, in fact, he is right.

THERAPIST: Is that right?

CLIENT: Then sometimes the story is like a personal memory of family stuff or friends of family, he might exaggerate. But in terms of factual stuff sometimes I feel like, "What the hell are you talking about?" and I'll say that and I'm like, "Oh, brother." Then I go and I'm looking it up and I'm like, "How in the hell did he know that?"

THERAPIST: Huh. Knowing?

CLIENT: Yeah. He's right more often than not.

THERAPIST: Yeah, yeah. (pause) [00:57:02]

CLIENT: And, like I mentioned last time, for puzzly-card things or playing solitaire, which I have never played until the last time we went up for Christmas because they were into it and so I thought, "Well, I guess I'll learn how to play." I actually got a software partner on the Mac and I'm sitting there thinking, "I don't know what's so great about this. Really. This is not exciting." But then I sort of, realizing that I couldn't win all the time, I just sort of thought that as long as you were relatively intelligent, you should win. Then I'm realizing that, no, usually you don't. Then I'm watching my dad and I'm noticing that he has like a 37 percent winning percentage. Meanwhile, I'm down like eight [00:57:59] and I'm thinking, "What am I missing?" He's watching me play and he's like, "No, no. Use that one. That. That. That." "Really?" So anyway, my mom and dad have this thing where they keep track. My mom, who I think is the brains of the operation, she is consistently way behind him percentage wise. My dad is like this weird savant when it comes to playing cards. Where does this come from? There's something sort of meditative about just remembering, remembering, remembering. Last year there was a fish there. You look at a bunch of water. It's a big river. The Colorado River is really long, and yet within ten feet he's like going to fish there. [00:58:56] It's like he spends a lot of time meditating on things that, perhaps, I don't. And when you see him he's just off sort of tinkering in the garage or just staring watching NASCAR. Cars go around, cars go around, cars go around, and he gets mad at like Hendrix Motor Sports or what Junior is up to. He just kind of knows all this stuff about NASCAR and I'm just like although I watch it because it's ingrained in me but I fast forward it just for the yellows and the wrecks and the pit stops and then I'll watch the last 20 laps just to know what's happening. But I find it boring. And yet, call him and he'll know what's going on with the NFL. How he knows, I don't know. He'll talk Formula One. He's not watching the races, but he knows what's going on. When I'm around he's not sitting on the computer all of this time. It's like where is he picking up his information? [01:00:09]

THERAPIST: Yeah. I don't mean this literally, but it's almost like he'd know about tires.

CLIENT: Oh, yes. Absolutely. He'd definitely know about tires and I'm not going to talk to him about it. Absolutely he'd know about tires; and I don't talk to him about it because feel like I'll become very aware of the fact that he knows about tires and I don't.

THERAPIST: That's right. Yeah, yeah.

CLIENT: I also feel like that's a moot point because I've got to buy Michelin tires because that's what everyone says to buy.

THERAPIST: But then it kind of made you feel like, "There's something for me that means that I'm missing that kind of thing that my dad has, and that makes me a more vulnerable person in the world in some really basic sense, I guess. [01:00:55]

CLIENT: Or he might just say, "You just find the best deal you can find. It doesn't matter because they're the same tires, right?" Then it's sort of like oh, he just accepts that reality because how many tires has he bought in his life? A lot. And me, it's like that's a bummer. You just kind of find the best deal and I feel like yeah, find the best deal. I don't know. I guess I'm just used to things costing what they cost. You want an iPhone, it costs that amount no matter where you go. That's what it costs. You can look for sales about things you understand shoes and shirts and whatever, computers; although Mac's don't go on sale. [01:01:56] But tires, I don't know. Who knows. Who knows. Do you have to get them rotated? I don't know. (chuckles) It's like on my car the back pressure is different from the front pressure. It's like they're different tires. They are different tires. Front and back are different. Whatever. Out of line, but there it is. Maybe if you don't get Michelins you will notice. Anything's got to be better than what I have because the auto shop, "You can see the air in your tires," which is true. It's like racing slicks at this point. (laughs) Monday and then you'll figure out the next Monday?

THERAPIST: Yep. All right. Good enough.

END TRANSCRIPT