TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: It's one of those days where I'm just in math mode and so it feels foreign in some way to even come here, even though it's like sort of stepping out, I suppose. There is class after this and there is this sense of do you know this stuff and it is complicated. It's sort of changing the way that I look at things and it's tricky and I wish that I were not always on the edge of my knowledge. I feel when you're learning some things, which are difficult, you feel like you're always in this place of not knowing because you're learning so quickly you're always on the edge and sort of half-know something. It's not really clear if you totally know what you know and yet you're also aware of the fact that there is more to know, so you're always sort of on the edge there. That's how I arrive. I don't really know what to say, but I feel like talking about trying to sort out math issues. [00:01:35]

THERAPIST: You try to sort out math issues with me?

CLIENT: Yes. I have questions about there is this notion of relations, which is a formal [...] (inaudible at 00:01:51) term and it's not functions. It's less restrictive than that, which is simply any relation to any other thing and you just can create rules just to say it's either related or it's not; so it's flexible but peculiar. [00:02:22] What you can do is you can take a set of numbers, integers or real numbers, and partition them up completely so you have these equivalence classes. In that sense you can only divide things into even and odd, you can have the equivalence class represented by two or four or six or 5,000,004 any number; but that's the simple example. You can take any set and partition it up completely so the sets completely they do not overlap, which is an interesting principle. It's interesting, I suppose, when you think about things that are less complex or less simple simple evens and odds, but that's something more interesting, like dividing it up; dividing up a plane into all of the infinite circles, so the relation is a circle. [00:03:28] The plane can be completely described by circles or ovals or lines. You're in this realm of relational circles and you can talk about all of the circles that are and are not overlapping and completely describe a set all the numbers and so it's descriptive. Functions take input, whereas this is just like well, we've sort of created tests is this a circle or is this a non-circle? [00:04:14]

Anyway, I'm not quite clear on why this is a thing. I mean I'm still trying to figure out how it fits and what it's going to lead to because I feel like it's some sort of perimetry basic idea, being able to do partition sets. And not be downed by the idea that it's a function. No, it's just that you can completely describe [...] (inaudible at 00:05:01) based on some pattern. Yesterday, two classmates and I went around and around trying to do these proofs. It's one thing to understand what they generally do, it's another thing to actually prove these things. So often we take something this abstract and [...] (inaudible at 00:05:23) abstract. I feel like I've gone a couple of months doing math and the way I have these 20to 30-page booklets that are my homework that say less than their percent of the characters that I write are numbers. (chuckles) Will X be a member of that? What's X? Well, it's a member of R. What's R? It's just odd numbers. [00:06:05]

And it's full moon I don't know which I used to think, "That's nonsense," but I feel like it's been independently sort of told to me about my anomaly and it's like, "Oh, yeah. I feel differently." That's just the way it is. When I was working at [...] (inaudible at 00:06:32) I would sometimes express feeling off kilter and anxious; and every time I said that, Sarah would say, "It's full moon." And it's just like oh, it is a full moon.

THERAPIST: You feel a little bit off-kilter?

CLIENT: Yeah, just anxious and a little I don't know just not full of marshaled energy. Usually I'm just sort of focused on something or fixated on something; and now I feel like I'm not really getting the relations idea, and yet I've done all of this homework and I've written all of these proofs and I'm like "uh-uh-uh." I do the massive no math, and now I'm unclear as to whether I even get it. I've been e-mailing trying to explain stuff to Carrie because she's writing out this proof that isn't correct. There's a feeling of this being a long effort and I wish I just got it and I'm not feeling happy; so there is that. [00:08:20]

THERAPIST: About being on that edge of not knowing?

CLIENT: Yeah. Not having that certainty because it's all foreign. It's not easy math with just numbers. You can actually sort of compute it. There is nothing to compute. It's all abstract. (chuckles) Either you prove it or you don't. It's weird. You write these proofs using your own logic and using everything that you've learned or you think you've learned, and you try and do it correctly; but in order to critique proof, you have to use your own logic. There's a built-in problem with that because how do you know whether you're right or not? You're using the same methods to think with that you use to write the proof. So does this sort of jump off the page as being right or not? [00:09:35]

In geometry it seems to make more sense because if you're looking at something it's a little more intuitive, I suppose. Even still, you look at a geometric proof there is a sense of needing to bend your brain around. Looking at that angle you think, "Well that angle," and you have to sort of fill things around and say, "Okay, I guess if that and that and that are the same, then okay." You can look at something and still it's difficult, whereas with this there's nothing to look at. There's no picture to draw. It's just completely internal. (pause) [00:10:32]

Yesterday was just filling up the chalkboard just filling it up, filling it up, filling it up just writing proofs. It's a Sunday so the Patriots aren't playing because they played on Thursday, so it's sort of a weird day. It's like studying on Sunday as opposed to Saturday by necessity because they couldn't study on Saturday. (pause) I recorded the RedZone and I'm playing it back. I'm watching and fast-forwarding, watching and fast-forwarding the Chargers in overtime. I'm really relaxed and I'm rooting for the Chargers. It's like come on. [00:11:36]

THERAPIST: Yeah, what about that, though?

CLIENT: I was identifying. I was looking at the fans and I was looking at the stadium. It's like I know the stadium.

THERAPIST: Did I come to mind?

CLIENT: Yeah, you're rooting for the Chargers; but I'm looking at something. I know the stadium and they flashed on some kids in the crowd. They're crazy and they're all dressed in blue and gold and it's like you know, I had a blue and gold outfit when I was a kid, right? I would sit there and watch the games. When John Jefferson got traded, it was just horrible. I cried and cried. I couldn't believe it. We had beautiful weather and great green grass and that feeling of like and then looking in the end zone, it's weird how you judge things that are familiar in a way. [00:12:47] Two things stood out to me yesterday. One: the way the Chargers had written in the end zone so the H is different. It's a different color. And then the R's are swoopy underneath the letters. Looking at that I'm thinking that as a little kid I can see myself as a fourth-grader scripting it on paper, writing it up. Looking at it I'm thinking, "It's childlike." It's sort of a needless decoration. Why did they go to the powder blue? That's not the Chargers I grew up with, although then they were, perhaps, the original color. I'm looking at Norv Turner and just sort of thinking, "Huh. The people, the fans are really invested watching this team, and yet they can't really enjoy the success [...] (inaudible at 00:14:12), like a [Don Coryell] (ph?) and [Favos] (ph?), Charlie Joiner and Jefferson. [...] (inaudible at 00:14:22). They were all contenders and it was entertaining. [00:14:31] I was looking at the way the writing was in the end zone thinking, "Huh. It's not bold; it's decorative." And then I was looking at the Cardinals, because they were playing in Phoenix yesterday. On the inside of the stadium on the corridors, at the four junctions at the stadium two of which are where the teams run in there are these high triangular passageways. And on them is written "‘C' Red," so "see red." I said, "Cardinal red." I'm thinking, "Okay, it's a misuse of quotes. It's a pun. It's lame. Who likes that? Are they smart people trying to look at their audience thinking their fans like dumb puns and they like the letter C in quotes? Patriots don't do that. They don't do any puns." They have other problems, like fans not being super-excited and loud; but they're not writing "C" something or other. [00:16:27]

THERAPIST: Yeah, that and the Chargers not being bold?

CLIENT: Yeah, well it's this decorative Chargers and the "C Red" for the Cardinals and, yeah, it's struck me as being juvenile. Fireman Ed calling it quits, the Jets, so just throw in the towel. Then I was dreaming, this was Sunday noon? So it must have been around 7:00 in the morning, because I wanted to head over to school. In my dream I was holding these little baby birds and some eggs and I was on top of a very tall building. My hand was sort of over the ledge because I was trying to help them. I'm not sure how that exactly worked, but that's what I was doing. I wasn't afraid of the height, although I was aware of it. That was the feeling. I was aware of somehow needing to tend to these things. And then the alarm on the phone went off. It's this song called Boa Constrictor by Magnetic Fields. [00:17:50] In my dream I start to hear this song. It starts out very nice and it's the woman singing in my head. I hear it and I think, "Oh, Barbara's going to wake up if I don't turn it off. I have to turn off the alarm." Then I reach for the phone to turn it off and, as I do it, I'm aware that the birds are going to drop. I turn off the alarm and immediately sort of go back into dream mode and I'm aware of the fact that it's too late. The birds are gone. And then I'm just aware and sort of feeling "oh well," and then being aware of the fact that it's in my dream. Then you have this sort of feeling at times where it's like which is the real world your waking life or your dream life? [00:18:56]

THERAPIST: What do you make of it?

CLIENT: I don't know what the birds symbolize. I don't know what that is about.

THERAPIST: I'm wondering how you find yourself feeling talking to me about this the associations that you have?

CLIENT: I guess I'm aware of the fact that I'm not fully focused, meaning that if I were at some particular task, like if I were at the gym I would sit on the bike and get warmed off and watch the TVs and get into that mindset. [00:19:57] Even though if I wasn't really feeling unusually motivated, I would get my blood pumping, ride the bike and then I'd feel a little later to get up and then I'd get into weight-lifting mode; whereas here it's really akin to I don't know. It's a sort of non-committed way of thinking, like if I were in the car I'd listen to Fulcrum Mass. If I were at home, I'd be listening to the radio trying to figure out math or turn off the radio if I really needed to truly try to grasp it and feeling irritated by that; whereas when I'm here I'm not listening to the radio and I'm not doing math, although I'm thinking about math. (pause) [00:20:57]

Yesterday was the final Grand Prix for the 2012 season this year in Sao Paulo, Sao Paulo's track. That race was undecided. The champion was for the year and so Sebastian Vettel, the German, was ahead by 13 points and Fernando Alonso was in second. There were these various scenarios where, if Alonso won the race and Vettel came in seventh or worse, Alonso would win the championship. Both of them have won the championship twice. They are the two great drivers in F1, Alonso for Ferrari and Vettel for the Renault Red Bull, and the opening lap, Vettel normally is, more often than not, in the pole position. This time he was in fourth and Alonso was in eight, so basically Vettel stayed ahead and Alonso ended the race, then it's a done deal who has the championship. But opening lap Vettel gets rear-ended and now he is in last place. The car is intact, so the entire race is Vettel chasing, trying to move up to the pack and he does. [...] (inaudible at 00:22:34) in five laps and bam he's in seventh place. It's raining so the thing is do you put rain tires on or not? It's really starting to rain and you have these cars that are extraordinarily fast, but it's also the aura of Ayrton Senna and it's this old track. [00:22:57]

THERAPIST: Is it the same track he died on?

CLIENT: No. He died in Monza. It's just the aura because he's larger than life. His nephew, Bruno, is a driver. There is this sense of danger because it's a very small track and it's very up and down, unlike most tracks, which tend to be relatively level. Monaco goes up and down and Belgium goes up and down and the new track in Austin, Texas, goes up and down; then it's the Sao Paulo up and down. It's steep hills and downhills. The car is sliding and going off track and it's hard to see, especially since the camera has rain on them, so there is this sense of grey and they're racing and it really is palpable, unlike other Formula One races. Sam Posey normally he's not talking during the race. He's not one of the regular commentators, but he was talking. Just the way he expressed himself is just his voice is linked with Indy 500, so to have him talking in Formula One, I think he sticks out. It sort of heightened the notion of risk. [00:24:57] It was Schumaker's last race. Speed Network it was their last final Formula One after over 16 years, and now NBC has got the contract, which is very disappointing. So it's like it was the end of everything, right? To people who are attached to who is commenting on Formula One, it's over. And, unlike Nascar and other forms of racing, the biggest thing is who wins the championship for the entire year, right? It's the masters. It's worth $100,000,000 to the team. It's huge. And yet the rules of Formula One are that the only people on the podium are the three winners of that race and the only people you talk to are the winners of that race, so the biggest story of all was Vettel dramatically winning the championship; and yet no. It was just a fact but he's not interviewed; it's not built up; it's sort of like he won, but we're going to talk to the winner of the race. (pause) [00:26:29] There is a sense that everything seemed to be not in the shadows necessarily, but this sense of it's not hyped. As multi-million-dollar as it is, it feels understated. You have these massive companies and someone wins the championship but the rules are the rules. The commentators talk about Sebastian Vettel but nope he's not on the podium. There is the trophy, [...] (inaudible at 00:27:14) you'll see him getting it. There is no talking to him. It's almost like a footnote. [00:27:43]

I don't know. It's almost like there's something maybe connected with the Chargers or thinking back to, as a little kid watching it. Sometimes that may be at papa's house, watching the Chargers there with my dad and uncle. In the garage there are all of these trophies. This one trophy is just huge. As a kid it was almost as tall as I was. You see people get these trophies and it's odd. It seems to highlight impermanence, just the very fact that a person wins the championship and they don't interview him is just sort of like it's already... [00:28:46] What it highlights, perhaps, is this entirely internal experience, like he knows that he won. Everyone knows that he won, but it's not being outright or explicitly celebrated. It's almost like, not only do trophies get dusty, but you don't even see him get the trophy. So even in the moment, it's not really real; or even in the moment, it's already past tense. Even though there are consequences to winning, massive amounts of money and so forth, the experience is most important for the person actually driving and taking the risks. [00:29:41] And making his way from 24th to 7th to 6th to 5th and finishing, winning the championship, and having to take risks in the rain and sliding everyone is sliding and bumping into each other is phenomenal. I mean you're in the rain and you're going uphill and turning and you're doing 200 miles an hour. (pause) [00:30:18]

THERAPIST: You know what comes to mind to me? It's that last time we met I had a feeling that you were feeling very excited. I was thinking almost maybe because of the trophy triumphant in some way about how much satisfaction you've been getting from the work you've been doing; and that things seem to be coming together. You were very proud of this. It felt very good to you. And then today I get a sense that it feels quite different. I was wondering what it felt like talking with me about it and how you felt my response to you was. [00:31:35]

CLIENT: I don't know. I feel like much of what I'm expressing today is characterized by the odd, weird [huna] (ph?) that is Thanksgiving. I went to Ethan's, and yet there were like 15 people and it was a lot of fun. Everybody was funny and everything was great. It was really amusing. The food was outstanding and it was a really pleasant time. (pause) [00:32:42] It's sort of like a time away from normalcy, which maybe is a positive thing, but it feels like all of a sudden I'm out of my comfort zone, so I'm meeting people who I don't know. I'm having a good time and it's very positive, but that feeling of "but I always cook Thanksgiving dinner," and it's a big thing. I get up and Barbara would be at work because she works Thanksgivings usually, and so I do all this stuff and I have a lot of fun doing it and there is this focus to keep all the balls in the air and football is on in the background. There is familiarity even though, perhaps, it's tinged with stress or tinged with the notion that I'm not back home, but I'm focused on making a really good meal and then there is leftovers. That's the thing. [00:34:00]

So instead, I get up and I do green beans, which I've never done, but they wanted a vegetable. I offered brussel sprouts but Ethan balked. Ethan is, "Da-da-da brussel sprouts," so I researched how to make green bean casserole the night before and then I wake up and I'm sort of inspired and I just take the concepts and just do it; any particular recipe just do it. I watched Alton Brown so I was thinking about starch molecules holding onto fat molecules. I was very pleased about thinking about the chemistry of making green beans, and it turned out really well. But so I'm like, "That's done." An hour later bup-boop that's done, right? There is no turkey, no mashed potatoes, no candied yams, stuffing or any of the et cetera. So Friday morning you wake up and there is that sense of more turkey and how to think about turkey and then, over the weekend, make turkey soup and parcel it up, right? The whole thing is to make it a four-day activity, right? Like I said, Friday I wake up and it's like eggs and toast, per usual. What do we have for dinner? Salmon and couscous and this big salad. It's like Thanksgiving is done. [00:35:37]

So then Saturday, I forget I think I went over to Edna's, Barbara and I did, and that was fun. But Sunday, no football, other than fast-forwarding periodically through RedZone. Instead, just being over in a room at the science center trying to sort this stuff out. It's sort of like at my core I was that little kid watching the Chargers, but now, on a Sunday, I was not doing that. I was doing math and it was difficult, and I'm fast-forwarding through a Chargers game 3,000 miles away. (pause) So I'm not remembering your response to me liking what I was doing. I'm teaching tomorrow and on Thursday, so I'm feeling like that will be good because that will be me not doing math and it will be doing something that I enjoy and I'll be making money. I'll be thinking about how much easier it is to teach that than it is really trying to do abstract algebra. [00:37:36]

That's the thing algebra is easy. I mean it's not easy, it's always the most difficult part of any computation. It's so easy to make an algebraic mistake, but we're not doing regular algebra where it's actual numbers. It's abstract algebra so it's entirely symbolic. It feels like two different levels. On the one hand, when I'm teaching I feel very knowledgeable and I'm imparting knowledge and people always respond very well. It's always very positive, as I explained last time. The opposite feeling is this entirely internal experience of doing things that feel very difficult and it's not present tense. [00:38:42] When I teach, I'm very in the moment and am very connected to real people; whereas doing math, to be connected to an abstract idea and really connected to it, just trying to understand it, that becomes the real thing. The idea becomes the real thing, but it's not the real thing. It's not a person. It's just this confusing thing and it's sort of extended. It's this sense of there is this idea and how far does it extend? [00:39:40] Meaning what is the significance, either spiritually or philosophically, of this intellectual endeavor and the ideas in them? Even though I am convinced of the fact that there are different sizes of infinity and can contemplate that, what is its actual significance? I feel like there is one, but I don't know what it is. These abstract thoughts create needs. It's not lost in the clouds, it's just a feeling of things that are really not intuitive and thinking, "Okay, I'm thinking much more flexibly and I can convince myself logically of the fact that some infinities are larger than others." It's a very strange idea. And again, I'm just uttering that. You cannot help but think that there is some meaning, other than the math of it. It's not simply a quarantined thought like, "Sure, yeah. Some infinities are larger than others. Yeah, okay, fine, whatever." It's not okay, whatever, it's this idea that is puzzling, even though you can write up proofs and say, "Yeah, that's the case," but it's not a small idea. [00:42:07]

THERAPIST: Yeah, I guess one way that I've been thinking about our discussions here, particularly around math and what its meaning is to you, is that I feel like it's been a way for me to connect with you in some way that's deep and personal that isn't set on terms dictated by myself. It's more dictated more by your own internal experience. I was thinking very much about that being a very important thing for you. Maybe I hear a clearer sense with Barbara that there's a way that you often find yourself connecting with her world, on her terms in some way and her experience. [00:43:11] What I mean by that is like you talk about things that she'll find mutually interesting. What I think about is that I guess I think all the way back to your experience as a kid and being up in your room making the teepee and that there was something very special and personal happening in that teepee and that you were often very alone in it. I mean you were alone in it. It was your space. Some way, some experience that you were undergoing that was very private and no one entered into the teepee with you in a certain way. I think there is a way you felt very alone. [00:44:04] Obviously, in a real sense you were alone, but there was kind of a sense of people connecting with you, I know who you were in various ways; but in some deep way in that teepee. I was thinking how math was another entrance, like another way. What I feel is something deep in you is trying to bring me into it, trying to bring me in to connect with something very deep and personal in a way that you find it so easy to do; and not just the things that are important, but the anxieties that can be there. (pause) [00:45:06]

CLIENT: The thing about the teepee (pause) absolutely alone, but just in the sense of contemplation because it was like (chuckles) this sort of empty place of just being able to organize something. [00:46:03] So the imagery of it, the Hot Wheels track going around the circumference of the TV, and the little machine that I put the cars in and they don't slip around, "pshew," and then having a little space heater in the middle, which is totally dangerous. Me in my Indian costume. I'd go out and I'd get a bunch of Wonder Bread and I would sit and the cars would be going around and I'd feed them in and they would zip around and zip around. I would take the Wonder Bread and fold it in half and then in half and then in half; and there was a folding issue. There is a limit. [00:47:02] You make this little tiny thing and you keep squishing it and squishing it and squishing it; and you eat that. Or you set it onto the space heater and you toast the bread. I'm entirely self-sufficient in the sense that mom is elsewhere feeling sad, I remember. So, yeah. Creating this little I don't know if creating is the right word, just entering into this realm and it being womb-like without the imagery of wombs or the concept of that at all. Just the sense of it being this dark little space in the middle of a large, large room. And even though there are all kinds of stuff on the outside of the teepee, including lots of toys and a bed and three dogs, I was in that space. I was in the middle of a circle folding up bread; and seemingly doing it forever. [00:48:31]

Maybe this is inaccurate, but it felt like I probably did that for hours at a time it being timeless in some way the Indian outfit... which is not dissimilar, perhaps, to the feeling that I'm having now, in the sense that I'm not in the teepee and not playing with Hot Wheels, but I am contemplating circles, thinking about things being folded and wondering like I was then perhaps, playing with little metal cars if those are symbols of big cars and controlling the little cars. [00:49:46] And somehow thinking about wanting to get the little things right, somehow that that and I don't think I was thinking about making big cars correct, whatever that would mea I was thinking about the bigger world in a real sense, thinking about making this little thing perfect and contemplating how little cars are somehow different and what the issues are with why cars sometimes fall off the track and which cars would go through the machine and stay on the track and which ones wouldn't. It was sort of this high-level of contemplation. Some cars do it well and some don't. I was thinking about the (chuckles) I'm sure I was thinking about the little space heater being at the right temperature or not. It was probably the right temperature for making toast, and other times it was not; and feeling like in this little world, really contemplating all the possibilities and related to that. [00:51:08]

So the mathematician, Dedicant, he had this psychological notion of infinity, even though he did all kinds of fantastic stuff in mathematics and moved set theory forward. What he contemplated, which I thought was phenomenal, and the mathematicians criticized him roundly for this, saying he wasn't being objective, he said that if you want to think of the levels of infinity, that they can always be bigger, think about all of the thoughts that you've ever had and the objects attached to all of those thoughts everything you've seen; all of those. Imagine the fact that you can combine any particular object that you've ever seen and any thought you've ever had in a unique way, which creates sort of infinity if you take any of the millions and millions of things ideas and objects we've contemplated, feelings we've had and just juxtapose them. [00:52:18] Well, it's a new thing and we have the feeling of that thing being truly new because all of a sudden it's like huh, that's surprising, even though usually the things that surprise us, the objects are not different, it's just that their juxtaposition is unusual and it sort of catches our eye. Then, whatever that idea is, make that the new object; and then you can think of that, and you can think of thinking about it, and you can think about thinking about it. Therefore, psychologically, you create a first order infinity of all the objects; a second order of infinity, all the combinations of all of those thoughts and objects; a third order, the thought about any particular order; and a fourth order, the contemplation of that contemplation, and a contemplation of those things. So even though it's confined to our own human conception, we have this sense that we are, on the one hand, trapped, but we're trapped with the weight of our own infinity. [00:53:32]

In fact, they didn't write that, that's my own sort of gloss on it. That's how I feel about it the weight of it because it's obvious that he was just trying to convey infinity, and he was criticized for it. But I find it absolutely true, that sense that we are, on the one hand, stuck; but in that stucked-ness we can create new feelings and new ideas if we allow ourselves the imagination to somehow make different arrangements. [00:54:38] Of all the things in the world we can make different arrangements. And even though things aren't necessarily novel, how we feel towards them might be, how we arrange them, how we react to them might be; and yet, we have the set of all optics, a set of all ideas, a set of all experience. Just like in the thing about a bar graph, and I was talking to Ethan about this, you can make a bar graph of all the knowledge in the world. Individuals are their own knowledge is miniscule compared to all the knowledge. So you can take someone like Einstein, the 1930's Einstein, at the time, maybe he knew ten times as much as the average person, so he's ten times higher; and yet compared to all of the knowledge that exists, next to nothing. [00:55:46]

We're all next to nothing compared to all of the knowledge that exists. I'm not talking about mathematics or physics, necessarily, but what did he know about making [tea consala] (ph?) in Calcutta and how to run a restaurant there. I mean, he could probably figure it out, but he didn't have personal experience with it, so that's out of his experience. We live in a world where we are surrounded by infinity and I think, "Okay, well, there are lots of experiences that are common." [00:56:38] I'm sure a French filmist has done this and everybody would say he's not novel. I think it's the Seventh Samurai. Who knows. [00:56:50] There is the Rashomon effect, just this notion of multiple subjectivities and realizing that we're kind of stuck with that fact and, yet, we have our own, so we realize that we contemplate an abstract size of infinity; and yet be very particular in the moment. [00:57:30] I a single moment, tomorrow, I will be teaching. That's a very real thing. That is a real instantiation of gospel stories, I guess. When you really have traction and are really connecting, it's less fearsome because you're not contemplating all of it at once, you're enacting something, and legitimately so, so you're embodying something. You're holding onto something. [00:58:27]

There is a notion of equivalence relations that talks about classes of things and how numbers can be partitioned, but it's the idea that if a class has any element in common with another class then, by proof, they have to be identical; so things either are completely separate and share nothing, or they share everything. There is no in between. Either they are identical in every way or they are completely separate in every way. It's completely erratic (ph?). They sit right next to each other different and different and yet, if one molecule whatever; this notion of they either share everything or nothing. [00:59:21] It's weird how in life there's something binary about an experience like that. Either you can be completely on the outside or have the feeling of being completely on the inside in a body; and it can be jarring moving from one to the other. We can be alone and in contemplation versus actually standing in front of a group of people and teaching and connecting with them, two very different things. [00:59:47]

THERAPIST: Yeah, inside the teepee or outside.

CLIENT: Humph. Interesting?

THERAPIST: All right, next week. I want to give you my plans for the holiday. Both Christmas Eve and New Year's Eve fall on Mondays. I'm taking the week of Christmas entirely off and then I'm back on Wednesday, January 2nd, so I don't know if you have your plans lined up yet, but hopefully we can figure something out if you're going to be around that week.

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