TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

THERAPIST: My allergies are bugging me.

(Pause): [00:00:18 00:00:32]

CLIENT: There was this guy, from high school who like asked me out to dinner and he's two years older and I rejected him but felt a lot of affection towards him and decided to have the conversation where I rejected him apparently during one of the worst allergy days that spring. He was very off because he had taken too much Benadryl.

THERAPIST: Laughs.

CLIENT: And he was so embarrassed and it was really memorable.

(Pause): [00:01:28 00:01:42]

CLIENT: Did you drive home on Thursday after I left? Was that bad?

(Pause): [00:01:48 00:01:57]

THERAPIST: No.

(Pause): [00:01:57 00:02:05]

CLIENT: (Unclear) driving home. (Unclear) too far to drive. It didn't cross my mind not to if it had it would have been better for me to have (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:02:17 00:02:38]

CLIENT: (inaudible)

(Pause): [00:02:42 [00:02:56]

CLIENT: You seem very surprised that I think about you getting some (inaudible) from me.

(Pause): [00:03:15 00:03:41]

THERAPIST: I guess (unclear) partly because

(Pause): [00:03:56 00:04:04]

THERAPIST: part of the gist of the fantasy was like, okay, let's imagine something happens so the boundaries are not the same.

CLIENT: Yeah. I think I thought that's surprising because it's not really true. Like the terminal illness part in the fantasy isn't very real because I don't think that would work the way it does in fantasy.

(Pause): [00:04:35 00:04:39]

CLIENT: I started to imagine like you collapsing in here and what that would be like what I'd do and how you'd (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:05:11 00:06:09]

THERAPIST: The roles, they can be very (unclear).

(Pause): [00:06:17 00:06:20]

CLIENT: Yeah, the care taking/caretaker (inaudible) are (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:06:24 00:06:50]

CLIENT: It's hard to nurture (unclear) and (unclear) sometimes.

(Pause): [00:07:01 00:07:06]

CLIENT: I think.

(Pause): [00:07:06 00:07:16]

CLIENT: So you think that this might be a bridge between like my mourning my childhood and my motherhood?

THERAPIST: I think that may be a (unclear) what's going on.

(Pause): [00:07:37 00:07:53]

CLIENT: Yeah, I think so.

(Pause): [00:07:54 00:08:00]

CLIENT: I don't have fantasies about you leaving. My parents would have fantasies about you leaving (unclear).

(Pause): [00:08:08 00:09:54]

CLIENT: I don't think it's that hard to nurture you. I think it's just like slowed down a whole lot.

THERAPIST: Good.

(Pause): [00:09:59 00:10:10]

CLIENT: Like it happens to happen so, in such small ways infrequently. But it's building.

(Pause): [00:10:32 00:10:39]

CLIENT: So like this direction, no this direction is like on a much slower track than the -

THERAPIST: (Unclear) uh huh [yes].

(Pause): [00:10:57 00:11:01]

CLIENT: So if you don't compare them then they both are easier to handle.

(Pause): [00:11:12 00:12:29]

THERAPIST: I guess I'm -

(Pause): [00:12:31 00:12:35]

THERAPIST: talking about is what are some of the things that are for you in taking care me?

CLIENT: Expecting gratitude (Pause) for things that (unclear).

(Pause): [00:13:02 00:13:24]

CLIENT: I don't know. Just a bunch of stuff that I have pointed out.

(Pause): [00:13:26 00:13:39]

CLIENT: (inaudible) instead of playing them out (unclear) nurturing for some reason.

(Pause): [00:13:43 00:13:52]

CLIENT: (inaudible) about and all of these things feel like they're nurturing me, too. Like it holds you.

(Pause): [00:14:15 00:14:20]

THERAPIST: Sure.

(Pause): [00:14:21 00:14:34]

CLIENT: Other reflections on what you do.

(Pause): [00:14:35 00:14:44]

CLIENT: And then just like my appetite for you right now is so voracious that that itself feels like it holds you in some way. Maybe not like against your will or not in a way that you've chosen, but -

(Pause): [00:15:09 00:15:27]

THERAPIST: What what kinds of things have you been thinking outside of here (Pause) for the last few days?

(Pause): [00:15:33 00:15:43]

CLIENT: It's almost like 'what kinds of things have I not been thinking about.' (inaudible)

(Pause): [00:15:52 00:15:59]

CLIENT: It's like the fantasy dream I was always (unclear) (Pause) which is always like growing and growing, evolving and affecting me and not affecting me. There's a certain point between sessions where I switch from thinking about what happened the last session to fantasizing about the next session and I almost always know like based on how I'm feeling where I'm going to fit. It's not like that I choose it but in the fantasy -

THERAPIST: It becomes clearer.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Like last session that session was like a (unclear) in my head.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: I think it makes sense.

(Pause): [00:17:01 00:17:10]

THERAPIST: Yeah, I mean my decisions were to like -

(Pause): [00:17:14 00:17:29]

THERAPIST: you're feeling hurt and angry about that I'm treating you like a patient (inaudible) thoughts.

CLIENT: Yeah.

(Pause): [00:17:40 [00:17:44]

CLIENT: It's like, fine, (unclear) a patient, I will be a patient.

(Pause): [00:17:46 00:18:00]

CLIENT: I think that association is more mine than it is an assumption about what other people do.

THERAPIST: Yeah. (Pause) (Unclear) up to you than about.

CLIENT: Before the last session I had in mind while masturbating.

(Pause): [00:18:36 00:18:41]

CLIENT: And it was good but it was slow and it took me a long time. We also ended up crying in my fantasy both of us because we were hurting (unclear) people.

(Pause): [00:19:01 00:19:12]

CLIENT: The details feel (unclear).

THERAPIST: (Unclear) about that.

CLIENT: I can imagine like -

(Pause): [00:19:23 00:19:31]

CLIENT: (Unclear) it's really detailed.

(Pause): [00:19:31 00:19:48]

CLIENT: I don't know why it's important to imagine the really detailed things about intercourse or -

(Pause): [00:19:56 00:20:10]

CLIENT: like as opposed to like -

(Pause): [00:20:10 00:20:21]

CLIENT: coming up behind you and putting my arms around you and like being nose to nose and holding your head and like kissing all the different parts of your head and your face and -

(Pause): [00:20:48 00:21:02]

CLIENT: I guess it's clearer here than when I'm not here. Sorry.

THERAPIST: (inaudible)

(Pause): [00:21:02 00:21:30]

THERAPIST: You mean it feels foggier when you're here?

CLIENT: No. It feels clearer in here.

THERAPIST: I see.

(Pause): [00:21:35 00:21:48]

THERAPIST: I imagine like, imagine in a way reassuring when I'm (unclear).

(Pause): [00:21:53] [00:22:04]

CLIENT: Yeah, if you're being reassuring.

(Pause): [00:22:06 00:22:12]

CLIENT: It's not just reassuring that you're here but (unclear).

(Pause): [00:22:18 00:22:30]

THERAPIST: Like that (inaudible) me.

(Pause): [00:22:31 00:23:42]

THERAPIST: You look like you're thinking more about it.

CLIENT: I am.

(Pause): [00:23:46 00:23:52]

THERAPIST: (Unclear) talk about?

CLIENT: Yeah.

(Pause): [00:23:54 00:24:02]

CLIENT: But that you were (unclear) -

(Pause): [00:24:07 00:24:38]

CLIENT: I think you're very good with your hands.

(Pause): [00:24:39 00:25:29]

CLIENT: Because they (unclear) in charge.

(Pause): [00:25:27 00:25:48]

THERAPIST: (Unclear) feels like I'm in charge?

CLIENT: Um hmm [yes]. Earlier it feels like I'm in charge.

(Pause): [00:25:48 00:26:13]

THERAPIST: I'm not surprised at the way (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:26:18 00:26:44]

CLIENT: Like all these things they are just layers and layers and layers that don't that make me like not make it hard to like know or imagine what else happens like how you smell and what you're saying and what (unclear) you're (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:27:14 00:27:21]

CLIENT: I think there's a (unclear) like savoring it but (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:27:24 00:27:33]

CLIENT: Yeah, that makes it very, very slow then.

(Pause): [00:27:38 00:28:00]

CLIENT: Like if your hands are right between my butt and my lower back they stay there for hours.

(Pause): [00:28:06 00:28:17]

CLIENT: Or they feel like, it feels like it could.

(Pause): [00:28:19 00:28:24]

CLIENT: And maybe they move to my thighs and stay there, too.

(Pause): [00:28:28 00:28:36]

THERAPIST: Does that mean (unclear)?

(Pause): [00:28:36 00:29:07]

CLIENT: Maybe if there were parts of my body that attract you more than others.

(Pause): [00:29:10 00:29:28]

THERAPIST: (inaudible)

(Pause): [00:29:28 00:29:34]

CLIENT: (inaudible)

(Pause): [00:29:36 00:29:44]

THERAPIST: I say that to my wife and she -

CLIENT: Do you use it too much (unclear)?

THERAPIST: (Laughs)

(Pause): [00:29:53 00:30:09]

CLIENT: I guess the things that come to mind are it's hard to start to have, start to take baths and picture just the thought of my lower (unclear) first and foremost.

(Pause): [00:30:31 00:30:36]

CLIENT: And then (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:30:37 00:30:46]

CLIENT: But over the course of the years it's been (inaudible).

(Pause): [00:30:49 00:31:13]

THERAPIST: That's not a good I'm glad that you didn't entirely desire to (unclear).

(Pause): [00:31:13 00:31:26]

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: (inaudible)

(Pause): [00:31:29 00:31:32]

CLIENT: This concert would be the African drummers, would be incredible as they are so talented and it's the story like if you were born in West Africa you will have a sense of rhythm by the time you are four months old. And (unclear) and there are four brothers and they understood each other so well and were so jolly and there is a full house and people really liked it. It feels very ridiculous but they were completely obsessed with me in a way that feels very familiar with black men. We had to rehearsals with them and then a kind of long, several hours before the concert, and then the concert, and then after the concert and over the course of that time like by the end of the second rehearsal, the four brothers and their manager which is also a musician and this other guy who told me he was their brother, but he's not. And the manager, the other guy the head brother (unclear) the three of them at various times -

(Pause): [00:33:16 00:33:29]

CLIENT: like told me that I'm like the sexiest woman in the whole world, especially when I'm playing an instrument. And he wanted me to record on this thing that he's doing with (unclear) musicians. And he had this whole thing about how he can tell that my spirit is like is in line with like the good things and in line with what he (unclear). And then they all wanted like separate pictures of me and I don't know, said a bunch of stuff that I didn't understand. And then they asked me to (unclear) a little bit of (unclear) and then (unclear). And the manager, (unclear) was just like so worried about it and so smitten and he told Jeremy like, 'I'm going to say this because I've learned to just say things, like this is the most beautiful woman, or like something like that, the sexiest and most beautiful woman and Jeremy was like so psyched he was like, 'I agree,' and I was just, I felt like I was being a little bit tossed around but it was I could handle everything.

(Pause): [00:35:35 00:35:54]

THERAPIST: I get a sense that you do not feel kind of turned in a (unclear) way, it put you in a pretty passive role.

CLIENT: Yeah, like I couldn't understand most of what they were saying so there's a bunch of stuff that I didn't know about and yeah it was like, okay, now you take a picture with me, now you take a picture with me but I was happy to do it. Yeah.

(Pause): [00:36:35 00:37:11]

THERAPIST: You know I get the sense that you (unclear).

CLIENT: Um hmm [yes].

(Pause): [00:37:13 00:37:17]

CLIENT: Yeah, (unclear) felt pretty special.

THERAPIST: Yeah. But it didn't like need to have it make it kind of like a thing (unclear).

(Pause): [00:37:28 00:38:06]

CLIENT: And they watched me a lot when I was dancing with Ben.

THERAPIST: His what?

CLIENT: With Jeremy.

THERAPIST: You were dancing?

CLIENT: I was dancing almost the entire time that I wasn't playing. What?

(Pause): [00:38:27 00:38:46]

THERAPIST: I guess as one of the musicians, I wouldn't have imagined you'd be dancing. Of course I can't picture you dancing, but am surprised that you would be dancing in general but I guess I wouldn't have thought of it in that you were also playing.

CLIENT: Yeah, it was an incredibly long concert. I played (unclear). It was like three hours long. They, just the four of them, played for another (unclear) and then I began playing with them for the last three.

THERAPIST: I see.

(Pause): [00:39:27 00:39:30]

THERAPIST: Where was it?

CLIENT: The concert?

THERAPIST: Where was it?

CLIENT: It was at in the yard which is the graduate students' like house and a big, kind of grand dining room where (unclear) lots of different things.

(Pause): [00:39:55 [00:40:06]

CLIENT: Yeah, it was nice that so many people came.

(Pause): [00:40:06 00:40:18]

THERAPIST: That's great.

(Pause): [00:40:18 00:40:27]

CLIENT: And I'm glad it's over and I have my annual I'm going to practice every single day for four months. I don't know why it doesn't happen. I don't think I like it very much at times.

(Pause): [00:40:50 00:41:30]

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