TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

THERAPIST: Good morning.

CLIENT: Well there was this bombing two hours ago.

THERAPIST: Yeah. I don't really know what happened. At all. (inaudible at 00:00:25)

CLIENT: Uh news reports have been sketchy. There were two bombs that went off at the finish line at the Boston Marathon.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Twenty-three confirmed injuries and two confirmed fatalities.

THERAPIST: Wow.

CLIENT: Yeah so for the last two hours I've just been frantically texting friends and making sure everyone is okay. Everyone I know is okay.

THERAPIST: That's good. (inaudible at 00:00:50)

CLIENT: Not yet.

THERAPIST: Where is the finish line? [00:00:59]

CLIENT: At (inaudible) Square. Yeah so it's pretty terrible.

THERAPIST: Mm.

CLIENT: But everyone I know who was watching the marathon was far away from the finish line.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: I have one friend who was volunteering as a medic but she's fine and has been evacuated with all the other civilians.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. Yeah. (pause at 00:01:24 until 00:01:32) Horrible.

CLIENT: Yep. I don't know that there is much to say about it though.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: There is really no good information. Just a whole bunch of news feeds repeating the same thing over and over again.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. (pause at 00:01:47 until 00:01:58) I assume it's also not clear if it was intentional or some utility or –

CLIENT: Oh no. They were actual bombs. That much has been confirmed by the fire department and the police department. And ATF. [00:02:12]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. (pause at 00:02:13 until 00:03:01)

CLIENT: I don't know what to say. I'm afraid it might be a little bit narcissistic to want to talk about my relationship stuff given the news. [00:03:11]

THERAPIST: Uh. (pause at 00:03:12 until 00:03:25) (inaudible) focus on yourself at a time like this?

CLIENT: Yes.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:03:39) the bombing?

CLIENT: (inaudible)

THERAPIST: Even if (inaudible at 00:03:54) information?

CLIENT: Yes. (pause at 00:03:55 until 00:05:21)

THERAPIST: I have the impression you're waiting for some reassurance from me.

CLIENT: Maybe.

THERAPIST: (chuckles) (pause at 00:05:28 until 00:05:55) Without that I guess you'd really be quite convinced that I would think you were (inaudible at 00:06:13).

CLIENT: Well convinced that you would think I was really narcissistic because it would be true. Right? (pause at 00:06:25 until 00:06:30) I don't know. The way you framed it. Like convinced that you would think made me think – made it sound like you were thinking that I was more concerned about your opinion than about the truth of the fact that you were basing your opinion on. [00:06:43]

THERAPIST: I see. The issue (inaudible) fact.

CLIENT: Right. I mean not that I don't care about your opinion but – (both chuckle).

THERAPIST: You care more about the (inaudible at 00:06:51).

CLIENT: The facts are a bit more important to me. Yeah. (chuckling)

THERAPIST: (chuckles) I see.

CLIENT: Sorry. (laughs)

THERAPIST: (laughing)

CLIENT: I do find your opinion valuable to spend an hour and a half a week here.

THERAPIST: (laughing)

CLIENT: (laughs)

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:07:13) narcissistic I am in how I react to that. (laughter) (pause at 00:07:20 until 00:07:35) Well it's a little more complicated I think in that – (laughing) – I'm saying this to establish the importance of my opinion but it seems the reassurance would somehow make a big difference. [00:07:54]

CLIENT: (inaudible)

THERAPIST: You know? Like I mean my hunch is it sort of could be any number of people sitting here reassuring you that you that you weren't being self-absorbed or something.

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: But that somehow it's my opinion or somebody else who would kind of establish the fact.

CLIENT: Mm-hmm. Right. Mostly because your opinion is an expert opinion. (pause at 00:08:25 until 00:08:44) I have conflicted feelings about authority. You may have noticed that. (laughs)

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:08:51)

CLIENT: (inaudible)

THERAPIST: Mm. (pause at 00:08:55 until 00:09:11) (inaudible) it's not my opinion (inaudible at 00:09:14). My opinion insofar as it establishes a fact (inaudible). [00:09:20]

CLIENT: Right. That is precisely it.

THERAPIST: And somehow the issue of your self-absorption in the context that we're talking about is something that I can expertly establish as opposed to something (inaudible at 00:09:45).

CLIENT: Right. (pause at 00:09:46 until 00:10:15)

THERAPIST: It reminds me of something more like (inaudible at 00:10:19) where an expert could sort of tell you how things are in the world. [00:10:27]

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: And that would be quite distinct from what their opinions might be. Like they like this area of research or –

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: or they think that set of ideas is very useful. But that's different from like, "Here's how a circuit works."

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Or (inaudible at 00:10:46).

CLIENT: Or to give a really good example, my father-in-law is a professional engineer. He's a civil engineer. He designs power plants for a living.

THERAPIST: Oh.

CLIENT: And his neighborhood – a group of (inaudible at 00:10:59) in his neighborhood wanted to oppose the (inaudible at 00:11:04). Not in my backyard.

THERAPIST: Oh okay.

CLIENT: Landowners, homeowners who don't want any building. Anyway they were opposed to having a wind farm built near their neighborhood. They came up with a bunch of bullshit arguments about ground vibrations and the structural soundness of foundations of houses. [00:11:27]

And there were city hall meetings. Etcetera, etcetera. And my father-in-law went to one of them. And when you testify before city council or whatever you're supposed to say your name, your address and what your profession is.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: And he was standing up to give his opinion that these people were arguing in bad faith and that really what they were concerned about was sight lines and aesthetics. And on aesthetic grounds there is nothing wrong with the wind farm. But as soon as he said he was a civil engineer, (inaudible at 00:11:58) all of a sudden that completely changed the context of the conversation. Right? Because –

THERAPIST: Yep.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:12:07) expertise.

CLIENT: Even though he had not done any kind of real engineering analysis of the situation. He was basing it on his gut feel. But he had to be very careful to say, "I am not speaking as a C.E. but as a homeowner. This is not a professional opinion. I am expressing ." [00:12:33]

THERAPIST: (inaudible) (pause at 00:12:36 until 00:12:46)

CLIENT: But it was a judgment he would be qualified to make if he had read the reports and done the analysis. (pause at 00:12:51 until 00:13:55)

THERAPIST: Well I had the impression you kind of – (inaudible at 00:14:06) how things arranged in your mind between you and I so that there is not a possibility of personal push and pull. Or disagreement or something like that. Either I'm speaking from a position of expertise in which case what I say goes. [00:14:30]

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: Or I'm sort of voicing an opinion in which case you have your opinion and that's what goes. Or that's like—

CLIENT: I don't think I ever think of the latter case as happening.

THERAPIST: Yeah I guess what you said was my opinion doesn't Tomer. The reality does.

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: Not (inaudible at 00:14:55) to your opinion. (inaudible) (pause at 00:14:56 until 00:15:13)

CLIENT: And I do worry that it makes me a bad person or at least some kind of personality disordered person to be more concerned about my sex life than about bombings. [00:15:27] (pause until 00:15:58)

THERAPIST: I certainly would not diagnose you on that basis. (chuckles) I will say that much as far as reassurance goes.

CLIENT: I guess in my defense as soon as I heard I did check in with everyone I know to make sure they were safe. I don't know. (pause at 00:16:17 until 00:16:35) This has been actually the same kind of emotional reaction after the New Town, Connecticut shootings. Like people were posting on Facebook and Twitter – people I know – about how heartsick and horrified and deeply emotionally disturbed they were.

And I didn't have that deep and emotional reaction. I mean terrible – both of these events are terrible things. And you know perpetrators should get caught and justice should be done and all of that. But like I don't feel particularly devastated or traumatized by the fact that something bad happened in the world somewhere. [00:17:16]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: And I don't know how much of what people post in social media is just posturing because that's what expected and how much is genuine. It's really hard to tell.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Um – but mostly what I worried about both times – and in fact any time there is a public tragedy like this – is I hope the perpetrator wasn't (inaudible at 00:17:48) because that would make life suck for a lot of people I love. And I hope they get caught. Why do we not have better gun control laws? And maybe disgust and a little bit of horror but not the like soul rending anguish that so many people say they feel. [00:18:10]

THERAPIST: Mm. (pause at 00:18:11 until 00:18:41)

CLIENT: And of course all of this stirs up like old unpleasantness from my childhood from parents and teachers. Like lots of teachers and parents used to – well lots of teachers and my parents used to tell me that I was cold and unfeeling and heartless. I had one teacher who said she didn't think I was human. [00:19:04]

THERAPIST: Oh God.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: That's horrible. (pause at 00:19:09 until 00:19:17) What was the context of that?

CLIENT: That teacher was one of my coaches in Science Olympiad.

THERAPIST: Was this the evil Science Olympiad coach?

CLIENT: No. We had a dozen teachers who were involved in coaching.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: (inaudible at 00:19:33) was the evil coach. He was the head coach, which he had like twelve underlings. Twelve or thirteen. A whole bunch of underlings who helped students in their various areas of expertise. (inaudible at 00:19:42) I get very competitive very easily. And especially in high school the competitiveness was in overdrive. So I just –

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:19:51) right?

CLIENT: Yeah. So another kid had been really sick. It turned out that she had mono. And I said, "Does that mean I can have her place on the team?" Because someone had to fill her place on the team. It was not tactful. Maybe a little heartless but –[00:20:09]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. (inaudible)

CLIENT: It's not like mono was cancer. She was going to get better eventually. (pause at 00:20:17 until 00:20:27) My parents used to say that I was heartless because I didn't express enough interest in the lives of my sisters. (inaudible at 00:20:33) about what was going on in somebody's school. (pause at 00:20:35 until 00:20:45) Other teachers used to call me self-centered because I never – I guess because I never asked enough questions about other people. Like I would do a perfunctory "How are you doing?" and then not pay any attention to the answer. [00:20:59]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: And I guess even now I have to remind myself. Like an actual mental checklist of good people show interest in their friends' lives. So I've actively cultivated a skill of remembering what's going on in the lives of my friends. And making an effort to ask about it. But it's certainly not second nature or even habit.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: It's a thing I think about actively. This is how you maintain friendships.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. (pause at 00:21:35 until 00:22:34) I think I'm going to be kind of like another teacher who thinks you're inhuman or – if you talk about your love life? (chuckles) Sorry. (inaudible) [00:22:53]

CLIENT: Point taken.

THERAPIST: (chuckling) (pause at 00:22:57 until 00:23:06)

CLIENT: I saw Ashley yesterday and it was wonderful.

THERAPIST: Oh yeah? Good.

CLIENT: I saw Tom Thursday and it was really weird and awkward and terrible.

THERAPIST: Sorry I remember Ashley. Remind me about Tom?

CLIENT: Tom and I have had an on and off thing for like two years. He's the one who was weirdly exhibitionist at a party at my house and made everyone uncomfortable.

THERAPIST: Yes. Yes.

CLIENT: So we both participate in this hobby called contra dancing. And I ran into him at a dance Thursday night. And he asked me to dance with him. And so the way contra dances are structured you dance for a few moments with your assigned partner and then you switch off to dance with a neighbor. And then you go back to your partner and you go to a different neighbor. And so in the course of the dance you end up dancing with like 15 or 20 different people. And every time alternating between someone new and your partner. [00:23:56]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: And so even though he made things really weird and awkward at that party and I haven't spoken to him since we still chat online relatively frequently. And so he was – he's dating Ashley's girlfriend. So (inaudible at 00:24:20). So anyway. So he knew that Ashley and I had been (inaudible at 00:24:26) date last week.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: Because gossip moves at the speed of light in my world. So he was asking me about that. I was like, "Yeah I really like Ashley a lot. I had a really hard time reading him. I wasn't sure what kind or extent of his interest in me was but looking forward to seeing him on Sunday." And Tom was like, "Wow. You really have a type don't you?" I was like, "Not really. (inaudible at 00:24:57)."

And so every time I went and danced with a new neighbor when I came back to Tom he would say, "Well is that guy your type? Are you going to sleep with him? What about that guy? You're smiling but he doesn't seem like your type? Why aren't you sleeping with William? I would think he's your type." This was really weird and gross. And so – like the first time I answered the question earnestly. Like, "Sure. That guy I was dancing with is kind of cute but I don't know anything about him." The second time it was like this is really weird. [00:25:30]

And then the third time my neighbor was William who is a friend of ours. We all went to school together. I know him fairly well. And it's like, "What the hell?" Like I've known William for (inaudible at 00:25:40) years. I was a shoulder he cried on when he got out of his bad relationships. Like sure if you were to only look at the last two people I've been interested in William kind of falls into that type, but I don't have romantic feelings for him. And I'm not going to defend that. It's okay to not have romantic feelings for everyone. It was really weird and terrible and awful.

And I really came away feeling like he was trying to shame me or judge me for my sexual decisions. Which (sighs) this is really catty. And I recognize it's catty. And I would normally never judge someone based on the number of sexual partners they have but Tom is sleeping with five times as many people as I am. He has no right to judge me for the number of partners that I have. Or want to have. (inaudible at 00:26:29) This is ridiculous. I was really upset. It was really (inaudible). [00:26:43]

THERAPIST: Mm. (pause at 00:26:45 until 00:27:03)

CLIENT: Possibly more than five times. He has an actual database to keep track of all the people he's dating.

THERAPIST: Oh gosh.

CLIENT: (inaudible at 00:27:16) those are the choices he makes. And he seems to be happy. It's working for him. So you know – whatever.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: But like he has no grounds on which stand on which to judge me. (pause at 00:27:29 until 00:27:49) It reminded me really unpleasantly of my last therapist who made this really kind of snide comment about her cousin being Mexican and maybe I'd like to sleep with him. [00:27:58]

Something to that sort of thing. (inaudible at 00:28:01) you're talking about that makes no sense. And also like – (pause at 00:28:03 until 00:28:11). I really resent the implication that because I like sex and willing to talk about the fact that I like sex and am not monogamous that somehow this means I have no standards or whatever.

THERAPIST: I see. (pause at 00:28:23 until 00:28:45)

CLIENT: It's like that kind of judgment – I don't know. It's not really surprising coming from a second wave feminist but it is surprising coming from someone in my community. Right? [00:28:53]

THERAPIST: Your old therapist being the second wave feminist? Uh-huh. It was surprising coming from your shrink.

CLIENT: Sure. But that was not the first time she had overstepped boundaries. So –

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Maybe it would be surprising coming from a generic shrink but not so surprising coming from her specifically.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: But yeah. It was (inaudible at 00:29:29).

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: And then Tom had the nerve to ask if I could come with him and have sex with him. (pause at 00:29:34 until 00:29:43) And I realized that we've never had a serious, emotional relationship. There was no relationship with a capital R there. It's always just been about the sex. But – I don't know. It was very not cool in execution. [00:30:02] (pause until 00:30:56)

THERAPIST: I guess one thing my potential judgments seem to do is they always seem directed really against whatever you're feeling. [00:31:16]

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: You know? Like it's catty what you're saying about him or you're being inappropriately mad. Or right but –

CLIENT: No I mean I think my anger and frustration at Tom is justified. I don't think it's justified to then make judgmental comments about his sex life.

THERAPIST: I actually – maybe you held them back – but I didn't hear you make any. I mean I heard you say, "He's sleeping with five times as many as I am and he keeps them in a database."

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: I suppose there is a little bit of a (inaudible at 00:31:58) there.

CLIENT: (inaudible) Yeah.

THERAPIST: But your point was quite clearly that – in fact you said, "He can do what he wants."

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: But he really shouldn't be judging me in the way that he is. So I don't actually really hear the cattiness there. [00:32:25]

CLIENT: Mm.

THERAPIST: Maybe I'm missing it or maybe you didn't say it or something.

CLIENT: Mm. I felt like just pointing out the number of partners he had was what made it catty. (pause at 00:32:39 until 00:32:50) Maybe I'm being overly harsh on myself. That's been known to happen on occasion. (chuckles)

THERAPIST: Now and again. (pause at 00:32:59 until 00:33:13) So – (pause at 00:33:13 until 00:33:30). Yeah the judgment is usually along the lines of what you feel is bad or it is wrong.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: It's critical of him (inaudible) catty. (inaudible) [00:33:51]

CLIENT: Mm.

THERAPIST: I'm not saying it's impossible for you to be catty but just like – (pause at 00:33:58 until 00:34:05).

CLIENT: There was a – (inaudible at 00:34:06) one of my friends about Tom on Friday morning before work. And I typed in all caps. I was not expecting (inaudible at 00:34:17) from Tom (inaudible at 00:34:18) the king of the (inaudible at 00:34:19).

THERAPIST: (chuckles) Uh-huh.

CLIENT: Which I think that definitely falls over the line into catty. Calling him the king of (inaudible at 00:34:30).

THERAPIST: True.

CLIENT: I was still really pissed off. I guess I am still really pissed off. Like how dare he? I felt really uncomfortable. And like – (sighs).

THERAPIST: And shamed a little. [00:34:49]

CLIENT: Yeah. (pause at 00:34:51 until 00:35:00) I mean I realize my taste baffles most of my friends because I don't have a type. Like not in any sense that would be meaningful I guess. Everyone I've ever fallen in love with has been intelligent and a good conversationalist but that's not really a type per se.

THERAPIST: Right. Right.

CLIENT: I don't know. (pause at 00:35:22 until 00:35:45) And Ashley is nothing like any of my past lovers.

THERAPIST: Hmm.

CLIENT: I mean except that he's intelligent and a good conversationalist. Yeah I had a great time with him yesterday. [00:35:59]

THERAPIST: Well good. (pause at 00:35:59 until 00:36:33)

CLIENT: And of course I am absurdly anxious now about the possibility that he might not like me as much I as I like him. And this might not turn into a real relationship with a capital R which I very much want it to.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: I like him a lot. (inaudible at 00:36:50) sort of thing that only time will tell and I should chill and just let things unfold. That is easier said than done and I'm not very patient. (pause at 00:36:58 until 00:37:33) I'm also worried about the fact that Ashley knew me when I was nineteen and stupid is going to (inaudible at 00:37:40) to blow up in my face.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: That actually came up last night. We were sitting on the couch. [00:37:46]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: And we had been talking and then had started leaning in towards each other in that are we going to kiss or are we not kind of tension. And I got tired of that tension so I just asked. "May I kiss you?" (chuckles) And he said yes. And then we started kissing. And a few minutes later he paused for a moment and he said, "I can't imagine (inaudible at 00:38:11) ever being that comfortable in her own skin." Because I wasn't when I was nineteen. I'm not nineteen anymore.

THERAPIST: As it turns out. (chuckles)

CLIENT: (chuckling) Thankfully.

THERAPIST: (laughs)

CLIENT: Being nineteen really sucked. I don't want to be nineteen again. (laughs) (pause at 00:38:33 until 00:38:47) But yeah I feel like there is a little bit of double vision going on on his part.

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: And he's even said that you know the first time we met a week ago that he had trouble reconciling my behavior now with his memories of me from twelve years ago. [00:39:04]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: I don't know. It is a thing that worries me but there is nothing I can do about it.

THERAPIST: It sounded like a compliment to me. (inaudible at 00:39:21) that you're comfortable in your own skin (inaudible).

CLIENT: Sure.

THERAPIST: I mean I wasn't there. I don't have the context but I don't have the impression that it occurred to you that that was possible.

CLIENT: No it hadn't. (pause at 00:39:44 until 00:40:00)

THERAPIST: Yeah I think with me and I guess probably with him as well you're really worried about the judgment that's going to be kind of like the other shoe dropping. [00:40:10]

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:40:13)

CLIENT: I'm always worried about the other shoe dropping.

THERAPIST: Uh-huh. (pause at 00:40:30 until 00:41:06) I guess it seemed to me that it you worry about it a lot. And other things too but (inaudible at 00:41:15). You already feel what you want. [00:41:23]

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: Like it turns out you're going to have the wrong feeling or reaction. You worry. And that's going to be (inaudible at 00:41:36). (pause at 00:41:41 until 00:41:56) And I think that makes you worried (inaudible at 00:41:57) dating. (inaudible) other things too but – and I know some of this comes from what happened with (inaudible at 00:42:08) but I imagine it comes from other things as well.

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:42:14)

CLIENT: Yeah I guess it's always a worry for me with everyone. [00:42:33]

THERAPIST: Uh-huh.

CLIENT: But I mean Brenda gave me a pretty strong recommendation for you that you would not give me shit about (inaudible at 00:42:42) or queerness or (inaudible) or any of that.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. (inaudible at 00:42:49)

CLIENT: No I posted something on my blog about something my former shrink had said to me. And she went all Mama Bear on me and was like, "You need to find a new shrink now."

THERAPIST: Mm.

CLIENT: Here call mine. [00:43:16] (laughter) (pause at 00:43:20 until 00:43:31)

THERAPIST: Well good.

CLIENT: And my friends did kind of gang up on me and forced me to end the professional relationship with Chrissy because I was just – I couldn't cope with the idea of meeting new shrinks. And like going through the phone book and – I called one or two randomly from my insurance's website and they're like, "We're not taking new patients." And that was just so demoralizing and (inaudible at 00:43:55) that I couldn't deal with it. It's like a bad shrink is better than no shrink I guess. I don't think that's true anymore but that was certainly where I was then. [00:44:05]

THERAPIST: Sure.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Well I imagine it sort of relates to what you're coming to a shrink for in the first place in that probably if at one level (inaudible at 00:44:27) what she was saying was wrong or inappropriate –

CLIENT: Mm-hmm.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:44:32). At another level I would guess maybe you weren't so sure.

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: I mean you're sure about some of the content. You weren't so sure that you didn't deserve to be treated badly.

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: Or – (inaudible at 00:44:52).

CLIENT: Mm-hmm. (pause at 00:44:56 until 00:45:07) Ashley wants me to go with him to the (inaudible) Festival next weekend. [00:45:12]

THERAPIST: Oh.

CLIENT: I've never been to (inaudible at 00:45:15) although I participate in a number of hobbies that will represented at the festival but Tom is going be there. And Ashley's girlfriend is going to be there. And my evil ex is going to be there. And I just – it will be lots of people. And lots of people I don't know and lots of people with whom I have tense relationships.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: And not that many people. I don't know that many people who I know are friends who are also for sure going.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Does that make any sense?

THERAPIST: Sure.

CLIENT: And so I don't know. I haven't decided whether I'm going or not. I haven't told him one way or the other.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: But I'm leaning towards not. I'm over thinking the question (inaudible at 00:46:02).

THERAPIST: I see. We should finish up.

CLIENT: Okay.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:46:09)

CLIENT: Yeah. Take care.

THERAPIST: Thanks. You too. [00:46:11]

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