TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: So they lost.

THERAPIST: I heard. Sorry about that.

CLIENT: If they won, they would have played San Francisco and I would have been in San Francisco for my the Super Bowl, instead of at my grandma's 90th birthday party. So now...

THERAPIST: I guess you'll be there during the Super Bowl.

CLIENT: Yeah, but they won't be in the Super Bowl.

(silence)

CLIENT: So I had a real slop (ph) day yesterday. Just stayed in my PJs and slept on the couch and watched the inauguration all day. And I went out to get Chinese food, which I threw up this morning. [00:01:23]

THERAPIST: Oh no.

CLIENT: Nice, yeah. Which is probably a good thing, because I ate too much.

THERAPIST: That's a pretty delayed throwing up. I mean, I know you, like, spit up some phlegm in the morning but usually you don't throw up, like, dinner in the morning, do you?

CLIENT: Only when I order Chinese food, because I eat too much, so it's still in my stomach, you know, 12 hours later, 8 hours later, whatever. It's happened once before. And (ph) I woke up yesterday, I had no nausea whatsoever. So I was a little surprised because I figured I was dehydrated (yawns) from drinking. But I decided against taking the Adderall yesterday because that would have probably motivated me to do something. [00:02:22]

THERAPIST: Wait, wait, wait. Back up. You decided (laughter) not to take the Adderall because had you taken it you would have felt like getting something done and you didn't want to feel like getting anything done so you didn't take it?

CLIENT: Sort of. It's not that I didn't feel like getting anything done. I didn't feel like doing anything, you know. Kids...

THERAPIST: And you were worried you might start to feel like doing something?

CLIENT: If I took the Adderall, yeah. You know, like I'd go to the office and do something, you know, which I probably should have done. I'm going straight to the office from here. And I had motivated and made that decision before I took the Adderall. (pause) But I definitely can tell the difference. Not too long after taking it, like right now, from how I felt, you know, an hour ago.

THERAPIST: Good, I'm glad it's helping. It could be really (inaudible at 03:44)

CLIENT: You know, it's like I'm just like...

THERAPIST: ...different, yeah.

CLIENT: Am I just, you know, too tired and this is giving me energy or is it really helping my focus and stuff like that? I thought about something that (pause) I was able to focus on a little better. I can't remember what it was. (pause) I think Ian (sp?) was bothering me while I was trying to do something. I can't remember.

(silence)

CLIENT: I did want to see the kids yesterday though. I was going to text Jess to see if they went and see when they were going to get back but I never did. [00:04:53]

THERAPIST: For the weekend?

CLIENT: Just for..

THERAPIST: For the day?

CLIENT: ...for the day, yeah. Ian's (sp?) little friend moved. (phone rings) Jeez. They always call me when I can't take the call, you know, have to leave a message. And then when I did speak to them, you can't even remember the conversation. Like, nothing was accomplished, you know. So I kind of ended up talking with Jess about what's going to happen with the house and she still suggested I move into the house and that she take my apartment, which now has one less room. I'm like, how are you going to fit in there, you know?

THERAPIST: So is that your condo?

CLIENT: No, that's the multi-family.

THERAPIST: Where she is now? [00:05:54]

CLIENT: Right. What she wants to do is, because my rent's going down to $1200, she's not going to be able to get $1200 rent anywhere that isn't a slumlord or in a bad neighborhood. So she wants my $1200 rent, you know, and for me to move into the house that's getting foreclosed on or short stay alert (ph). I don't know why she wants me to move there, you know, but...

THERAPIST: Right. She just wants to cover her own ass.

CLIENT: Yeah. But I've been dreading talking about it and it wasn't so bad, you know. Just about what we were going to do as far as selling, you know. And I said I was going to do something. Oh, see if they have an investment modification program. Maybe I'll call them today or tomorrow.

THERAPIST: This is the bank?

CLIENT: Yeah. Just to buy some time, you know. [00:07:00]

(silence)

CLIENT: My condo litigation is just I'm on all these emails that I can't even read them. They're just so I don't even know what they're talking about. They're arguing over stuff and taking hot shots at each other. The disenfranchised trustee is, you know, both trustees gave me affidavits to what the finances were or at least Riley did the guy who jump sized. So she thinks that he should be brought up on perjury charges because he no longer supports the litigation. I don't want to explain to her that, you know, he didn't lie in the affidavit -he just doesn't want to enforce it, you know. They really need to either go into some sort of mediation or hire their own lawyers and sit with each other individually. [00:08:21]

I mean, I have to figure out how to extract myself from this situation, you know. Riley has not been communicating to me at all about it. He just in one email said he no longer supports the litigation. And of course the email that I wrote out with our options. Luckily I didn't talk about our trial strategy, but the disenfranchised woman ends up emailing it to the defendant. I am picking a trial date on Tuesday. We have a closing that morning. Probably not going to be able to meet with you on Tuesday.

THERAPIST: Which Tuesday?

CLIENT: This coming Tuesday, the 29th.

THERAPIST: [About a week] (ph) from today?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: So we're off?

CLIENT: I'll know better today but I think I've got a closing that morning.

THERAPIST: OK, do you want to send me a message later today? [00:09:24]

CLIENT: Yeah, if I remember. But I pick Ian (sp?) up today. Jess's taking some knitting class or something like that, you know. She complains that she has no time to get work done and she's so overwhelmed and, you know, I don't know. But taking a knitting class in the middle of the day? She takes all of Friday off with Lucille.

THERAPIST: Wait, every week or...

CLIENT: Yeah. They've got a (inaudible at 10:01) class at the school that they go to. She's been trying to apply for the preschool and get (pause) what's the word? They have a preschool program. I think they do.

THERAPIST: This one out there?

CLIENT: Yeah. Trying to get financial aid. (pause) (sighs) Yesterday was interesting because, you know, I felt crappy all day, you know, and it wasn't so much bummed about the game. I mean, I'm sure that affected my mood some but just, you know, felt lonely, nothing to do. Just, you know, (pause) I don't know. [00:11:17]

(silence)

CLIENT: And I helped Ian (sp?) build his pinewood car, this car (ph) that I had no fucking clue what I'm doing. Went and bought some stickers for it (ph), numbers and flames and skulls and stuff like that, little decals. He has a bunch of paint but I don't think he has the right paint to, I don't know, paint wood. I don't know. They kind of don't give you a whole lot of direction, you know. They're just like help you cut it and then they're just like, "All right, the way in is," you know, whatever. So there's no, "OK, here's what you need to do now" or anything like that, you know. I don't think it's [art time's leader] (ph) kind of a scatterbrain. [00:12:42]

THERAPIST: You really do the thing where you feel (inaudible at 13:04)

CLIENT: There's not a clinical term for it?

THERAPIST: There's some clinical terms.

CLIENT: I just wonder if this thing was official (ph) jargon or...

THERAPIST: (laughter) You also do this other thing.

CLIENT: Back to the first thing I do. Sorry for interrupting.

THERAPIST: The second thing.

CLIENT: That's part of one of the symptoms of ADD, so.

THERAPIST: Yeah, but you don't interrupt randomly. You interrupt specifically when I'm trying to tell you something. (laughter) I guess I think it's funny.

CLIENT: So I do this thing. What?

THERAPIST: Yeah, where you feel you have this fantasy that you're completely helpless.

CLIENT: Fantasy?

THERAPIST: Yeah. "Oh my god, I have no fucking clue what I'm doing with the pinewood derby car. They don't give us much direction. The scout leader is kind of scatterbrained. I don't know if we have the paint to paint on wood. It's this Saturday, five days from now, whatever." I mean, there's this thing called the Internet where people, you know. I mean, you could look up in 15 minutes sort of a detailed instruction, if you want, about what to do, I'm sure. Or figure out where to buy the paint or, you know, you could probably watch a video on YouTube showing you exactly what to do. And you don't need me to tell you this. Like, you've used Google and YouTube before. And part of you (ph) is like, "Oh my god. I'm completely overwhelmed. I have no idea what to do. I have this responsibility that's way over my head. I completely can't handle it. It's only five days away. I'm going to let my kid down. I'm anxious and confused." [00:15:00]

So it's, like, striking to me. (pause) Or you could ask one of the other parents. Or you could call the scout leader and ask him or her where to look. Or you could I mean, any one of those things would probably work. And again, I'm not saying this to, you know, I'm so smart, I have all these ideas. You could think of this (inaudible at 15:43) but (inaudible at 15:46).

(silence)

CLIENT: It wasn't about my anxiety.

THERAPIST: Maybe. I mean, clearly you are feeling anxious when you are feeling overwhelmed. Absolutely. In that sense it's your anxiety. I don't think you're actually (pause) I'm not sure that's really mostly what this is about. I'm not at all questioning how you feel. You know, do you feel overwhelmed, do you feel anxious and do you feel helpless. I absolutely believe that you do. I know you're not making that up and I know it's really unpleasant. Absolutely. [00:16:54]

I'm not sure. Is this, like, a bid for attention? Do you want somebody to run in and help you out and fix it and make it better and tell you what to do? Is it because, you know, if you found instructions then you'd actually feel responsible for doing the car, doing a good job, and somehow that would be normal (ph)? I don't know. Is there something else? I'm not sure.

CLIENT: Just kind of something beyond my comfort zone, you know. I don't have really good woodworking or painting or any time of skill that requires making something using a tool.

THERAPIST: I guess I sort of think that's the same thing again. I hear what you're saying. (pause) [You were saying] (ph) you're not sort of, like, crafts-y or carpenter-y (ph) that way. It's not something that you're comfortable with. At the same time, you're a smart, competent guy. You could probably get pretty good instructions. It's (ph) a fucking pinewood derby car. You know what I mean? [00:18:37]

I don't know if it's that you have no confidence, you know? I guess I refuse to believe you don't have the, like you're not so smart, never (ph) skilled enough to, like, get in there and give it a try and have it turn out adequate, you know? I'm sure Ian (sp?) is probably excited about how it looks when it turns out. He feels mostly excited about just doing it with you, you know, (pause) and I'm sure if you, like good (ph) instructions, thought about it a little bit. I mean, 20 minutes or something before you get (inaudible at 19:22) and worked with him on it, that, you know, you'd do more than an adequate job. Maybe it wouldn't be the best one there or the fastest one or the best looking one but it would [probably be] (ph) fine. I guess it doesn't feel like that.

CLIENT: No.

THERAPIST: I imagine you have this sort of idea that you're just...

CLIENT: I made one when I was a kid but I remember nothing about making it other than I won the silliest car, funniest car. I made, like, a Dotson, you know. I don't even remember why it was funny. Ian (sp?) wants to win the silliest car but we're not making a silly car. I don't know. [00:20:28]

(silence)

THERAPIST: OK (ph), I think you could do a fine job if you spent, you know, 20 or 30 minutes on Google and YouTube.

CLIENT: When am I going to do that?

THERAPIST: Maybe took a trip to, like...

CLIENT: Michaels.

THERAPIST: Sure, Michaels.

CLIENT: They have a whole pile (ph) of derby stuff (ph).

THERAPIST: Sure. That sounds ideal then. It's mostly about spending time with the kids, doing something together. (pause) [Maybe you guys will turn out] (ph) something fine. What's involved? Did they give you, like, the parts of the cars and you have to put together or...

CLIENT: They gave you a block and some wheels.

THERAPIST: And you have to, like, use saws and...

CLIENT: Yeah, they had a band saw junior template on the car and they cut it. We actually have to add pieces of wood to the top to make it, you know, which is the part I'm really more concerned about, is, you know, making it look like a bumper car, you know. [00:22:43]

THERAPIST: So what do you need to add to the top?

CLIENT: Just like the front shield. You know, it kind of goes up a little bit and then there's the back part, you know, just kind of a little it has to be built up a little bit.

THERAPIST: I see. So you have like a car with no front, back windshields and you kind of need to put those on there?

CLIENT: Right. A lot of the cars are race cars where you go down and, you know, where this is you're building it up.

THERAPIST: I see. That's something that has to be wood or can you get, like...

CLIENT: Well, I don't want...

THERAPIST: A couple of nails and a piece of tape and, like, just or maybe three nails, like boom, boom, boom and then you put a piece of tape that's the windshield kind of around the nails and then, like, [you know what I mean] (ph)?

CLIENT: I don't know.

THERAPIST: Then you could even get a sharpie and you could, like, draw the windshield wipers (inaudible at 23:37).

CLIENT: I don't know.

THERAPIST: I'm horrible at this stuff so, like, I'm thinking of the easiest [least talent] (ph) way to do it because that's about what I would be up to.

CLIENT: If only Ian (sp?) was a girl.

(silence)

THERAPIST: [How do you get up to this] (ph)?

CLIENT: Well, we'll find out.

THERAPIST: I think the main thing that gets in your way is that you're afraid to give it a try and so you kind of [overweight it] (ph) and feel helpless. And then when you get there and you haven't thought about it at all and you're kind of freaking out a little bit, you know, then it does make things more difficult (inaudible at 24:46) pull it off. (pause) What do you think?

CLIENT: I don't know. I mean, there's just, you know.

(silence)

THERAPIST: What?

CLIENT: What?

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: What?

THERAPIST: You said (inaudible at 26:50), you know.

CLIENT: I don't know. I was thinking about something else.

THERAPIST: [What was that] (ph)?

(silence)

THERAPIST: Cameron, I don't think you have enough self-confidence in yourself when it comes to lots of things. [00:30:15]

CLIENT: We already knew that. How does that explain why I have a ton of laundry that I needed to do two weeks ago?

(silence)

THERAPIST: I think you feel kind of crummy about yourself (pause) as a result in part of your lack of confidence and (pause), you know, when you're feeling crummy about yourself it can be hard to be motivated and take care of yourself. You feel down, you don't feel like you're worth it, you don't do your laundry.

(silence)

[00:34:13]

CLIENT: I don't know. (sighs)

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 36:25)

CLIENT: Going to the bathroom. Chinese food.

[00:38:26]

CLIENT: Yesterday was blue Monday, the most depressing day of the year. (inaudible at 38:49) my whole life or something. It was (inaudible at 38:55) the things that'll happen. I don't have (inaudible at 39:06). (yawns)

(silence)

CLIENT: I don't know. I just don't know.

[00:41:07]

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 43:22) next Tuesday.

CLIENT: Yeah, I just have to confirm that the closing's Tuesday, which I think it is. (sighs) (inaudible at 43:43)

[00:43:48]

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