TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: (inaudible). Wasn’t available that day, I think, and (inaudible). The thing gets stuck in your head because it’s all parodies of popular songs. You’ve got Robin Thicke’s date rape song. Forget what it’s called.

THERAPIST: Blurred Lines.

CLIENT: Exactly. It’s called “Word Crimes”, goes through a variety of grammar mistakes, and is pretty much like, you’ve got to stop doing this. It’s great. His first one was Pharrell’s Happy one, (inaudible) Tacky.

THERAPIST: Tacky?

CLIENT: Tacky, (inaudible), if it’s okay with you, you’d be tacky too. The last one yesterday was Foil, about Lorde’s Royals song. It’s about aluminum foil. [00:01:04] Then it changes direction halfway through. A friend of mine is like, “I almost didn’t watch the whole thing, then hit the middle of it and the entire thing changed.”

THERAPIST: Can you get them on YouTube?

CLIENT: Oh yeah, it’s all through YouTube, but the first (inaudible) has one, and Vevo has one. He’s spreading them around to various Internet sites and also on YouTube. But it’s sort of a spread around the love sort of thing. Anyway, really funny stuff. Threw in some porn the other day. Not as difficult as I thought it would be, also not as easy.

THERAPIST: You did what though?

CLIENT: Loaded some porn.

THERAPIST: Loaded some porn.

CLIENT: One of the things that, this woman made $10,000.00 off of one month’s of work. She wrote 100 books, 110,000 page books in a series of erotic literature, self-published on Amazon for probably about $2.99. [00:02:07] She just paid attention to what people were buying, which books were popular, which books weren’t popular. She’s like, these are the formulas. Use the scenarios (inaudible), take those scenarios and write about them repeatedly, and she did. It was good. She was like, “I was trying to write horror novels.” And she wasn’t getting anywhere. She’s like, “I’ll just write porn for a month.” And it worked out. I fucking love to write porn, and I’m thinking about a semi-sci-fi series, like Firefly was sci-fi. It’s far future enough that there’s space ships and shit, but you know—

THERAPIST: That’s a TV show, right? [00:03:00]

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: I don’t know – I haven’t heard about it.

CLIENT: It’s like a western in space, the way Star Trek was supposed to be with – everyone’s got ships, but they’re not amazing ships. People who have weapons are probably firing at the grounds. Some people are firing at revolts, but that’s the military and stuff like that. Anyway, anything in that low sci-fi setting. If you can gloss over things, you can (inaudible) dropping a line about (inaudible), because there’s aliens in one of the styles. (inaudible). That’s what we’re (inaudible), and a 10,000 page book, I’m not particularly worried about that, but it’s really getting into how long did it take them to get from point A to point B. What they do want to see, the women, are character stories, character arcs. They want to care about the people who are fucking, much like me, actually. [00:04:01] My porn, I want scenario based stuff, or why are they here? I want to know why these people are involved in this.

We joke about – in college we had this friend of ours named CG, he was a dude, and he had this really shitty porn tape, and they were mostly shitty porn tapes. It was all VHS back then. It was called Six Guys, a Girl, and a Couch, and he was like, Six Guys, a Girl, and CG was like his – we joked that it was more dudes than it was women, because it was. It was a gang bang, one woman, six guys, clearly on a couch. But one time I was like, thanks, I’ll borrow this. I put it in, and it just starts out in a pretty much empty apartment with a couch. It was a place they probably rented for the day, hasn’t been painted yet, who knows, and then the man and woman are naked on the couch, fucking. [00:05:06] She’s like, “Oh my God. Oh yeah.” That level of intensity, I’m not even doing a parody of her.

It’s the actual thing. So they’re doing that for a little while, then these other five guys walk in who apparently were like contractors in the other apartment next door that heard some noise or whatever. It was the supposed thing, because a bunch of them had overalls that are coming off in different stages, and one has a paint roller, but he’s naked. Some of the guys are just naked. It’s like, how did this even – what do you mean? You’re all naked. If you’re working next door, how did this happen? How did any of this – this sucks. [00:06:00] Six Guys, a Girl, and a Couch. Who the fuck cares? Who the fuck cares? There’s so much porn, so much porn available in the world, for free, from reputable sites, so why not make a good porn, right? This is what I started doing. I’m experimenting with a slash fic, pre-established characters, because those are a good way to get your feet wet. One of the reasons women write slash fic is because they already know the characters from the television shows.

THERAPIST: What is it called?

CLIENT: Slash fic is when you take fan fic, and you take usually two male characters and make them a couple. So there’s a lot of slash fic going on with Sherlock. There’s a lot of slash fic about Supernatural, all sorts of shows. Any shows with rugged dudes, there’s slash fic about them. [00:07:00]

THERAPIST: Oh is that right?

CLIENT: Yeah. I wrote—

THERAPIST: Who’s John of—

CLIENT: John Watson.

THERAPIST: So it won’t be from two different shows, necessarily?

CLIENT: Sometimes, but whatever. So I was like, I’ll just write something funny. I’ll write some basic gay sex stuff, really basic, nothing explicit, get my feet wet essentially, because women prefer men on men sex. It’s the most popular thing in when it comes to the female (inaudible).

THERAPIST: It’s just written word?

CLIENT: All written.

THERAPIST: All written word and you just—

CLIENT: Yeah. So I took the character, Eric Northman, from True Blood, who is a vampire, very popular vampire.

THERAPIST: Which guy? I have seen the show.

CLIENT: He’s like – have you seen the first season?

THERAPIST: Yes.

CLIENT: He’s the sheriff. He has the long hair. He’s (inaudible) fantasia. He’s the first guy you meet with any vampire authority. [00:08:01] (inaudible). Anyway, very popular character, the kind of guy who shows up in just gym shorts sometimes, just high enough to hide his pubes, but other than that, (inaudible). So it was like, okay, that’s good, but people love Sherlock slash, and people love Dr. Who slash. I was like, I’ve been pissed off for quite a while that Steven Moffat was still running Sherlock, BBC, and Dr. Who. You can’t give – like Sherlock is amazing, and he’s letting the doctor kind of wander, not really trying satisfying story arc stuff, where he’s doing these amazing short films. I was like, I would like him to focus on Sherlock and give Dr. Who a different show runner.

THERAPIST: Oh, he’s the show runner for both?

CLIENT: Yeah. So I started a fic about that, about him waking up in bed next to Sherlock, (inaudible) a bit of erotic movement, and then he gets up to go to – Steven Moffat gets up to go to the bathroom, and (inaudible), and he gets up to go to the bathroom, and the Doctor surprises him, and they have some sex in the hot tub, and then afterwards the Doctor’s like, “I’ve got to go.” [00:09:26] He’s like, “This isn’t fair. You’re splitting your attention between us. He needs you specifically, and you do all these other things. He could very easily be a horrible human being, so we need you working on that.” He’s like, “I know. It’s not right. It’s not fair to him. It’s not fair to me, that’s the problem.” So I have them go off, and it’s a tender thing, and that’s what the women tell me, “Oh, he’s so tender.” Oh good. Okay. That’s good. You like tender. [00:10:00] You’ll read tender and touch yourself, and that’s all I’m into now. But this woman writes porn. So I’m like, okay, I’ll write something more specific. So I wrote Eric Northman having sex with some random woman, but I wrote it all from her perspective as an exercise. I’ve read a number of sex scenes written from a female perspective, and I was like, okay, I think I know some themes I can use, some language that seems appealing, and it’s more about how the expression of it – it’s more about emotional aspects of what’s happening, the intellectual aspects of what’s happening. Yeah, there’s totally sex, and it gets explicit eventually, but not super explicit, not like watching XXX rated porn, more like watching NC17, like they made this in Europe. [00:11:01]

THERAPIST: (inaudible).

CLIENT: So I started looking on Amazon to see what sells, and the most popular erotic fiction out there is master/slave stuff, dom stuff. I could write dom stuff probably. I wouldn’t want to write it pretending that (inaudible). I mean, I (inaudible). It’s been getting a few hits and people are pleased with it.

THERAPIST: (inaudible).

CLIENT: Here’s a package. Someone bought GTA for the DS and (inaudible). So (pause) I’m (inaudible). [00:12:02] It’s good. People like a sex scene that I wrote from a woman’s perspective, from a mostly female audience.

THERAPIST: Okay.

CLIENT: So that’s good. The fantasies that I write is young adult, feminist, female characters. I’ve only really shown it to women, and they all eat it up, and there’s not even any sex in that. I’ve added some illusions to that. It’s young adult, something like we all meet back in my room, blah, blah, blah, something like that, stuff that’s eluded to people having sexual relations, but we’re not here to be explicit. That’s not what it’s about. It’s not about who they’re sleeping with, but they’re humans, so they’re sleeping with people. It’s not about that.

THERAPIST: When you’re writing, do you have an audience in mind that you’re writing to? [00:13:01]

CLIENT: Yeah, young adult women.

THERAPIST: Do you imagine what they might—

CLIENT: What they’re missing right now?

THERAPIST: What are you imagining, like how they might read it, or like what the intended effect is?

CLIENT: The effect is (inaudible). There’s violence and violence is graphically depicted, but it’s violence on an equal scale. It’s humans, or monsters and humans fighting, and the gender of the people doesn’t come into play when they’re fighting. In a perfect fantasy world where feminism, where sexism and racism don’t exist. So I don’t have to deal with those issues. I can just write them (inaudible).

THERAPIST: Women are as capable of violence as— [00:14:01]

CLIENT: Oh yeah, and because they are. I don’t know if you’ve fought a woman.

THERAPIST: Of course I have.

CLIENT: I mean physically fought a woman.

THERAPIST: No, but of course they’re (inaudible). It’s like the high school, a lot of girls fighting in high school, a lot of violence.

CLIENT: If there’s a pack, it can be incredible. One on one though, still, they’re like me. They don’t care all of the sudden. As one woman just wrote in an article I read recently, “Excuse me.” She’s like, “I’m sorry. I’m not going to assume you’re just regular Joe and not a rapist if I don’t know you. That’s not safe.” It’s assumed (inaudible). She said, so yeah, if I see you, and you’re a man, and I’m by myself, I’m going to be aware of who you are and if you’re watching me, if you’re a rapist. But they don’t care when they’re fighting, (inaudible). [00:15:04] (pause) The worst ones relish it. They want to hurt you. This exists on the male side as well. They want to hurt you when they fight.

THERAPIST: But you were sort of saying there’s no sexism when it comes to violence.

CLIENT: And there is. There’s Aaron, a Russian who fucking hates women, doesn’t think they should be in combat as well, so he just gets harder on them. Well no, he goes hard, which is why I love that character. Aaron’s like, “Let’s kill (inaudible). That’s what we’re doing. I learn so much from you how easy it is for you to take out my eye.” Anyway, (inaudible) level of competency they’re at. He doesn’t follow the rule of building partners up. He’s like, you’re standing or you’re not. You can stop me from killing you, or you can’t. [00:16:02] But I like the fighting (inaudible). That’s all I want to play. But not everyone does. It’s equalized. I do have one scene where one dude almost kills all three of them, and it’s not because he’s a dude, but it’s because he’s better. He’s more experienced, more talented, more trained. They’re not in great shape when he gets to them, so he’s able to take them on one at a time.

Then the wizard shows up and just destroys them. That’s the first time you see her do what she’s capable of, but it’s great. I have this bit where – the collective (inaudible), that’s the human, rather than people. Not everyone’s technically human, but the races that meet in the wild that are capable of compassion, empathy, and cooperation to things outside of their own species, can be called a person, essentially. [00:17:13] You’re a person. Now you can be part of the collective. As we expand we won’t wipe out your race. We’ll incorporate you. As the collective goes we’ll all find ways to contribute, because that’s (inaudible). But there’s a bit there where he’s fighting these people, and one of the characters pauses (inaudible) and gets into discussions because it’s a typical (inaudible) thing. But this official declaration she goes through, like an officer of the military, where she revokes the person under the authority of the collective. [00:18:06] He is now a monster, which the psychopaths are. The psychopaths are monsters. That’s how they deal with psychopaths. They don’t have a word for psychopaths. People just (inaudible) and revoke.

THERAPIST: Is this all the young adult?

CLIENT: The young adult fantasy stuff.

THERAPIST: It’s like you’re trying to talk to this audience about—

CLIENT: It is. It’s about who you are in relation to your power. That’s what these stories are about. Each woman has a different way of experiencing who they are in relation to their power. This one is born into it, and embraced it, and understood that as a duty. She’s like, I am capable of doing these things, in the service of the collective, and therefore that’s what I do. In fact all of them have that part, but this one was born that way. She’s not technically human. She’s got abilities people don’t. [00:19:03] Taylor took her power. She earned it, but then accepted it and took it, but begrudgingly to a degree, like, yeah, yeah, yeah. She has a connection to a divine being which she’s able to act (inaudible). (inaudible). We’re equals, you and I. Kayla stands on equal footing with the source of her power.

Sarah is the most powerful of all three of them, but is the artist, and never wanted to become – in fact her strength is what stopped her from being able to follow her dreams. Because she was so strong, they’re like, no, sorry. In the service of the collective, we have to give you a weapon. You’re too strong for us to waste you on building enchanted sewer pipes and stuff. [00:20:00] We need you on the front lines, so that’s where you’re going. I have this flashback scene for a while before she meets the other two characters where she is in the weapon trance, which is what I’m describing as the way I go and I fight. I no longer think of you as a human, and everything is where is your hands, where are their hands? (inaudible). It’s quick, it’s fast.

So that’s what I write her as doing in that state, then there’s this flashback state of where she was just deployed to essentially this war of this race that was discovered, and it’s a scene of her standing on a hilltop, motionless, except for casting horrible, awful spells, and calculating, “It’s more efficient if I wound or maim them, so I’ll shoot his leg off from here, and burn off half of his face, and that will cause terror in people around him who survive. Maiming is more effective psychologically.” [00:21:11] She’s going through all of that as a machine. Yeah, I don’t know. I want to show that it’s a thing she has to do, because she can do it, and of course she has to do it, and she hates it. That’s what the weapon state is for, so she doesn’t have to feel it, but she does afterwards. There’s always afterwards. I don’t know how I deal with that.

How do you deal with PTSD of a person who’s never had to experience the ravages of war until after they happen? I don’t know how that looks like. She writes novels. She has novels she’s writing. There’s a (inaudible). Writing a novel. [00:22:02] Also because novels that have stuff that goes on, on a frontier sell really well. People watch (inaudible). She’s writing a book where (inaudible) fantasy fulfillment thing where she’s really popular. This character she makes, Tara, has lots of friends, very popular, (inaudible). She’s very poorly socialized. So it’s almost this kind of naïve idea of this and this. Then the second part of the series after Kayla moves on to another part of the world, the captain comes to her to replace the (inaudible) and other soldiers. His name is Gavin, looks like the guy in the book, and she’s about to freak out, and blush, and be all sweet when she meets him. [00:23:05]

She’s like, “I can’t, I can’t do that, because I’ll look like an idiot.” So she drops into a weapon state immediately. I think I told you this. There’s this part where there’s a conflict between them of – he’s technically in charge even though she’s far more powerful, but she was deemed unfit for command because of her emotional distress about making these choices. You’re the weapon someone else is aiming, essentially. There was this complication scene where it puts him in front of all these dudes, and he’s trying to get her to stand down, and he wants to send people after (inaudible). [00:24:05] Because they’re not allowed to do that. You’re not allowed to just take off into the wild. There’s power to remain there, and the only reason you would want that is for selfish reasons. So you need to stay here and help us all get it or you’re not one of us.

So of course (inaudible) happens and it’s the face off where he eventually orders her to stand down, at which point she raises this (inaudible) to separate the two of them. This is after they’ve been debating for some time. (inaudible). She’s like, “How dare you? Now I have to do this.” He’s like, “I cannot let you go.” She’s like, “You try to order me.” She’s like, “Well, you can’t order me. There is no way you can stop me from going.” [00:25:06] So he’s trying to lower these walls, (inaudible) wizard, and you’re going to kneel down. This is over now. For that reason, the whole point of I’ve introduced power into this. (inaudible) we were never equal. We will never be equal. This is not salvaging. I have another one where she first understands the mistakes in training, and the guy who trains her is a total asshole, and he gets her and abuses her, and other wizards let this happen because he has the best weapons. He’s not a good person, but he makes the most effective weapons.

Anyway, he’s been trying to force her into weapons (inaudible). [00:26:02] You take all the emotional parts and compartmentalize them and turn them off for a period of time. (inaudible). Your mind is focused on the math of what’s happening. So she has this bit where she’s running scared, and it’s your final exam, and you’re going to pass or I’m going to (inaudible). She knows he’s aiming to cripple her, that if she fails she’s going to be crippled, because he hates her, and she hates him too, and she’s running, and trying to avoid these things and defend herself, and she’s on the defensive, and (inaudible). She’s not as strong as him. She’ll get tired before he does the whole thing. So she’s like, “I have to be smarter somehow.” She’s running, but she’s not afraid anymore. She hasn’t felt clouds of emotions in a long time because there’s been no source for that. [00:27:03]

She’s thinking of how much she hates him, and the only thing she has left right now is this hatred, at which point she’s like, “The only thing I have left is hatred, and at which point she’s able to (inaudible) and understand it, and put it in a box.” So then she becomes the weapon. She starts kicking his ass. It’s completely this dispassionate stuff. She’s like, what’s the most efficient thing to do? Boom. He’s casting fire, so I’ll create a sheet of ice. I bed I could modify it on the fly so that (inaudible) falls back and his hand freezes as ice, solid. This spell shatters metal but it should shatter ice too. Boom. His hand explodes in frozen bloody chunks, drops to the grand, target is (inaudible). She throws a shitload of spells at his chest. [00:28:01] He tries to put a shield up but one of his hands is gone. He gets slammed up against the wall to the point where she’s about to kill him, when another wizard tackles her, and she’s like, okay, snap out of it. You did it.

She looks over and sees this guy with a bloody stump, and other guys burning it to cauterize it. She’s like, what do I do? Oh my gosh. I’m so sorry. The wizard’s like, “No, you’re not sorry. You did well. You did the right thing today.” Her heart just fucking breaks at that point. You maimed this person forever. That was the right thing to do and I’m proud of it. It’s just the – yeah. But from that point in the book, she gets a different teacher, one who is like, “Sorry you had to go through all of that.” [00:29:01] But one who understands. He’s like, “I know how horrible it is. I get it. I’ve come out of the weapon state having done horrible things.” He teaches her how to live with it. But again, there’s a scene where it finally clicks for Kayla. Kayla doesn’t like Sarah because Sarah’s bubbly, and happy, and talkative, and kind of clingy, because she’s like, “Oh wow, friends. I have friends for the first time.” Kayla doesn’t really like her that much. So one day she realizes. She’s like, “Sarah didn’t ask for this. She’s like, Alyssa and I both want to be here. This is where we’ve both wanted to be since we were children. Sarah didn’t get a choice in any of that.” Anyways—

THERAPIST: As you’re talking about that, I was listening to you talk about this thought of you – it’s as if it’s reminding me of a painting, and of like an artist painting something, something that’s deep in their soul. [00:30:20] And letting me see it.

CLIENT: That’s the problem with slash fic. This isn’t explicit stuff. It’s vulnerability. Even under a pen name, it’s like, hello universe. This is sex as I see it.

THERAPIST: What do you see? How do you see it?

CLIENT: I don’t know. I’ve wrote it all from different perspectives, but I’ve focused more on the emotions of the thing, the feeling of being lifted, you know, the strength that the other guy has but also his ability to control it. [00:31:08] I don’t know if you’re familiar with Twilight at all.

THERAPIST: A little.

CLIENT: It’s the most awful thing. So they get married so they can have sex, because everyone has sex when they’re married, it’s traditional. She’s like, “I want to be a human. Will you turn me?” He’s like, “I want to have sex but I’ll lose control.” And he does, and she’s battered and bruised, and it’s really fucked up, this whole thing, and she’s like, it’s okay, because Kristen Stewart’s (inaudible). She’s into domestic abuse without knowing it. It’s just this awful thing, but the story starts off with her pressed up against a wall outside an alley where she met him. [00:32:00] She’s like, “This isn’t some Twilight bullshit, right? You aren’t going to lose control and damage me?” He’s like, “Twilight is such bullshit.” But there’s this whole element of it where every time he’s moving her, he’s a vampire. (inaudible). So he spins her and is moving her about the room in various positions the whole time and is like, “Is this the way you want it?” switches, “How about this?” He’s giving her all these options.

THERAPIST: It’s like power with consent.

CLIENT: Yeah, power with consent, exactly that. So it’s (inaudible).

THERAPIST: But the need to show power, the want and need to show power.

CLIENT: Power is sexy.

THERAPIST: Power is sexy, but also not wanting it to be—

CLIENT: Dangerous. It can’t be dangerous. They want power that’s focused on them. [00:33:00]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: But also something I read, an article the dude wrote about some of his experiences growing up and maturing, and realizing what ingrained sexism (inaudible). One of the key elements to that is he was making out with this girl, and it was going along, and he was like, just tell me to stop if it gets uncomfortable, the polite thing in my generation. We’re raised to be like, “Hey, if you (inaudible), is this all right?” That sort of thing, But then it turns into okay, if something starts to happen you don’t like, let me know. She’s like, “I don’t like that. Women are always asked to tell you when to stop. I would instead like to be given an opportunity to say yes to something as opposed to ‘I have to control this’, rather it be, ‘this is what I want.” [00:34:06]

THERAPIST: Oh I see.

CLIENT: So I build that in—

THERAPIST: To include what a woman wants as opposed to having to say no.

CLIENT: Yeah, especially writing her from (inaudible), because dude sex is not interesting to write. It’s pretty simple. I figured that out reading Changing Bodies, Changing Lives, at the age of 12, in like a fort made of cardboard boxes, flashlight.

THERAPIST: It was in a box somewhere?

CLIENT: Yeah. Seth’s father had built this amazing house, and his wife had kicked him out, so when he was around he had this house we built out of cardboard boxes, (inaudible), cardboard boxes. So when he wasn’t around, we would sneak out there and find his porn mags, or read Changing Bodies, Changing Lives, because my mother didn’t want me reading a sex ed book. [00:35:06] I was like, okay, how can I jack off better? That was my first thing. I was like, that’s awesome. Let’s do that. It was very simple. I was like, I’m doing it right. There’s no real optimal way. You figured out the optimal way. I was like, okay, great. So I went through the sections on women. I was like, how does the female orgasm look? I studied this fucking diagram. I was like, where is the clitoris? Do women find their own clitoris?

THERAPIST: What was compelling about it to you?

CLIENT: Knowledge, how to do it, how do you do that, how to be a good lover, essentially, how to understand it all. It was information, and I was curious, and (inaudible). I read more books, and I got older and (inaudible) sex when I was in high school, and read The Sensual Man which was also interesting. I read a lot of porn. I read some master/slave stuff. [00:36:01] So by the time I actually got to college and was having regular sex with people, I was like, I knew all this stuff already. People were like, “Oh my God. How did you know how to do this?” I’m like, I read about it. I studied it. I’m paying attention to you right now.

THERAPIST: And you wanted that (inaudible). You sought the study of it. You were seeking out the knowledge.

CLIENT: It always mystifies me. The joke is, the man can’t find the clitoris. I’m like, how can you not?

THERAPIST: Just look it up.

CLIENT: (laughter) Exactly. How do you not find the clitoris, even by touch, in the dark, by touch? Once you figure out where you are, and once she’s all turned on, it’s very easy. Then (inaudible) west, straight up from here, ah, there you go, found it. [00:37:01]

THERAPIST: But you looked.

CLIENT: Yeah, the clitoral hood, and exposing the clitoris, it’s like the whole thing, and just how much motions. Women need repetitive motions.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: Men can orgasm from a variety of shifting speeds or whatever, and we tend to benefit from that, more variation, whereas women actually – giving a woman a handjob or that sort of thing, versus going down, whatever it is, you find the pattern that’s right, and you stick with that pattern and repeat it, and that’s how you make a woman come every single time, and quickly. This, this, this, there we go. Boom.

THERAPIST: We’re looking for a woman to respond too, to please her.

CLIENT: That’s the only interesting part of it. I’m going to come. Doesn’t fucking matter. That’s easy for me. [00:38:01] I know I’m going to get mine. That’s not difficult, right? Women are the puzzle. It’s different. You have to bring them alive. You really have to turn them on. (inaudible). We’re both here to get laid. We’re both turned on now. Let’s just go and fuck. But so I read about this stuff, and Ginny’s like, that was really good. Good.

THERAPIST: You showed her – which one did you show her?

CLIENT: Both. They’re published under the (inaudible) archive.

THERAPIST: What was it like to show her?

CLIENT: I don’t know. I was just thinking I hope it’s not shitty, and I hope it’s not like, “You went too far in this direction.” [00:39:04] Essentially I’m like how graphic, how explicit am I supposed to be? It’s really borderline. She’s like, “You see the word cock a few times usually in these stories, you see pussy, in terms of the words, but there’s more of a key to how she gets wet. That’s the stuff.” I’m like, okay, I can write that sort of stuff.

THERAPIST: Did she find it erotic?

CLIENT: I believe so. She said it was really hot.

THERAPIST: Oh, she did?

CLIENT: Yeah, whatever.

THERAPIST: Huh.

CLIENT: So yeah, but I pulled the (inaudible) of contacts, which they all dropped, which is (inaudible), salesman, who I worked with on (inaudible), who was my counterpart when I was trying to sell my services, but as a true salesman from the South, he didn’t (inaudible) containing a relationship with me. [00:40:01] He would call me. We would talk for hours at a time. He never talked about (inaudible). His wife, and his dog, and my dog, and my wife, and shooting ranges, and that’s fun, and that other stuff, and experience in the industry. He’s a good guy, I like the guy, and clearly a salesman, but not a skeezy salesman, but quick and bright, and sees opportunity, he’ll seize it, and if he knows what you want to hear, he’ll code shift into that version of a person.

So I like him and I respect him, but he’s also a salesman. But he works at (inaudible) as a salesman. He sells services. He knows the QA director because he sells QA services. [00:41:01] He has something to gain if I become a QA manager. This is (inaudible). He’s a salesman who has something to gain from me being hired. He’s like, “Send me your resume today. Here’s what I’m going to do. I’m going to call in 48 hours.” I’m like, I know you’ve got (inaudible). Let’s talk about it. He said, “What things?” (inaudible). Have you looked at this? He’s a (inaudible). He’s going to be like, “I’m relocating you from across the country.”

He’s like, “Hey, got kids? Great. He doesn’t have kids, just a wife and two dogs. You don’t have to pay him a lot of money to get him out of here. You get a number, he makes you an offer, there’s no state income tax out here. It’s basically a 10 percent increase on whatever he offers.” I’m like, okay, thanks. He’s like, “Let’s say for instance, $100,000.00, ballpark figure. $110,000.00, $112,000.00.” [00:42:01] I’m like, okay. Thank you for all that information. He’s setting me up to accept an offer. He’s being like a fucking realtor here. I get what (inaudible). I have a sympathetic ear for my services.

THERAPIST: I see what you’re saying, because (inaudible).

CLIENT: And I can get you in there by letting you know what the range is, what you can be expecting for compensation.

THERAPIST: I’m sure that happens all the time.

CLIENT: And that’s what is known to people, but again, he is the one who has something to gain, so he’s the last one I called. Some people would be like, “Why didn’t you call that guy first?” Again, why would you move that trunk? Well because this offer is the best kind.

THERAPIST: Okay. Yeah. That way the other options would be you don’t owe anybody anything and there’s no kind of quid pro quo. [00:43:06]

CLIENT: Yeah. (crosstalk) It’s not like he owes me, but it’s clearly we worked together in the past and it’s going to be advantageous for you to have me there talking to them about how much data services (inaudible), and that will be easy for me because I think Babel is the best, and a little more expensive, but for the best.

THERAPIST: I’m sure people do that all the time. That’s sales for you.

CLIENT: They must. If someone’s in a sensitive position who has influence over their sales.

THERAPIST: He knows QA?

CLIENT: Yeah. That’s what Babel is. They’re a QA company. They do QA and localization. I got them a huge contract with (inaudible).

THERAPIST: You got them a what?

CLIENT: Contract with (inaudible).

THERAPIST: Oh, contract.

CLIENT: At an amazing price. [00:44:00] Like I just hammered them down.

THERAPIST: So they—

CLIENT: They’re localization, which means, I want my game to go to Europe. Okay. We’re going to translate it into British English, French, Italian, German, Spanish. (inaudible). It’s going to Canada, we can also put it in English and (inaudible). It has to have both options.

THERAPIST: He does that from a QA—

CLIENT: Yeah, they hire native speakers to go over all the text, translate it, do translations, and they also do functional testing as well. But they hire (inaudible) talent, and they keep specialists, and reward them well. It’s a lot of money for a tester hour. Usually they want $30.00 to $40.00 for a tester hour, which is wicked expensive. I got them down to $25.00. I got these other offers out there. I said, Ed, here’s the problem. They’re not as good as you are, right? But I can’t sell you guys unless you come down another five percent, whatever it was. [00:45:06] I was like, you need to drop it down to 25 if I’m going to sell to these guys, so he did.

Then I met the CEO, and he came to meet me, and he was like, “I just want to be very clear.” He’s like, “It’s professional courtesy that you will never let anyone know how much we are charging you for this. We can’t let word of that get out, and we’re really committing to this under the understanding that there are a lot of games coming out over the years.” I said, listen, here’s the deal, here’s what I’m offering you. Do these games at this price, and if you’re good like you say you are, then you are who we go to. I don’t sign anything, but I’m like, this is it. (crosstalk) Exactly. Give us a cheap price.

THERAPIST: The margin might not be as big but (crosstalk). [00:46:00]

CLIENT: (inaudible). So they’re still doing that. Still happy with them.

THERAPIST: Is that right? They still do it for Melody?

CLIENT: Yeah. So yeah. (inaudible). I was like, I’m setting you up, guys.

THERAPIST: Oh yeah.

CLIENT: It was Ed and I working together on their CEO. Me and my financial director, Ed, how do we work together. We both know this is a great relationship. (crosstalk)

THERAPIST: They know if they get you into there, that (inaudible).

CLIENT: Definitely. I’m totally (inaudible). (laughter) At the same time, I’m like, no, we need a small internal team. I’ve got that, but if we’re going to outsource, don’t waste money on shit.

THERAPIST: They’re looking for somebody now?

CLIENT: Yeah. They want a QA manager right now. [00:47:00] Ta-da.

THERAPIST: Still no word from one of those guys up here?

CLIENT: I got word from a friend of mine who started there, and he actually recommended a different guy we used to work with for the job I was going for before he knew I was going for it.

THERAPIST: Oh, okay. Did they hire him?

CLIENT: They’re probably going to. He’s got his (inaudible) Masters certificate, which is a bullshit thing.

THERAPIST: What does that cost again?

CLIENT: I don’t know, a few hundred dollars. Actually if I can afford it, I should just do it, but the thing is, I can’t afford shit right now. Ginny’s got her $2,000.00 grant that came in, because she applied for a grant years ago to help her pay back her student loans. So $2,000.00 bucks just came in. We were going to use that money to pay off her student loans, but right now—

THERAPIST: That would be a good investment if you think it would help you.

CLIENT: Yeah, and Ginny’s actually going to consolidate all her loans. We can’t refinance right now because she has too much debt, and not enough income to make up for that debt. [00:48:04] (crosstalk) starting using Ginny’s name, which she was making payments on, until one month he fucked up and missed a big payment, and I have a credit score of 800. Ginny has a credit score of 720, and that’s (inaudible) for refinancing. I’m so pissed at him, because he’s always, “On the up and up, and (inaudible).” I’m like, you just fucked her, and by extension, me. But that’s not the important part. You knocked 80 points off of your princess’s credit rating.

I’m like, I want to have that conversation with him, but Ginny would be like, “I can’t believe you said that to him.” He’s all about man to man. What am I going to do, be like, “Oh no. I get it man, you fucked up.” You fucked up, fine. You’re very fucked up, but I want to make it very clear how badly. [00:49:08] It’s not enough to just be like, “My bad, I’m sorry.” It’s like, yeah, good, you are sorry. Here are some specific reasons of why you ought to be. She’s like, I can’t get that off my credit thing because I’d have to press charges.

THERAPIST: Oh is that right?

CLIENT: Yeah, because he used a credit card in her name for years without her permission.

THERAPIST: How long did he wait to pay it?

CLIENT: He had been paying it off regularly, but he started using it back at the turn of the century. So he’s been using it for 15 years.

THERAPIST: He must have (inaudible) more than once.

CLIENT: Yeah, something happened, and Ginny got a phone call like, “Hey, you need to pay your bill.” What the hell are you talking about? She’s like, “I don’t have that card anymore. Someone’s been using my card regularly for 15 years.” So she calls and she’s like, what do I do? He’s like, oh shit. That was me. I didn’t think they were going to call you. [00:50:04]

THERAPIST: But then you were going to find out if you ever ran a credit report or something.

CLIENT: Right, and is a problem because of the refinancing stuff. We can’t refinance until we get that removed from her record, which we’re going to try to do by explaining it was a family member. She couldn’t press charges. It’s a whole thing.

THERAPIST: Yeah, and that’s a pain in the ass to get that done.

CLIENT: But we’re going to consolidate our loans. But anyway, here’s the reality. There’s a decent chance that I move to Portland and spend three months out there without her, and she’s here. I’m like, am going to start fucking other women when I’m out there? It’s down to less than once a month again.

THERAPIST: Jeez, man. [00:51:02]

CLIENT: Yeah, Fuck it. I have better relationships with (inaudible) girls than with my wife, you know? With fucking prostitutes man, that I’m more intimate with.

THERAPIST: Well I know we’ve got to get down to that, get through that more, because that’s a serious thing.

CLIENT: Yeah, there’s a lot going on. It is a serious thing. It is a serious thing. I feel like you can’t press on it because you’re not the one making any money.

THERAPIST: Oh yeah. Has she been more stressed then?

CLIENT: Yeah, because of course she’s stressed, we’re in a difficult financial situation, but people live in difficult financial situations. You can’t hold it over my head for a reason why we’re having sex 12 times a year.

THERAPIST: No, no.

CLIENT: In the last five years.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: We’re probably going to have a fight about that tonight after the play. [00:52:00]

THERAPIST: Well you want to just – this is a thing you’re trying to have that’s a good thing for the marriage.

CLIENT: It’s the only fight we have frequently, and I just—

THERAPIST: I think it’s a good thing for a man to want—

CLIENT: I fucking need to fuck people. I’m built that way.

THERAPIST: And you want to be close to your wife too.

CLIENT: Yes, preferably, but you know what? I get closer and closer every day to just being like, “Don’t worry. You don’t have to. It’s not a problem.” Like, “But no, me.” No, I’m sorry. Clearly you have no time for this. You can say whatever the fuck you want.

THERAPIST: We’ve got to talk about this.

CLIENT: I know, we’ve got to go.

THERAPIST: We need to spend some time talking about this.

CLIENT: Yeah, Monday.

THERAPIST: Monday.

END TRANSCRIPT