TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:
BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:
CLIENT: Hi. So, in the spirit of asking you for things do you by any chance have any earlier sessions on Friday or just this Friday?
THERAPIST: Let's see.
CLIENT: I can make 4:30, but we're (unclear) out of town.
THERAPIST: I don't.
CLIENT: Okay.
THERAPIST: But let me see if I can switch something around.
(Pause): [00:00:50 00:01:08]
THERAPIST: I'll see what I can do.
CLIENT: Thank you. (inaudible) apparently isn't due until the end of the month which I don't know, we did still, you know, (unclear) and were like, 'do you really want us to come visit?' And they're like, 'Absolutely.'
THERAPIST: End of May?
CLIENT: End of oh, I'm sorry. I said end of March didn't I? It was the end of June.
THERAPIST: You said, 'end of the month' and I assumed you meant -
CLIENT: Oh yeah, (unclear). But still, I feel really good.
THERAPIST: Good.
CLIENT: They were people who I had forgotten about and then I remembered. (Unclear). Yeah.
CLIENT: James's not doing very well. He's really sad. (inaudible) He does not feel like he can talk to anyone here. He doesn't feel like people will be able to handle this.
THERAPIST: Is he seeing anybody?
CLIENT: Yeah, he is. And it's really helpful. I mean, see her as somebody he can tell things to. So that's good.
THERAPIST: Yeah.
CLIENT: I feel like it could have gone either way but is really good therapy. Yeah. I told him to try, that some people are better at handling things then you think they're going to be. Yeah.
(Pause): [00:03:38 00:03:56]
CLIENT: I told him I thought we should do couples counseling again. (Pause) that I feel confident in our relationships with Franco and his (unclear) that when he needs to complain about me that he can complain about me to those people. It will be okay. (Laughs)
(Pause): [00:04:22 00:04:39]
CLIENT: They get very drunk on Saturdays and Sundays.
(Pause): [00:04:42 00:04:51] CLIENT: Which he does like once in a blue moon gets very sad. He doesn't handle alcohol very well, like (Laughing) it's a really good thing we had our kind of bachelor party two nights before the wedding because he spent the entire day before the wedding throwing up. :
THERAPIST: Really?
CLIENT: I mean, you know. It was sad he was (unclear) and we were all kind of setting things up the day before and he was supposed to be there. And he was like, 'no, still working on sitting upright for longer than 10 minutes at a time. Not going to be there.' (Laughs) So I showed up at the rehearsal at like five in the afternoon, or five in the evening and my dad knew exactly what was going on and said, 'Where you been? What's been holding you up?' And he said, 'I had too much to drink, sir.' I don't think he said "sir," but he basically was just like, 'what?' (Laughs) (inaudible).
(Pause): [00:06:14 00:06:51]
CLIENT: And I feel like there isn't very much I can do about it. Because he's not upset with me right now. He was upset with me six months ago.
(Pause): [00:07:09 00:07:35]
CLIENT So, not that I don't try to come up with, not that I don't constantly come up with things that he is going to be upset with me right now and he tries to preemptively fix them which doesn't work that well because usually they're not things that he has no interest or cares about.
(Pause): [00:07:52 00:08:00]
CLIENT: And one of the things that he does care about I'm often so anxious that I end up just (unclear) divorce.
(Pause): [00:08:01 00:08:29]
CLIENT: (inaudible).
(Pause): [00:08:29 00:09:03]
CLIENT: And I don't think he wants to be here. I don't think he wants to stay here.
(Pause): [00:09:06 00:09:59]
CLIENT: He started crying in church on Sunday after the service was over.
(Pause): [00:10:02 00:10:07]
CLIENT: (Unclear).
(Pause): [00:10:08 00:10:37]
CLIENT: It's hard not to be a student anymore. It feels like (unclear) leaving Brown and not being either teaching or learning and it's kind of just adding to everything that's been going on with the ECT and all. And I don't feel like I can be the person that I was and I don't know who I can be now.
(Pause): [00:11:27 00:11:44]
CLIENT: You know, the person that I was (inaudible) several times and did some pretty self-destructive things. I don't want to necessarily want to be that person, but it's just that -
(Pause): [00:12:07 [00:13:20]
CLIENT: (Unclear) said a couple of times recently like that she admires me for one thing or another. I find that very un-self like.
THERAPIST: What is it you're feeling? Or (unclear) tells me, like unacceptable.
(Pause): [00:13:37 00:13:49]
CLIENT: I don't know about unacceptable. It's not somebody to look up to.
(Pause): [00:13:54 00:15:05]
CLIENT: Geoffrey is coming back to town in July. He wants to have dinner together.
THERAPIST: He's the teacher?
CLIENT: A teacher here. He's very sweet. He makes all his plans two months in advance. (Unclear) here, in July. (Laughs)
THERAPIST: Right.
CLIENT: Like I don't know that we'll still be in Denver in July. (Laughs)
(Pause): [00:15:32 00:15:55]
CLIENT: Which is a little scary.
THERAPIST: (inaudible) apply for some jobs.
CLIENT: Yeah. And we'll still be here in July. Didn't apply for one because it was (unclear) then, too soon.
(Pause): [00:16:14 00:16:34]
CLIENT: I guess (unclear) can't leave because he's going to MSU. (inaudible) this person I didn't think I (inaudible) anymore.
THERAPIST: Right.
(Pause): [00:16:50 00:17:01]
CLIENT: And now I understand, sort of makes things easier, just kind of embarrassing. Like really, really embarrassing.
(Pause): [00:17:16 00:17:21]
THERAPIST: That you (inaudible) that way?
CLIENT: Um hmm [yes]. (Pause) Because I don't really think that that's what I'm doing.
(Pause): [00:17:30 00:17:42]
CLIENT: I've been tutoring this girl for the SAT II. She's taking it next week. (inaudible). Yeah, she's not likely to get below 650 so she's going to be okay in some sense but I'm not sure that she'll get a 700, which is what she wants. But she's also in 10th grade so why she's taking it now I don't know. (Laughs) But she asked me if I took it and I said yeah I did and she said, 'what did you get?' And I said I don't quite remember but I got 800 or close to it and she said, okay, well how did you study? And like I didn't study for that. (Laughs) And I'm not sure it was the hardest part about helping her prep for this was figuring out the ways in which one might study for a test like this. Which I feel like I figured it out pretty well, but.
(Pause): [00:18:51 00:19:06]
CLIENT: I miss that.
THERAPIST: Yeah.
(Pause): [00:19:11 00:19:59]
CLIENT: I told her to get some sleep. (inaudible). You will be amazed at how much faster your brain works when you've been sleeping.
(Pause): [00:20:08 00:20:30]
CLIENT: Teaching test preps is really frustrating because you're teaching something that doesn't matter at all. Like at all, at all. So like I see this girl and I'm realizing she's the kind of person who assesses her own strengths and weaknesses, decides what she needs to do to get better and actively seeks those things out. It's like, she's going to be fine no matter what score she gets on it. It's like those things are way more important than anything we're working on. Like her mom doesn't see that nor the tutoring company doesn't see that and so what do I do either than tell her that she's awesome, which she is and -
(Pause): [00:21:28 00:21:51]
THERAPIST: Boy, I think that kind of pisses you off, which (unclear) worries you.
CLIENT: How do you mean? Worries me.
THERAPIST: I guess sometimes being angry makes you worried like at (unclear) thing, like looking at (unclear).
(Pause): [00:22:19 00:22:28]
CLIENT: It does just now when I (unclear) being very helpful and I (unclear).
(Pause): [00:22:40 00:23:18]
CLIENT: But you know, I'm really, I didn't start getting any sleep (inaudible) like school. I (inaudible).
THERAPIST: Hmm [what]?
CLIENT: I don't know what I'm trying to say, but -
(Pause): [00:23:36 [00:24:03]
THERAPIST: I wonder if part of it is that when you're actually, it's when you're helping someone who is being put in the same position, which is in some ways the one that you were put in which was the thing that you were being made to feel what mattered about yourself like being the smart one which isn't a bad thing, but wasn't where it was at.
CLIENT: Yeah. It helps if I (inaudible). The thing is like it's been a while, like I feel as though I've worked very hard not to put all my eggs in the smart person's basket. I feel like I've been pretty deliberate about that. And when it comes down to it, it doesn't work that well.
THERAPIST: I see.
CLIENT: And you know, yeah, like working with like Kaley, this is this girl it hard because it's like I worked with her for six weeks and then she goes away and takes the test and then returns to her life where everyone seems to be telling her that the things that are important are the things that everyone seems to be telling her are important are not actually things that are important. And I can't do anything about that.
(Pause): [00:26:06 00:26:48]
CLIENT: It feels like I, you know it' hard not to be a student anymore. It's also hard to feel like I've had to realize that the things that I put my trust in actually weren't there ever.
(Pause): [00:27:08 00:27:18]
CLIENT: Like the higher you go in academia, it doesn't actually get better.
THERAPIST: (inaudible).
CLIENT: Like people don't get more idealistic. People don't get better at being idealistic. There are still lots of idealistic people but they pretty much just get screwed all the way up.
THERAPIST: I see.
CLIENT: As far as I can see anyway. (Pause) I don't know. It's like I feel like I've lost something huge but I'm not even sure what that is. (Crying)
(Pause): [00:27:53 00:28:47]
THERAPIST: I know (unclear), I thought so much of it is that though you're leaving academia coincided with your depression, I'm getting that it wasn't a casualty of the depression. But more so, (unclear) like you sort of reckoned differently about what you were doing and what it was doing to you what you were doing in being in academia and what it was doing for you and I gather like (inaudible). I don't mean that like you got some new information. I mean like what you're saying now that you lost your (unclear) became disillusioned or couldn't continue to believe some things about it that you have.
CLIENT: Yeah.
THERAPIST: And it's not because you were depressed and saw it negatively, but was a cause of feeling you didn't have any (unclear) but you did.
CLIENT: I think that's right. I (unclear) like thinking I can still be the person that I want to be and do the kind of work that I want to do within the system, if the system is actually working like I think it -
THERAPIST: I see.
CLIENT: Thinking that until I just couldn't anymore.
THERAPIST: There was not room for you and the kind of work you needed to do in that system.
CLIENT: Yeah. I can (unclear) see like back and forth like (unclear) now.
(Pause): [00:31:39 00:32:53]
CLIENT: That's why I feel like I've had that feeling that the exact thing happened when I was an undergrad. And I got very depressed then, too. (Laughs)
(Pause): [00:33:20 00:33:33]
THERAPIST: Also, maybe in a smaller way, like every 15 minutes, in you're interacting with the mental health system?
CLIENT: How do you mean?
THERAPIST: Times like, this is the thing that's going to help. Like, this is the thing that you can place your trust and hopes in for making things better.
CLIENT: I sort of feel like I'm the sucker if I believe them at this point.
THERAPIST: (inaudible).
CLIENT: But I'm the fucker. (Laughs)
(Pause): [00:34:01 00:34:52]
CLIENT: Yeah, that's a very difficult thing.
(Pause): [00:34:47 00:35:07]
CLIENT: Yeah, a lot of it is like I choose to be the naive person who gets hurt (unclear), rather than just being the person who just doesn't believe anything anybody says. But, it hurts.
(Pause): [00:35:20 00:36:20]
CLIENT: I guess I do feel pretty similarly to the mental health system as to academia in that I think like, 'that would be really fantastic if it actually worked.' But sometimes it actually doesn't seem to work very well. But it's also the best we've got.
(Pause): [00:36:42 00:37:04]
THERAPIST: I imagine that much of the time you don't really feel there is anything you can or anyone that you can lean on.
(Pause): [00:37:13 00:37:19]
CLIENT: Well, I try to. I trust Dr. Hoffsteder (sp?) That's about it.
(Pause): [00:37:26 00:37:52]
CLIENT: I don't know where your head is. I know in the broad course of treatment that in the next five minutes -
THERAPIST: Oh, I see.
CLIENT: (Laughs) I know. Here I am.
(Pause): [00:38:08 00:39:07]
CLIENT: When you look at it like that, it seems like a really bad option. (Laughs)
(Pause): [00:39:10 00:39:29]
CLIENT: Yeah, that's the thing, like I trust you as a person, but I don't trust that like I don't trust that your methods are replicable. (Laughs) I just I don't I don't know.
(Pause): [00:39:58 00:41:24]
CLIENT: Just because you are helping me, doesn't give me any reason to believe that the next person I work with will hurt me a lot.
THERAPIST: Yeah.
CLIENT: I feel like it would be not very smart or wise of me to trust the next person.
THERAPIST: I see.
CLIENT: But, you know, (unclear) a third of the time I end up getting really, really hurt and a third of the time I get by some other people and they help somehow and the third time eh. It doesn't happen.
THERAPIST: Um hmm [yes].
(Pause): [00:42:19 [00:42:39]
THERAPIST: I wonder if there's a
(Pause): [00:42:40 00:42:50]
THERAPIST: There's a pretty fundamental in this about the question of people who should I think -
(Pause): [00:43:10 00:43:28]
THERAPIST: I think you tended to trust people, or you trust people now in a way like in a fairly partial way. I mean I hear what you're saying that you trust me personally. I'm not like this is how -
(Pause): [00:43:43 00:43:53]
THERAPIST: You're really wary about how much it's okay to lean on somebody, I think. I mean you take a lot of it and put your heart on it, I think but in a kind of surprisingly, but still kind of there, in an important way.
CLIENT: Yeah. So when I say I trust somebody it doesn't really, necessarily mean that I actually trust them?
THERAPIST: (Laughs) (cross talk inaudible). Yeah, I know.
(Pause): [00:44:27 00:44:30]
THERAPIST: I do think it's (unclear) is here, but I think you generally really don't believe that other people would want to, would really be able to like hear and take in how things really are for you.
CLIENT: That makes sense.
THERAPIST: Which I guess is sort of a particular kind of (unclear) of how people are (unclear) of some things, but isn't an issue to be mad at people, is it (inaudible).
CLIENT: Yeah.
THERAPIST: We should stop.
CLIENT: Yeah.
THERAPIST: I'll let you know about Friday.
CLIENT: Okay.
END TRANSCRIPT
