TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:
BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:
CLIENT: So we're on next week for Tuesday and Friday.
THERAPIST: Yeah. I'm sorry for missing Monday but like we -
CLIENT: Yeah. Okay.
THERAPIST: And, let's see I, over the next two months expect to sort of fairly often to have some openings on Wednesday morning early-ish. The earliest is at 7:45, but if it's (unclear) temporary, I can come in at 7:30 those days until (unclear) gets back.
CLIENT: Okay. I don't think it would make a difference. Let me sound out (Unclear) and find out if that would work for her.
THERAPIST: Absolutely.
CLIENT: She did say that when she gets in at 9 she is the first person in the office and they work for her.
THERAPIST: Okay.
CLIENT: But let me ask her.
THERAPIST: Yeah, let me know if at least, so far I don't think it will be a regular thing, but I know most of the ones in July I'll have and so, yeah.
CLIENT: Okay. Thanks.
THERAPIST: Sure.
CLIENT: Yeah, I feel like that would be good. I'm having a tough day. I'm sending Jason cookies and my mom her birthday present. Which I've been trying to do for Denver actually, but haven't been able to make happen and I sort of melted down with James today, this morning. So the good news is, the insurance has already processed the claims from April, which is amazing except for two, inexplicably who knows. The bad news is that for half of them they sent us the process claim but they didn't send us a check, so I was calling asking what's going on with that and it seems like they sent the check separately and just who knows?
THERAPIST: I got a bunch of the sort of the type of paperwork that usually indicates they're sending claims and the check to somebody, in any case, not sending it to me. But anyway if they put a check in their maybe I can just sign it over to you (unclear) I can do that (unclear).
CLIENT: I really appreciate that. Yeah. I think it's going to be fine.
THERAPIST: If I can just save you the hassle of trying to get the check from them.
(Pause): [00:03:44 00:04:53]
THERAPIST: Did you get these just in the last few days?
CLIENT: Yeah.
THERAPIST: (inaudible)
(Pause): [00:05:00 00:05:10]
CLIENT: Thanks for checking.
THERAPIST: Sure.
CLIENT: I mean, the point really of bringing it up is like, on the one hand I feel like I'm dealing with this huge thing that can control my life and it's fucking with me just because it can. On the other hand, James keeps our accounts and so James is the person who has been handling the lot of this but I'm the person who calls the insurance company. And I just can't do what he wants me to do and I can't they tell me there's nothing we can do which is usually a lot because what they always say and I believe them. But that's not good enough for James but I also don't want to say well, you can call the insurance company because I don't want to add yet more to the list of things that he does for me. I just feel like I can't get it right.
(Pause): [00:06:55 00:07:13]
CLIENT: They tell me you're screwed and there's nothing we can do and I say, oh, okay, that's sounds familiar. Of course, that's sort of how it always goes and of course one tends to say, no, of course there's something you can do. But I don't know how to make that happen.
THERAPIST: Right.
CLIENT: It seems like part it seems to me like part of the pattern of me feeling like I can't be what James wants me to be and do things right for him and I'm pretty sure that's not James being picky or controlling. I'm pretty sure that's me. But I can't shake it.
(Pause): [00:08:30 00:09:15]
CLIENT: Work's fine. Overall, I think they're probably happy with me. But I can't feel like I'm doing a good job. I think I'm actually doing pretty well but I can't make that count for anything. The kids are really interesting. (Laughs) The five-year-old, Jackson (sp?) seems like every couple of days will do something that's like deliberately egregious to see what I'll do. So I like stop, and hold hands and we go out into the parking lot and he looks at me and he walks out of the parking lot. Or like, don't kick you sister and he kicks his sister and he looks at me. And he knows I do whatever I do send him up to his room or I did yell at him in the parking lot. I said, 'Jackson' like very loudly and I went over and grabbed onto him and sat down and said, okay, this is why you absolutely have to look at me when I say that. Period. But it's like for the rest of the day after that he not only like mostly does what I ask him, more or less for a five year old, (Laughs) but like he has gone out of his way to be helpful for me like cleaned up the room, like cleaned up their toys without really being asked or and I don't know I just think that's hilarious. And it's good to know, like okay, it's like he wants to know that there are going to be consequences if he messes with me so wants to trust me in a way. Very interesting.
(Pause): [00:12:06 00:12:29]
CLIENT: But you know, actually I think the hours are going to be about right. Like just three days nonstop and then four days to not be working. (inaudible) pick apart every interaction and I shouldn't have done it that way, I should have done it this way. I should have done that. Maybe Jackson hates me. Maybe when he's really old enough to have the option of not adoring someone who is with him for a long period of time, who pays attention to him.
THERAPIST: Yeah.
CLIENT: Yeah.
(Pause): [00:13:29 00:13:57]
CLIENT: I saw on Facebook yesterday that a guy from my department graduated with his PhD and I was very jealous and on the page someone asked him what's next? and he said, well, I'm working at Apple and applying for adjunct positions and I (laughs) still feel bad but reaffirmed that I should have left. It just really, really hurts. (Crying)
(Pause): [00:14:29 00:16:21]
THERAPIST: All right.
CLIENT: It's okay.
(Pause): [00:16:19 00:16:30]
CLIENT: We were (unclear) for a couple of weeks.
(Pause): [00:16:32 00:16:59]
CLIENT: (inaudible) is next week. It's just kind of a yearly, massive uncomfortableness. You know. I feel like it's really important that I not forget it (unclear). I've sort of given up on sending her the right thing because I have no idea what she wants and she buys what she wants. The things she wants she can get. She's not in I don't think about her all that much and so I do forget and don't think about it until about a month before and don't make plans.
(Pause): [00:18:25 00:18:30]
CLIENT: (inaudible) the hardest.
(Pause): [00:18:30 00:18:41]
CLIENT: I think there is something in me that I think is pretty (inaudible).
THERAPIST: (inaudible).
CLIENT: Yeah. She probably won't wear it, but she'll also probably be glad to have it.
(Pause): [00:19:02 00:19:15]
THERAPIST: Did it sort of distract you when I had to pull out my (inaudible)?
CLIENT: Not really.
THERAPIST: (inaudible).
CLIENT: No.
(Pause): [00:19:21 00:19:30]
THERAPIST: (inaudible) how hard it was saw this guy graduate I think turned out to do something for your mom is (inaudible).
CLIENT: Yeah. I guess I feel like I'm upset or sad about, or anxious about a lot of different things and none of them is overwhelming but none of them is winning so like I (unclear), (Laughs)
THERAPIST: Yeah.
(Pause): [00:20:22 00:20:27]
CLIENT: And I don't know what to say about the (unclear). (Pause): [00:20:35 00:20:52]
CLIENT: Like I've talked about it a lot but I'm just sad.
THERAPIST: Yeah.
CLIENT: It's not really a new thing. It's just being sad.
THERAPIST: I wonder maybe if it's like what you said other people getting stuff while you don't. (inaudible). I get that when the insurance says, 'sorry' and you're like, 'okay.' Or, In other words, you don't get to push back. (inaudible) works out okay.
CLIENT: I hadn't thought of it like that. (inaudible). One thing I think is really gratifying is to be around kids who aren't miserable and be a part of that. But yeah, hey, I think it does also make me (inaudible) I guess. But you know I make myself feel okay about the way my childhood was by just saying, 'well, I guess that's just the way it had to be.' I guess it is the way it had to be for me but not how everybody grows up.
THERAPIST: That sort of does away with what it was like that it went that way.
CLIENT: How do you mean?
THERAPIST: It seems to me that you sort of use the thought, 'that's the way it had to be,' not exactly as a justification, but as a way to kind of shut the door on what it actually was like that it was that way. I mean, all the ways that it felt like it shouldn't be that way.
CLIENT: Yeah.
(Pause): [00:24:41 00:25:34]
CLIENT: I'm really afraid that I'm going to be to other people what my mom was to me.
(Pause): [00:25:37 00:26:05]
THERAPIST: That must be part of why it's so difficult when you can't do things (unclear) somebody like James.
CLIENT: Yeah.
THERAPIST: (inaudible).
CLIENT: I just don't know what to do about it. I don't know how to avoid it.
(Pause): [00:27:22 00:27:46]
CLIENT: I feel like I'm failing James in the same way that (unclear) failed me is sort of a it feels like I'm right there, and it's horrible in that it feels inevitable.
(Pause): [00:28:10 00:28:30]
CLIENT: Feeling helpless is one of the ways I feel it.
(Pause): [00:28:55 00:30:27]
CLIENT: I'm fixated on like if I can make him a birthday cake I will because I can't look outside myself and I can take care of somebody else (inaudible). (Crying)
(Pause): [00:30:49 00:31:26]
CLIENT: I feel like when I was doing really badly and it feels like the whole time I kept saying either to myself or to James maybe I didn't actually say it, but it feels like it, but I said, 'this is too much of a burden for him.' I'm hurting him by being this sad. I'm hurting him with the way that I am. He's not going to be able to handle this. And -
THERAPIST: Stuff like that.
CLIENT: Okay. That's good. So you got this? Good. (Laugh) So then James was saying, 'no, It's okay. Do what you need to do to take care of yourself. And, 'it's okay,' and, 'I'll be fine.' And, no I was totally right. He's not okay. And he's not okay with me and he's (crying) really angry with me and it was too much for him and (crying) -
(Pause): [00:32:33 00:32:46]
CLIENT: But I guess I'm mad at him because he could have just believed me. (Crying)
THERAPIST: But he had to get (inaudible).
CLIENT: Yeah. (Crying)
(Pause): [00:32:58 00:33:21]
CLIENT: Allergies (unclear) really bad.
(Pause): [00:33:23 00:33:35]
CLIENT: But I don't know what to do now. (Crying) (Pause): [00:33:49 00:34:11]
CLIENT: I've been thinking about what you said in the session on Tuesday about when I say I trust somebody it doesn't actually, necessarily mean that I trust them according to what other people think the word means. And I kind of think well, yeah, of course, (laughs).
THERAPIST: Yeah.
(Pause): [00:34:33 00:34:42]
CLIENT: The more I trust James the less I can take care of it.
(Pause): [00:34:43 00:34:54]
CLIENT: I feel like I believed him when he said, 'it's okay, take care of yourself.'
THERAPIST: Right.
CLIENT: So I took care of myself so I think I should not have.
THERAPIST: Right.
(Pause): [00:35:03 00:35:59]
THERAPIST: What's actually going on between the two of you?
CLIENT: It's hard to say, you know. We're sort of being very gentle with each other with constant understanding that things aren't actually okay but -
THERAPIST: Regards his leaving?
CLIENT: No. He's not. I don't think he will. I really know that he won't and I really know that I wouldn't leave him.
THERAPIST: You do.
CLIENT: What do you mean?
THERAPIST: You want to kill yourself.
CLIENT: (inaudible). (Laughs) I sort of think I should get a daily gold star for that.
THERAPIST: (Laughs)
CLIENT: Yeah. No, yeah.
THERAPIST: I think that's a lot of what I meant (unclear).
(Pause): [00:37:17 00:37:22]
CLIENT: You know, so we like, for me at least, I believe that eventually things are going to be okay and I just don't know how. I don't know when. And -
THERAPIST: How not okay are (unclear)?
CLIENT: It's hard for me to say. I don't know. You know, like I think it's a case of I am more than usually anxious because I feel like whenever I do something to irritate him that, you know, there's this huge big thing that he's upset with me about behind that and also he feels like I can't do anything right. And I think for him like you know, I think he's just really sad, himself, and so more like, irritable, than usual and will snap at me and then it's like everything that I do that irritates him, there's also that. 'Oh, and by the way, my life is in this place I really don't want it to be and I was terrified that you were going to kill yourself for this long period of time and I feel hurt and betrayed by that.' Like everything taps into the big, giant thing.
(Pause): [00:39:01 00:39:10]
CLIENT: I'm like, that could be. But you know, we're pretty, in some ways, pretty normal, like we're pretty nice to each other.
THERAPIST: Yeah.
(Pause): [00:39:27 00:39:51]
THERAPIST: I guess what I'm asking because I'm curious, is I didn't know and in a way I still don't know I was reminded a little bit of when you used to say about being (unclear) suicidal that like it's always there, could never change, was always the same, was always that bad, it was inevitable. And I (unclear) like, huh? You know, like it's perfectly bad, and this causes it and that causes it, you know what I'm saying? And it wasn't so monolithic and so inevitable, so it wasn't monolithic and inevitable. And I know there's some reality to what you're saying and everything, and it is, but in a way it sounded like you cast it as being exactly what you feared but I guess it kind of seems to me you didn't. I mean, It wasn't in things you said that things are not okay between the two of you, that he's probably resentful, he's reassessing it in some ways, but when you said he's not leaving or putting everything on the table, and he's upset with you and there's this giant thing but to be honest, there was that giant thing the whole time. And there may be more reality clearly there's more reality to it now in view of what he's telling you how he's reacting, but I'm pretty sure you felt that giant thing even when he was telling you it was okay.
CLIENT: Yes. (Laughs)
THERAPIST: And it sort of makes me wonder how much of the giant thing is him and how much of the giant thing is you and I don't know but I imagine you can see what I'm getting at, or, why I'm not sure.
CLIENT: Yeah.
THERAPIST: We should stop.
CLIENT: Okay.
THERAPIST: See you on Tuesday and I'll let you know if I hear about Wednesday.
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