Client "AP", Session 34: December 17, 2012: Client discusses a recent family party and the feelings it uncovered about the death of his father. Client discusses issues with his current relationship. trial

in Psychoanalytic Psychotherapy Collection by Dr. Abigail McNally; presented by Abigail McNally, fl. 2012 (Alexandria, VA: Alexander Street, 2014, originally published 2014), 1 page(s)

TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:


BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: This girl's so nice. I mean, they're all nice. But I don't know where she's from or whatever. I got a part. I walked into the coffee shop (ph) and my coffee was ready. She's been doing that like the last three or four times. It's very sweet. It's really nice.

THERAPIST: She knows you.

CLIENT: Yeah. We're cool like that at the coffee shop. So, my grandmother's getting a lot worse. Yeah. Yesterday we were at my uncle's for my little cousin's birthday. So now my grandmother really doesn't like going to their house. She really hates... And that's all she'll talk about. She refuses to talk about anything else. I think it's just... It's funny because I see the progression. [00:00:59]

She started... Remember? I think I was saying for even like two years or whatever, she'd always be driving and she'd be like, "Whoa, the trees are so big." Do you remember? I was saying that.

THERAPIST: Yes.

CLIENT: And I was like there's something so poetic about that. But now it's turned into... Like I think she can't handle... I don't know what it is. Who knows. But it must be something about it's woodsy and their house is big and... I don't know. There's something. She just hated it and was very... I mean, really. She was like, "We're not going to stay long, right? I'm going to leave." You know? So there's that. Then she can't handle any noise. She was getting very, kind of angry and she was kind of scary the kids a little bit, the little ones and, at one point, she called my godson... She called him like stupid or something. So we were all like, "Whoa, whoa." My mom was really... See, my mom was being so good. I noticed she went over to him and was just like, "I love you, honey. I love you." [00:02:05]

You know? Because he was like, "What the fuck?" So she didn't eat any... She was not eating. So that was bad. She was looking at her rice salad, chicken, you know. She was looking at it saying, "What is this?" That was very new. She was like, "Am I supposed to eat this or what?" It's like (SIGH) damn. But I was very proud of like all of us. Like we were all like... I think we're all handling it well. You know what I mean? Like I think we're all accepting kind of what's happening.

(PAUSE) [00:03:00]

CLIENT: It doesn't really like bother me as much anymore now. Like she was at our... I drove them there and we were just like talking over and just, you know, much more lighthearted. Like she doesn't know what's going on. It doesn't help to get all melodramatic about it especially in front of her. So it actually ended up being a nice time. So... I was really worried that they were going to talk politics, especially after that gun thing because I'm done. Like that is just so fucking sad and I've been so angry about that. I was like, "Oh man. I hope they don't..." Because I was like, "I don't think I'm going to be able to control myself." You know? Like... [00:04:01]

It didn't even... It came up but we didn't talk about it. We didn't talk about any politics. So it was good. (PAUSE) But... (PAUSE) Yeah, I mean, I... I don't know. You don't want to be morbid but I almost feel like this might... I don't know. Like it's probably the last kind of holidays that I think we might have with her. I just don't know how it can go on for another year like this. How could her body... But... So...

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: It's really different to have, knowing that half the time. [00:05:01]

CLIENT: I think that's what's happening is we're all just like, "Hey, at least she's here." We've lost other people so young. She's 89, 90 years old. I mean, we all, we're all going to go at some point. How nice to be old, surrounded by your family. You know? So...

THERAPIST: Well, even for your family to have time, be making peace, saying goodbye.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's kind of like it's... We're very lucky with my grandmother and my grand... Both of them... My grandfather was at least mentally sharp but, still, being old, there's like a dip of a... Like we had time to... It didn't... It wasn't like so traumatic. It was like, "Okay, he's old." So we were able to make peace with it. You know? [00:05:57]

The harder thing with this... You know, my grandfather didn't suffer. That was the only thing. It was as if he decided. He was like, "Alright. I'm 92. I'm just tired." It's harder when someone so vibrant and so like full of life... It's like, you know... It's hard to see her like that. But, hey, she's on her feet which, you know...

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: Is she happy at times? Is she...

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

THERAPIST: She's enjoying...

CLIENT: Yeah, even last night. Yeah, yeah, yeah. She started singing. My cousin's... My cousin who has a cousin that I'm the godfather of, her younger daughter is so adorable. She's becoming just this little... Just like my cousin where she's a carbon copy. She just melts your heart. There's no way you can... So, my grandmother was like... She sang for her. Which was crazy. [00:07:05]

She sang this Assyrian song. She remembered all the lyrics. So that was... You know, we just totally let her sing and then we applauded and then we were... You know, we drank a toast to her. Yeah, so once we got there and she calmed down a little bit, it was better. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. She's... Yeah. When we did the birthday stuff, you know, she was happy. Yeah. It's more just that she initially was very, very irritated about being there and then just that she didn't eat anything. So... (PAUSE) Yeah.

(PAUSE) [00:08:00]

CLIENT: (SIGH) (PAUSE) I just thought of something though.

THERAPIST: Hmm?

CLIENT: It's kind of... No, it's not cool but it's... I don't know what the word, adjective is but, you know, I'm seeing someone now who I really, really like and someone is my family is kind of going downhill, which is what was happening when I saw Samantha. Right? So it's... I take small... It's a bit of a comfort to know that it's such a world of difference now.

THERAPIST: Yeah, yeah.

(PAUSE) [00:09:01]

CLIENT: The other thing that happened yesterday that I thought was really interesting... I didn't know what to make of it. But we all started talking about memories. We took a little stroll down memory lane. I thought that was very sweet... It also kind of bothered... It didn't bother... I was like, "Wow. We're talking as if..." I don't know. I didn't know what to make of it. Something was different this time about it. Like my mom talked about how they went to Oregon. My mom and dad went to Oregon with my aunt and uncle, my aunt who died. You know? I just... I kind of cringed because she talked about my aunt and she told my cousin, "You know, you were in your mom's belly. She was pregnant with you." So she's like, "It was as if you came too with us." She talked so openly about my aunt. I was like, "Are the... Is that okay?"

THERAPIST Huh. [00:09:59]

CLIENT: And then I was like, "No, I think that's kind of cool." I think my mom's just like... Why? I don't know what to make... I don't know. I felt very uncomfortable because my uncle was there. You know? They're there.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: But then I thought, "You know, no. I think she's like..." We're not going to forget her. We're not going to act like she didn't exist because we went through this trauma. I mean, there were these wonderful... I don't know. I didn't know what to make of it.

THERAPIST: Yeah, what would make it not okay?

CLIENT: Maybe it's just me. I thought maybe it's just me. I'm uncomfortable because it was so awful. I don't know how to... Like...

THERAPIST: Because it's hard to bring up.

CLIENT: Yeah. I was like, "Wow. Like that's ballsy." You know? I don't know. Like I was like, "Holy shit." You know? That was a...

THERAPIST: So this is your aunt's husband and daughter were there?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: And you all don't talk about your aunt with them? [00:11:01]

CLIENT: I mean, if it's just me and my cousin, I will.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: But I just have a way of doing it... I don't know. I'm very kind of mellow about it.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: But, you know, when it's a group of people, I always feel like that's a little bit... You know? But... I don't know. I give my mom credit. I don't think anybody... I think they were actually touched, I think. You know? You know? My uncle's very... He's the one I was telling you, now he's a softie. You know, he gets immediately teary eyed if... You know? So maybe it's nice that she talked about it and my cousin seemed fine that she talked about it. But I was just like, "Wow. What are we doing here?" Maybe it's just so different. I thought something seemed different. You know?

THERAPIST: Even in your mother bringing it up was different for her?

CLIENT: Yeah, because she brought it up in a very matter of fact way. Not like, "You know, my poor sister, God rest her..." You know? She just brought it up and just talked about it in a very kind of happy way. [00:11:57]

And her whole thing was, you know, "Thank God. We had some really nice memories." You know? So...

THERAPIST: Not as a victim.

CLIENT: No, it wasn't. No, no, no. She's... She's definitely shown a different side to her with some of this stuff.

THERAPIST: Yeah. (PAUSE) Well, it's even so different just publicly putting it out there.

CLIENT: Yeah. My aunt and my dad, we don't really talk about. My aunt's husband who died and my grandfather, you know, we can talk about that. But for some reason, my dad, they just...

THERAPIST: Oh, I didn't know that.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. My mom will bring it up but not quite the way she brought up my aunt. Although now I wonder if she was doing that for me. [00:13:05]

You know? Maybe she just doesn't want to upset me or something because... I don't know. Or if I mention it... I'll mention it in a kind of passing way. If I don't dwell on the story, I'll be like, "Oh, yeah. My dad this." Then I'll just kind of move on. Yeah. We don't...

THERAPIST: Do you know what it is? Like...

CLIENT: It's too sad. It's hard to talk about.

THERAPIST: Is it sadness?

CLIENT: For me, at least. Yeah. It's hard to talk about. (PAUSE) I don't know. (PAUSE) Or just, you know, it's my own insecurity or I just don't want to talk about anything related to death. I'm sure it's not... You know, it's just my own whatever. Yeah. Because I enjoyed... Yesterday, I enjoyed listening and talking about it. You know? [00:14:03]

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: So...

THERAPIST: I mean, that's what I was thinking. Even for your cousin, for your uncle, for you, it's new to imagine talking about it could actually feel comforting.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: And the funny thing... What I thought was well sometimes my cousin brings up my dad and I find that... It makes me a little uncomfortable but not really. It's comforting. She has so many nice memories of my dad and, you know, she'll, you know... But, yeah, it's hard. I don't know.

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: What will she bring up.

CLIENT: I don't know. She'll... You know, she'll be like, "I remember your dad took us here. We did this," or, "Your dad was always really nice to me," or, "I remember when he's get on the phone in North Carolina and like tease me." You know? Like all this stuff... [00:15:03]

Yeah. My dad really loved her, my, the one who I'm, the cousin I'm talking about.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Because she was the girl and she was for a long time the only girl and she was feisty. You know? So... I think that it is, is like for me... I don't know. Maybe my cousin's stronger than me in that way. I have so much sadness, I think, about my dad that it's just still hard. You know? Like, I feel good when other people talk about him but it makes me sad. You know? Like... Not in a way like, "Why did you bring it up?" I just, you know, it's hard. You know, my friends who had the diner... People bring him up. "You know, your dad was really a great guy." Whatever. It's just like, "Ugh." It's so nice to hear but it's so hard. You know? [00:16:05]

THERAPIST: It's hard to feel sad or...

CLIENT: I think so.

THERAPIST: What's so bad about those beings?

CLIENT: It's just so deep, I think, that it's just like... Yeah. It's just very difficult. I think with my uncle Randy... We all loved him but, you know, he was more... You know, he was a drinker. He was a little bit more aloof. He didn't treat my aunt the best. Remember, I was saying... We all loved him.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: But it's not like he... You know? So I think we kind of made peace with that. So now we can just think of him fondly and that he was a funny guy and he had a good heart and all that's true. Somehow, that didn't... My dad just really... You know, my uncle won't talk about it. [00:17:01]

My mom's youngest... My uncle with the baby... We will never, ever... Like that hit him so... You know? He just can't talk about it. Well, the same with my other uncle. It's hard. They just don't talk about it. Which, in a weird way, is a... I mean, sometimes by not talking about something you're showing how much that something meant to you. So I never... I never... I almost... Not I respect them for that but I feel for them like, you know...

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: Yeah, I keep getting this feeling, even as you're talking about your mother bringing up your aunt in this unusual way for her, there's some way it feels as though it's not just sadness that's being avoided but there's something that feels like shame too. Almost...

CLIENT: In me? [00:18:11]

THERAPIST: In you, probably, even in the way you're describing your uncles being sad about your...

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: The fact that you just said, "Because, in a way, even not talking about it shows how much you care..." I just, I wonder if there's something that also just feels really too vulnerable to have your sadness known or seen.

CLIENT: Oh, so shame in that way.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Oh, yeah. I was wondering why shame. Okay.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, yeah. Of course. It's kind of... Yeah, what are you going to do? Break down every... Yeah, it's hard. It's... I think, you know, we're men and that's hard. You know? I think, on their end, there might also... My blood uncle, not so much, but, you know, my older uncle, you know, he used to be kind of a hard ass and not such a fun guy and, you know, of all the three of them, it was really my other uncle who passed away and my dad who were buddies. You know? [00:19:15]

THERAPIST: Mm hmm.

CLIENT: You know, they would have fun. They... You know? This uncle was a little bit more of a hard ass and sometimes difficult. So I think he definitely felt some guilt maybe or some...

THERAPIST: Oh.

CLIENT: You know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Because when my dad died, it was just when things were good again. Like everything was really good. Everyone was hanging out together. So I think he might feel a sense of... Just like I think he does with his wife. You know? His wife died and now he's doing very well financially, this and that when he wasn't when she... So I think he feels these things and I think with my younger uncle it might just be that, yeah, he feels some kind of something for his sister or for me or for some sense of responsibility. [00:20:03]

I don't know. I'm just... It's just conjecture. But you're right. I think overall it's just that it's kind of just so vulnerable to talk about.

THERAPIST: But you're adding some importance that there may in them maybe even in your maybe some more complex feelings.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. Exactly. Yeah.

THERAPIST: I wonder if you have guilt.

CLIENT: Yeah. Sure. Probably. I mean, I wasn't there. Oh, plus my blood uncle was there. He wasn't there when it happened but he rushed over like so he saw him. You know? So I can't imagine how traumatizing that was to see your sister and your brother... You know what I mean? Yeah. So that's... Yeah. I probably feel guilty because I wasn't there. [00:20:59]

So... (PAUSE) I mean, it's never something I've beaten myself up... I thought about it. I was like, "Well, that's not my fault, obviously." But, yeah, there is something about my mom was alone and I wasn't there and...

THERAPIST: You were in Oregon at the time.

CLIENT: No, I was just in San Diego for the day.

THERAPIST: Okay.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Oh, you were living here.

CLIENT: Yeah. I was only like 18, 19, at the time. Yeah.

THERAPIST: And had gone to San Diego for the day.

CLIENT: Me and a few of my Assyrian friends had gone to see a classical concert. It was like... There's an Assyrian composer and it was like his hundredth anniversary. So...

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: Was it Saturday?

CLIENT: I'm sorry?

THERAPIST: Was it Saturday?

CLIENT: Sunday. Which doesn't help with my hatred of Sundays. [00:22:03]

THERAPIST: Why?

CLIENT: Sundays... Was it November 6th or October 6th? It was the 6th of October or November. Yeah.

THERAPIST: And you... There were no signs.

CLIENT: No. He just died suddenly.

THERAPIST: He wasn't sick or anything beforehand?

CLIENT: I mean, he had this... He had hurt his arm. He wasn't working. There was a lot of stress.

THERAPIST: He had hurt his arm on the job?

CLIENT: Yeah. It got caught in a... Like all the tendons... I don't know. It wasn't good. We were going to buy this property in Baltimore, like a convenience store thing. But he was having second thoughts. I think he was very stressed, unhappy, or... I don't know. He just wasn't in a good place. But, you know, when I look back on it, in terms of size, like of course that's way too young to die like that. [00:23:01]

But, you know, if you've been smoking since you're 15, working manual labor, you know, fucking AWOL from the army from one continent to the... I don't know. It's a hard life. So it's shocking but not completely out of the realm of... Fifty eight, it's not old but that is the age when things like that can happen. You know? Once you hit your fifties, you've got to fucking... I mean, you should take care of yourself anyway. But, you know... Didn't really go to... We've talked about it but didn't really... Just old school. Because I think there were a few doctors that... Not that I know for a fact but there was at least one. "You know, you should take this medication, blah, blah, blah, blood pressure..." You know? So, never quit smoking. [00:23:59]

Especially when his brother died young. You know, it's like maybe you should... You know? So...

THERAPIST: How old was his brother again?

CLIENT: His brother was way younger. His brother was 48. You know... Half brother.

THERAPIST: This was the half brother?

CLIENT: Half brother, yeah. And, you know, that guy was... That guy. My uncle was a big dude and he was a historical... His stress levels were... That's a very different situation and also there were some rumors that he was killed or... I don't know. He died young.

THERAPIST: I remember this.

CLIENT: Yeah. Either way, he died young. So...

THERAPIST: Your dad was in the range and given what was going on with behavioral things, it's not shocking once you learn what happens but it's also... It doesn't sound like there were immediate signs...

CLIENT: No, no, no.

THERAPIST: ...in any way.

CLIENT: No way.

THERAPIST: It also could have not happened...

CLIENT: Of course.

THERAPIST: ...for 10 to 20, 30 years. [00:25:01]

CLIENT: Absolutely. You're absolutely... I mean, yeah, I think there's definitely something... It was one of those freak... Or it could have happened but he could have lived.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: It was just one of those where I think unfortunately, you know, it's just a freak... I think that's why he had all those panic attacks. It's just such a freak thing that it's as if there's like nothing you can do. So...

THERAPIST: Your, this uncle was there when it happened you're saying?

CLIENT: He rushed over. I think he was either in the ambulance or he got...

THERAPIST: So he wasn't with your father.

CLIENT: No, no, no. (inaudible at 00:25:41)

THERAPIST: Oh.

CLIENT: Yeah. He was best friends with their dad. That's why they were so close.

THERAPIST: He was at the diner?

CLIENT: No, no, no. They were at their house. These three couples would get together and they'd have like dinners. They'd have a nice time. You know? So maybe like once a week or every other week they'd get together. They had dinner and that was it. He just kind of slumped over. [00:26:07]

THERAPIST: Just... That's the story?

CLIENT: That's it.

THERAPIST: He slumped over? Not in pain or not...

CLIENT: As far as I know, no.

THERAPIST: Huh.

CLIENT: I mean, who knows what my mom's telling. I couldn't ask them specifically. I'm assuming he must have felt something but, yeah, it wasn't some...

THERAPIST: But he was out beforehand.

(CROSSTALK)

CLIENT: It wasn't some prolonged kind of thing. Or even if it was, it was very, very quick, very quickly.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: So...

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: What did they do?

CLIENT: I'm sorry?

THERAPIST: What did they do after?

CLIENT: After what?

THERAPIST: Did they call 911? Did they...

CLIENT: Yeah, of course, yeah, yeah, yeah and the ambulance, all that. [00:27:03]

THERAPIST: There wasn't a chance though.

CLIENT: As far as I know, yeah. There was no... They tried to resuscitate him all the way (ph) or... (PAUSE) It's funny though because it makes perfect sense with why I... You know, with Kelly, for example, it's funny that... That's going so well. Like really, it's going so well. But I still like, when it comes to the text messaging, I still have some... You know? It's so obvious that that has a lot to do with it because that's suddenness. [00:28:01]

There's a fear of like just sudden, you know... Like I think of all the things that have to do with my dad, that has the most to do with it. My shyness, this, that, even the anxiety, whatever, but that idea that things can just... At any moment, everything's going to be totally different. You know? that's a tough one. That definitely comes from that, I think. It only got reinforced from my other uncle and my aunt. You know? (PAUSE) Yesterday... So, I saw Kelly Friday night. She stayed over. Then she went to work Saturday. [00:29:03]

I texted her last night and, you know, I was just like copasetic with the rest of the weekend. I was kind of flirty. I was like, "Oh, you know, I've been really turned on for you all day," of whatever. She was like, "Oh, is that so?" She sent me a heart, whatever. She has this way of... I don't know if she's a little shy with text messaging but she uses those stupid emoticons and... So she sent me like some couple of things. I sent her a couple of things. She sent me three roses or whatever and so I still, I got into that thing. I was like, "Alright. I'm just going to leave it at that." But it's funny. It's still that thing of like I sent her something, she sent me something, I sent her something, she sent me something. Done. It gets... That's nice. That's a nice exchange. You know, because she wasn't using words. So I was like, "I don't want to..." Maybe she's a little shy. Maybe she's with her son. You know? [00:30:05]

So, on the one hand, it's good that I've gotten much better at listening to my rationing side. I was like, "Well, this is great. Nothing's happening here. Everything's fine. It's great." But then there is that part of me that's like... That's the thing. I don't even know... So what is it? You know what I mean? She sent me a heart. Then she sent me like a rose. So... There's nothing to feel whatever I'm feeling. You know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Yeah. That's what's so striking about this example is that you're feeling...

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: It's not even like she made some ambiguous statement.

CLIENT: Absolutely. Yeah. Absolutely. Well, and not only that, we had such a... Like our dates just get better and better and it was very passionate and like, you know, we had such a... We're talking about maybe going away for a day or two over the Christmas break. [00:31:07]

She told me about, you know, her brother has a nickname for me. He just calls me Toe.

THERAPIST: (LAUGHTER)

CLIENT: Some of her friends know... I mean, it's... We have a relationship. You know what I mean? So, on the one hand, it's good that I get that now. Yeah. This is great. But I was like, "Wow, that's so weird." Even now, the girl is sending me a heart, roses. You know? Like what? (LAUGHTER) But I feel like this dread or this like...

THERAPIST: Well, with your dad the relationship was good and lost. That could still happen.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: This anxiety, even when it's going well...

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: But it's...

CLIENT: I think that's the problem. Yeah. There's that voice that says, "Well, lots of things go well and then they don't." You know? People cheat on each other. They just decide they don't love that person. You know? [00:32:07]

I think that's a big one. That's important because no shit. Everything is like that. You can't be in a constant state of walking on eggshells or stopping yourself from communicating. You know what I mean? Like I'm always like, "Should I text her today? I texted her yesterday. So maybe I shouldn't text her today." It's like that... You know? Like when I asked her about going away, I was like, "Oh, do you think like we have a little more free time over the Christmas break of whatever?" She made a joke. She was like, "Yeah..." She said something like, "Yeah, because he's thinking, 'Think I can maybe see you more than once a week.;" [00:32:55]

So she even goes to a place I still... you know what I mean? I was just going to ask her if she wanted to go away for a night or two. Do you know what I'm saying. So, in other words, I'm keeping myself from list just telling her I miss her or feeling like... Like of course I can text her everyday. This is like... You know what's weird? I can't... I haven't been allowing myself to tell myself that she's my girlfriend. I haven't been allowing it. I'm just worried that I'm somehow, I'm imagining something that's not there. That's kind of fucked up. Right? I mean, in this situation that's a little irrational.

THERAPIST: Yeah. You seem scared to kind of see that it's real.

CLIENT: Yeah.

(PAUSE) [00:34:00]

THERAPIST: I'm wondering where you were when you got the phone call, I assume it was a phone call, about your dad.

CLIENT: Oh, I didn't get a phone call.

THERAPIST: No?

CLIENT: No, I just got... We got home. I dropped everybody off. It was me and my cousin Bobby, my... We got to my house and all the lights were on and I saw my relatives cars. I kind of got excited. I was like, "Oh, they're hanging out." Then the minute I got...

THERAPIST: What time was it?

CLIENT: It was like 11, 10 or 11. But the minute I opened the door, it was my aunt who passed away and my mom's brother and either my aunt or my uncle said, "You know..." I mean, they just looked fucked up and they were like, "You know, your father had a heart attack." You know? [00:34:59]

I didn't even... I just ran up the stairs and then like I just... The priest was there. My mom looked completely just whacked, just, you know... So...

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: I'm sorry.

(PAUSE) [00:36:00]

(PAUSE) [00:37:00]

THERAPIST: What are you thinking?

CLIENT: I was just thinking how tough, like how tough that whole thing was like when his brother and sister came, my aunt and my uncle, that was just so surreal. The wake was so fucking surreal. My aunt kind of fainted and my uncle like ran to the coffin and like hugged him, like picked him up and hugged him and I was just like, "What the fuck?" [00:38:05]

That was just... (PAUSE) It was like a very... It wasn't like the kind of thing where someone dies and there's just kind of an order to it. You know what I mean? You go to the wake. You say some things and like they bury him. Like, "Oh, that was very sad." There was something very visceral that happened, you know, with my dad. I mean, the church was overflowing. I had never seen anything like that. You know? I mean... It was one of those things where people... You know, it was during the week, weekday. People came to each thing. The church was overflowing. Everybody wanted to go to the cemetery. Everybody wanted to go to the church for the coffee or whatever they do. It was just really... I don't know. [00:39:05]

The amount of people that come to our house and bringing us things and just like... Just very intense.

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: So there's this incredible outpouring of feeling. (inaudible at 00:39:31)

CLIENT: No, no, no. I mean, the wake was private.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Which I think, you know, I think was a good idea because if all those people... I mean, we'd have to be there for hours just sitting there. It's a nightmare. But, yeah, it was just unreal. It was unreal.

(PAUSE) [00:40:00]

THERAPIST: What were the services like for you?

CLIENT: I was pretty stoic. Yeah, I was pretty... Probably I was in complete shock or something but I was like stoic. You know? I mean, it's not that I didn't cry but I don't remember really crying at the church or no, maybe I didn't a little bit at one point, a little bit. At the wake, I don't know if I cried. I don't know if I cried... Maybe I cried a little bit at the cemetery maybe. [00:41:03]

But there was no real like massive... Like I didn't really lose it. You know? Then at the thing afterwards with the coffee... That was just annoying. I really didn't want to be there. Yeah. I think it was just so surreal. It seemed absurd. The whole thing just seemed... Yeah.

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: It's sounded very dramatic.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: The scene you described, just walking up and opening the door...

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 00:41:55) walking in and seeing the faces on your family and knowing something was very, very wrong. [00:42:01]

CLIENT: Yeah. It was almost more traumatic seeing the different people's reaction. You know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Yes.

CLIENT: My grandfather just was devastated. I mean, he ended up having to have open heart surgery. I'm sure it contributed to that. You know? He was just fucking devastated. Just so... It was just seeing... My uncle finally broke down. Everybody chipped in. They wanted to help with the funeral and all that and at one point it was just me and my uncle in my parents' bedroom. He wanted to give me a check or whatever and he just fucking lost it, just lost it. So it was weird. You know? So I was kind of consoling him. Yeah. It was very strange. My aunts were just like zombies, just like totally, you know...

(PAUSE) [00:43:00]

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Were people worried about you?

CLIENT: See, that's the thing. I mean, that's... I mean, they were and they weren't. Not really. No one... That's the one... I've said, that's where they dropped the ball. You know? No one took me aside, you know, to say anything. So that's... That was kind of lame. You know? The amazing thing is of all people my fucking aunt who's the psychiatrist... I mean, isn't that part... I don't care if you specialize in eating disorders, you've got to know that that can't be healthy, what's going on right now. There was just no... I mean, of course there were things like, "Let us know if you need anything." But those are... It's like when someone dies, "I'm so sorry." You know what I mean? That's all things we just say. [00:44:01]

I think I really needed someone to really pull me aside and be like, "Listen. This is very difficult what you're going through. You know, you're not alone or, you know, this is a traumatic thing. You're young and this is very..." I don't know. Something. I don't know. So they... They didn't do that and that's... You know, it's one of those things where they unintentionally fucked up. You know?

THERAPIST: Yeah. Yes, interesting just hearing you talk about each of the different family members having this very strong reaction at one point or another and, you know, I can feel myself joining their sadness but then it's your, you end up getting kind of...

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: ...lost in the picture.

CLIENT: I know. [00:44:57]

THERAPIST: It's almost like you're not even there.

CLIENT: I know. It's weird.

THERAPIST: You're telling the story of the experience of this.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: It's like you're a fly on the wall watching it happen.

CLIENT: Yeah, it did feel like that a little bit. It felt like that. It's weird. I don't know.

THERAPIST: It's really weird because you're his child.

CLIENT: I know.

THERAPIST: Like a...

CLIENT: His only child.

THERAPIST: Right. Not that they shouldn't be having immense amounts of feelings. But, in a way, your feelings should come first.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Maybe you and your mother...

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: ...as the two most...

CLIENT: Yep.

THERAPIST: ...affected people.

CLIENT: The thing is she had like her girlfriends like... She's the wife so there's some...

THERAPIST: A lot of people in her generation...

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: It sounds like aunts, uncles attending to her.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yep. (PAUSE) Yeah, but what do you make of that? You know? It's just a sad kind of shitty moment, you know, where people just didn't... You know? No one went that extra mile to, you know... [00:46:15]

(PAUSE)

THERAPIST: To be continued.

CLIENT: Okay.

THERAPIST: See you Tuesday.

CLIENT: 12:50?

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Okay. Thanks.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Have a good one.

THERAPIST: You too.

END TRANSCRIPT

1
Abstract / Summary: Client discusses a recent family party and the feelings it uncovered about the death of his father. Client discusses issues with his current relationship.
Field of Interest: Counseling & Therapy
Publisher: Alexander Street Press
Content Type: Session transcript
Format: Text
Original Publication Date: 2014
Page Count: 1
Page Range: 1-1
Publication Year: 2014
Publisher: Alexander Street
Place Published / Released: Alexandria, VA
Subject: Counseling & Therapy; Psychology & Counseling; Health Sciences; Theoretical Approaches to Counseling; Life events; Family and relationships; Teoria do Aconselhamento; Teorías del Asesoramiento; Death of relative; Death of parent; Family relations; Psychoanalytic Psychology; Anxiety; Sadness; Psychoanalysis
Presenting Condition: Anxiety; Sadness
Clinician: Abigail McNally, fl. 2012
Keywords and Translated Subjects: Teoria do Aconselhamento; Teorías del Asesoramiento
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