TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: How's it going?

THERAPIST: Good.

CLIENT: What's up?

THERAPIST: This is December and you paid $20 extra for December. I don't know if you were aware of that.

CLIENT: I'm sorry?

THERAPIST: You overpaid $20. I don't know if you did that on purpose or maybe by accident. There was a session we didn't meet, the week of Christmas.

CLIENT: Great, even better, that's good.

THERAPIST: So that, I just put that towards the -

CLIENT: Actually, you know what? Maybe I'll start doing that, even if I pay a little extra each time, you know, that would be good.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: How's it going?

THERAPIST: Good.

CLIENT: How was your New Year's? [0:01:00.3]

THERAPIST: It was good.

CLIENT: So, I had kind of a big night last night, very symbolic, very good. I was at home, (drumming) it was around maybe 11:00 or something like that, and I just, for the first time since I've been back from England, the first time, I went and I sat at my desk and I wrote a verse. It wasn't much but you know, it felt good, it felt good. I've got like one verse and I just kind of sat there, you know, and then I was like all right, I'm not going to beat myself up. I sat down, I did it, you know?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: The first time since that's I hadn't done that since I've been back. I just suddenly felt, I don't know.

THERAPIST: You felt what?

CLIENT: I think I'm just because I'm just slowly, you know, just feeling better, things are just falling into place. I just felt kind of excited to actually do it, do you know what I mean? [0:02:08.1]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: I was like look at this, my I have my parents' old dining room table, so, you know, it's a pretty big table, and I use it as a desk. It's one of these old, kind of dark wood, with thin legs kind of thing. It's really nice. So I have that pushed into this kind of little nook thing that I have, and I have my office chair, and I was like, you know, I don't know. It just felt like you know. Cecelia jumped up on the table and kind of like sat near me while I was it was awesome. So I don't know if that's... That's a big deal, I think.

THERAPIST: It is.

CLIENT: (drumming) I haven't seen any really awful nightmares. I actually saw a really nice dream, well I think it was a really nice dream, last night, where I was in a class. We had this family friend... When my mom went to work at this corporation, she was kind of recruited by this Persian Assyrian, who was the chief of that back then, and he was also a very well-known modern Assyrian writer, very, very and he was a great guy, a very, very sweet man. So I kind of got to know him. He saw some of my poetry when I was like 18, 19, and he died from illness, but he was older, you know, a pretty old guy, but he was a very robust, kind of just one of these like full of life kind of. [0:03:51.1]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: This really sweet guy. So, I saw this dream out of nowhere, that I'm in a class of his, like an Assyrian literature class or something. But then, the cool thing was, I don't know what we were doing but we were all kind of using chalk or these really cool crayons, to like draw our ideas. And it wasn't like we weren't like children, I mean this was like a university class. It just, it was awesome, and I was doing all these cool things, like I was drawing really nicely. Not as in figuratively nicely, but I was just doing all this cool shit.

THERAPIST: Creative.

CLIENT: Very creative, yeah. They were kind of nice colors and it was really weird. Then, I told I think I was with my good friend, the one who got divorced, my good Assyrian friend, and I think I was telling him that, like I'm going to go to the Academy of Art, or something academy of art, and I was kind of happy about it. And then I had some other idea about traveling somewhere else. I don't know, but it felt, it all felt pretty good, although I have no idea, why him, like why I saw his name was Joseph. I don't know why I saw him. I've never I haven't thought about him in years and years and years. But anyway. [0:05:15.4]

THERAPIST: But when you think of it, it sounds like it's a very positive thing.

CLIENT: Yeah, very, very, yeah, yeah. It was really like I mean, he was kind of old when he died but he wasn't that old. He was young for you know? Very, very sweet, robust, like very like a true artist kind of, you know?

THERAPIST: It's interesting, a true artist who is robust. It's not just that being an artist is being weak or not successful or not a doctor and a lawyer. There's a way he embodies strong.

CLIENT: Sure. Oh, yeah.

THERAPIST: Something to be proud of and an artist.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. Well also, my friend, the one Assyrian guy that I took some kind of lessons from, who passed away, he was the same way, very just you know? Like my dad, these were like men, you know?

THERAPIST: Yeah. [0:06:16.7]

CLIENT: But artists. They didn't compromise, they didn't you know? And very optimistic. I mean, optimistic/pessimistic, you know, which is like kind of what I am I think, just full of life, pushing others, not having egos, being happy if others do well or being willing to help others. Very cool people. I was like oh, maybe I'm seeing it, because I've been thinking more and more and more about going to Assyria. So maybe that has something to do with it.

THERAPIST: I also can't help but think about our conversation about dress and clothing and aesthetics and style. One of the things we were talking about that on Monday is how there may have been elements that have been defensive or narcissistic to all that, but there are also elements that feel increasingly clear, that are just about you. [0:07:30.0]

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: That that's just who you are.

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: Like art is part of who you are. And to have that not be a bad thing that you have to get rid of.

CLIENT: Right. The opposite actually.

THERAPIST: Quite the opposite. Something to be, because it's who you are, that you could actually feel proud of.

CLIENT: At home for example, I pay attention to detail, you know, like where my books are. I have these one or two knickknacks at the end of the books, like here.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: For some reason that gives me pleasure, I like what those little knickknacks are. Do you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: That's not a typical guy, especially a guy thing, you know? But, you know, stuff like that resonates, like I love that Freud had all those fucking knickknacks on his desk. I don't know what that is, for some reason I love that he did that. I don't know, things like that are important to me. [0:08:30.5]

THERAPIST: There's been such a split in man is strong and doesn't have knickknacks.

CLIENT: Right, right.

THERAPIST: And woman is weak and has knick you know?

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: This conjuring of this person from that company, who died, you'd known, is a person where actually that dichotomy breaks down and you can remember wait.

CLIENT: It wasn't like that, yeah.

THERAPIST: There's almost a role model.

CLIENT: That's right.

THERAPIST: Where it's not like that, and he felt really happy about himself and proud of himself and didn't hide parts of who he was, and was strong.

CLIENT: Absolutely. Yeah, him, and this teacher of mine, and in a way too, my dad. I mean he wasn't an artist, but for a guy that was a mechanic and worked in a factory? You know, I mean the way he carried himself, the way he dressed, the way he interacted with people, was not typical. [0:09:43.9]

THERAPIST: Like a refinement, a sophistication too.

CLIENT: Exactly. The way he'd like to go to stores and check out colognes and flirt with the perfume girls and smell the different smells, and there were things he liked and things he didn't like, or that he even gave a shit, you know?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. It's his own art.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. My mom has that too. The problem is with my mom's, all these kind of more negative sides kind of my mom is a very well put together woman. She doesn't look her age, she's very kind of dainty and she dressed kind of cute for a woman her age. So then she puts her hair in braids? I mean, it's kind of adorable, it's ridiculous. And she's very, you know, we kind of look like each other but she's much more she's like very, very white and kind of very regal looking kind of. But it's just that the negative sides kind of cover that, you know what I mean? For my dad, it was like he didn't talk about it, he didn't care if other people noticed it. You know what I mean? He wasn't doing it to keep up with the neighbors or, you know? [0:10:51.0]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. The negative stuff, and your mom sort of made that all one. You have this image, this icon or this icon.

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah.

THERAPIST: And instead of both of them having all these complicated layers of who they were; some good, some bad.

CLIENT: Yeah. Harder to see her good qualities and her yeah.

THERAPIST: And that her good qualities could even be good qualities in a man.

CLIENT: Yeah, oh, yeah, no, absolutely, absolutely. (drumming) Actually, that's wow, I just thought of this. I was hanging out New Year's Eve with Donnie and Lila and Matthew, whatever, we went to my boss's ridiculous get-together. But, first they came over to my house for some drinks, to my place, and I was putting the beers in the fridge and Lila was helping, and I was like, "Oh, Lila, you changed your hair color, you look so good." And her and Donnie, they just looked at Lila goes, "I told you." And they just started laughing. I was like what? Lila's like, "I told him that only Brian is going to notice that I've done anything to my hair." She was like, "I can't believe it, I knew that you were going to notice it, no one else has noticed." I was like, "Oh, it's kind of noticeable." [0:12:08.8]

THERAPIST: And it didn't sound like she sounded like she was teasing you about it.

CLIENT: No, no, no.

THERAPIST: It sounds like something wants to happen.

CLIENT: No, and I felt good about it. I felt like fuck man, that's awesome, that's why chicks dig me, that's why I dig me. I like that, you know, it's important, things like that.

THERAPIST: And it's actually not really it doesn't have to be a gender trait, attending to details in people.

CLIENT: No. No, no, it's not, yeah. It has nothing to do with that.

THERAPIST: At all.

CLIENT: And it's also not in the past, I would worry that it's like some kind of douchey, metrosexual... Remember that whole...?

THERAPIST: Yeah, yeah.

CLIENT: That would annoy the shit out of me. But, you know, more and more I'm like, what does any of that mean, like that's I'm just who I am and I like what I like and I'm proud of that.

THERAPIST: I think that's what I was saying, you know, the words, like there are all these categories of what's douchey and not.

CLIENT: I know, it's silly, it's silly. [0:13:14.7]

THERAPIST: It feels sort of reminiscent of even people say a guy who gets a manicure.

CLIENT: George does.

THERAPIST: Maybe he likes it.

CLIENT: George does.

THERAPIST: Maybe he likes it.

CLIENT: The guy who works in a diner like 14 hours a day, I mean I don't blame him. Musicians do sometimes, you know, our fingers. My fingers are all kind of jacked up sometimes.

THERAPIST: What's not to like?

CLIENT: I don't do that but I can understand why some guitar players do that. But it was funny, I was at my New Year's Day, I was invited to that music teacher's wife's house, she had a get-together. She's a really great lady, I'm really glad I reconnected, because I wasn't here when he died, and we had this time where I just, you know. Nothing happened, but I was just, you know, you kind of drift. So I was really like it really bummed me out that he died, and I wasn't able to like kind of reestablish a relationship with him, or at least tell him how important he was, whatever. So I'm really glad I'm able to hang out with her. She's such a cool lady, she's such a cool lady. But when I was at their house, I was going to leave and they're like, "No, no, stay." I was the last one there with her and her daughter and her daughter's two friends or cousins or whatever. But it kind of felt good, like I was totally myself, you know? Like I wasn't they were going to have Prosecco with some strawberries in it or some shit, and I was like, "Yeah, that's a little gay for me." And I know, even as I was saying it, I was like well, they're not going to quite get my humor as much, but I didn't care. I was like, I'll take the Prosecco, I just don't want the fairy dust in it, or whatever you're going to put in it. But I was like, I don't like, now I feel more comfortable when I say things like that, because I know I'm not trying to, clearly it's not gay. You know what I mean? [0:15:04.8]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: I'm just being funny and I just don't like drinks like that, you know what I mean? It's not anything... It's literally, just like what I'd like to drink, just like I like drinking shitty beer, not because I'm manly. I literally just don't like the taste of that crappy, heavy beer.

THERAPIST: And then even you're making a comment, like none of that gay stuff for me, could also just come from a place that's just your humor.

CLIENT: Yeah, exactly, exactly. I can't help it, like I like to you know? And then I kind of because then I like to make themes on it. Then one of the girls said something and I was like, "Well, now you're the one being gay." You know, like I was just like, you know, and then they got it, they knew I was joking around. And, you know, also it's a test. If someone gets a little ruffled, I immediately know that person is not for me. Do you know what I mean? It's a way of filtering people out, honestly, because that's just who I mean, I need to make jokes all the time. Life is, what the fuck's the point if you're not going to laugh? So, people that kind of don't get that shit, or if I see a retard, you know, and they're like rrrrr, you know, I'm like all right, you know, you don't know me, you know what I mean? So that kind of stuff, I feel like I don't know, it's important. Or if I say something about someone's ethnicity, like if I say, (laughs) sometimes when I toast, I'll wait several months, so it's a surprise, and then when I you know, I like to do a lot of toasts, and oftentimes they're kind of serious a little bit, it's my moment of sappiness. But then sometimes I'll just be like, "All right guys, white power." And everyone gets all, you know? Like that's if people don't understand that that's, you know, then I don't want to be friends with them. I make fun of Assyrians, I make fun of myself. [0:16:58.6]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: But it also felt good to be at that get-together and be totally comfortable. When I walked in, there were already people there, just like sitting around, and I walked in. I felt the normal way you would feel, but you know, I just felt very comfortable, I chatted with people, very kind of I just felt very grounded and so it was good. I also didn't let myself get upset because my mom didn't come. She was supposed to come, but that day, I called her and she had that sound in her voice, like she's just defeated. She's like your grandmother, ba-ba-ba-ba-ba. I didn't let it bother me, you know, I was like okay. In my mind, I was like that really sucks. And normally, then I would go to that get-together and I'd kind of fester a little bit, I mean people would know, but in my mind I'd be like oh, my mom's not here and see these fucking, like uppity, more well-to-do people, like they don't have a care in the world and my mom's fucking schlepping around with my you know? [0:18:21.0]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: I would start doing that thing. But I didn't, just I was like, you know what man, everyone is living their lives. These people are going to go home and schlep around other things, like everyone's got something.

THERAPIST: It didn't feel as persecuted.

CLIENT: Or personal or kind of segregated, or like, you know, because of that, that that means I don't belong here, you know what I mean? Because my mom is so whatever, whatever, then somehow I am tainted and I don't belong in this. I didn't feel that way at all. I was like, who are these fucking people, who cares?

THERAPIST: Hmm.

CLIENT: So. [Pause] So, the one question I had though today was well, that we've talked about before, but I think it's important, is so like with Kelly, is it wrong to date somebody when you're not dating other people, but in the back of your mind still be open to like meeting an Assyrian person? Do you know what I mean? I'm feeling weird about this. I think it's an unusual because it's not like I'm saying if I meet someone better in general, it's not like that. It's more like there's something very specific that's almost impossible to find, but I can't help leaving this small window, you know?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: I don't know.

THERAPIST: And if I had an answer to that, it absolves you of your guilt.

CLIENT: Yeah, exactly.

THERAPIST: I don't think so.

CLIENT: And I guess if you're just dating, you're not married, you're not living together, I don't see the harm in it, and you're not actually cheating on somebody. But it just does feel a little strange, to be conflicted a little bit. [0:20:34.6]

THERAPIST: There's something that feels almost wrong about it you're saying?

CLIENT: Yeah, because I just feel like mentally, I'm like 99.9 percent with her, but then there's that .1 percent that, you know, I do have one eye open, kind of. Like a part of me is like oh, you never know, what if I go to Assyria and there's some really cool chick there or whatever. That feels kind of not right in a way, but on the other hand I'm like, yeah but wait, what's the alternative? I'd break up with every single girl that I might actually date because there's some potential? You know what I mean, like that doesn't make sense either. I can't just be a monk and wait for some ridiculous possibility. So I guess I just figure well... And again, it's not the same thing as like waiting for someone better in general, you know what I mean? [0:21:40.8]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Well, you know, maybe there will be someone skinnier and I don't know, with nicer tits, you know what I mean? Like that's a different story. Or a richer girl or something. That's, I think, very douchey, but this is, you know, it's delicate, it's just complicated, it's a cultural it's like a deeper thing. Like, you know, when I was at this get-together, when it was me, the mom, my teacher's wife, she's like 65, her daughter who's 35, her daughter's cousin and some other girl, I don't know. But there was something about that, the conversations we had, and the fact that I could speak Assyrian, you know it matters, do you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: It felt good.

CLIENT: Yeah, and it always does. Whether it's a serious conversation like that or when I'm with my buddies and we're just having Dunkin and making jokes, or I'm just listening to them tell stories. What do you do, down the road, if I cook Kelly to that get-together, it would be totally fine, there were people there who weren't Assyrian, but then at the end of the night, it was this and we did speak a lot of English, but I just like the fact that (snaps fingers) I could just, I could make I could interject a little joke in Assyrian, I could you know? [0:23:05.3]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: What do you do with that, you know what I mean? And a lot of the things we were talking about, I think Kelly would have something to say actually. It was just about identity and belonging and assimilation or not assimilating. Everyone has some anyone who's interesting and has a brain might have something to say about things like that, but I don't know.

THERAPIST: That's what I wonder, is when you get into what matters, what is it? Because it sounds like you feel like she could relate enough.

CLIENT: See, the problem is... I told my friend. My friend George was visiting and his wife is black, and he's American Assyrian too. He doesn't know Assyrian the way I know it but and I was trying to explain to him, without being rude. I was like, you know the thing is man, his kind of American Assyrian is a little different. He's very assimilated.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: You know? Very, very proud Assyrian, very, very proud Assyrian, but there's just something about him and people like him. They're just... I just can't explain. Culturally, there's somehow more so. With me, the issue is not only do I speak Assyrian really, really well, like with this woman is from Beirut, she's 65.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. [0:24:26.1]

CLIENT: I can immediately talk and relate to her as if I'm from Beirut.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: It's weird, you know, like I feel very comfortable and something about that. I feel a pull, do you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Especially to the Middle not necessarily the ones from Russian Assyria, but the ones from the Middle East. Maybe because I was brought up in such a bubble or something, I don't know, or I just like them. They're warm and they're a little more European, you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: There's something about them that's a little more interesting and European. I don't know. My other American Assyrian friends don't have that extra thing, do you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: So like when I was there, there are Assyrian, they're all Assyrian, these other girls, but I was the one making Peeta laugh, interjecting little words that they didn't even know what those words were, little sayings. So I feel like it's language and just a cultural... things you don't have to explain, do you know what I mean? [0:25:28.4]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. You're saying though, even the other Assyrian girls, women, wouldn't understand, so they're Assyrian and they wouldn't.

CLIENT: Exactly.

THERAPIST: So it's not even an Assyrian...

CLIENT: Yeah, that's what I was trying to tell George. I was like, I feel like I'm a really weird bind, because a lot of Assyrian American girls, a lot of them don't know Assyrian that well.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Or they do know it but they're a bit lax about it. Or, they do know it the way I know it but then they're too... do you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: I'm in this weird, weird...

THERAPIST: Well, you really embody both cultures at the same time.

CLIENT: Yeah, exactly, exactly, and I feel like that's a bit of a blessing and a curse. It's a blessing artistically.

THERAPIST: That it's unusual.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: It's not common.

CLIENT: As a cosmopolitan, I feel like a true cosmopolitan person, in like the old sense of the word. Yeah, I often feel stuck, you know I don't like George's wife, for example, I love her, she's like a sister to me, but at the end of the day she's more like family. I feel really comfortable with her but she's so Assyrian, Assyrian, that you know, there are things I can't really talk to her about, you know? [0:26:46.8]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: But then with my super American Assyrian friends, which I don't have many of actually, but they're just basically American. Either they don't know Assyrian that well or they become a little more like... what's the word? Almost like weekend Assyrians, do you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: They'll go to the church bazaar and they care about Assyria, but then that to me almost seems kind of contrived. Do you know what I mean? I don't know, it's just a tough bind to be in, it's really hard, it's really hard. I really feel like I'm in a place now where I just have to, you know? You have to make a decision. George was honest, he was like, "Yeah, you're right." He's like, "Let's say you married someone like Kelly, I mean you're not rushing into anything." He's like, "Yeah, you are going to lose part of that." One day we're not going to have parents or whatever, whatever, whatever, and your Assyrian is going to, you know, unless you find some way to speak Assyrian often. [0:27:55.3]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: And he's like, you can't force her to be somehow... you know, which I never would. So then what you know what I mean, it's like you're in this weird...

THERAPIST: In contrast about your kind of "weekend" Assyrians, it sounds like the feeling that a lot of people look at it, even if they feel bicultural, when they're in one they're sort of forgetting they're the other.

CLIENT: Exactly, exactly.

THERAPIST: And then they go to this one and they forget they're this one.

CLIENT: Exactly.

THERAPIST: And you I mean, I think that's what I was struck by when you were talking about the political debates in your family, how much you've always brought both sides of the whole of who you are to every situation.

CLIENT: Right, right.

THERAPIST: You're not with your Americanized friends pretending not to be Assyrian.

CLIENT: Right, right.

THERAPIST: And the same in your own family. You're not pretending that you're not part of you can be American culture.

CLIENT: That's right. Yeah, when I'm with my American friends, a lot of them have learned certain Assyrian phrases, because I just say them. They're funny and you know? [0:29:01.2]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: I think a lot of it just has to do with language. What was I going to say, something about that it embodies both. Yeah.

THERAPIST: Do you know what stopped you?

CLIENT: I'm sorry?

THERAPIST: Do you know what stopped you?

CLIENT: It suddenly just because I was listening to you and I suddenly... It was something about language, just that it's just very I feel very comfortable. Oh, yeah, no, no, I was going to say you're right about these the Assyrians who are American, or even ones who do know Assyrian fairly well, they speak English. And I've noticed the last maybe five to ten years, it kind of annoys me. I'm like wait a minute, we all know Assyrian, why the fuck are we speaking English, I don't unders like, isn't it cool that we know it's pretty awesome, you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: It's a beautiful language. You're going to speak English the minute you leave this house, or wherever we are, so you know? I don't know, stuff like -

THERAPIST: Why would you not keep it up? [0:30:09.1]

CLIENT: What's that?

THERAPIST: Why would you not keep it up.

CLIENT: Yeah, so stuff like that kind of annoys me and that makes me feel even more alienated in a weird way, because I'm like even with the fucking people that should be speaking Assyrian.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: And that's why I love my immigrant Assyrian friends. Sure, we speak English, but we speak a lot of Assyrian. Like in one sentence, we'll say half of it in English, half of it, we'll interject words or we'll, you know? And some of them, they're just workers or whatever, some of them aren't that educated, but man, when they want to, because of their youth, like they got a good education when they were kids, like their vocabulary is so beautiful, you know they pull out these words that are just awesome. I don't know, so that matters to me. I don't know. [0:31:10.0]

THERAPIST: I think there are ways some of what we're talking about is very specific to being bicultural. I also think there may be elements of this that you're less alone in than it might feel like, in that every person has a family culture that a new person in their life will never quite understand.

CLIENT: That's true, sure, sure.

THERAPIST: You know? Or that you lose parts of by joining with another human being, who just is not your mirror.

CLIENT: But see, that's what I'm saying, that's why the language part is the extra.

THERAPIST: Yes.

CLIENT: You're totally right, but when you have a common spoken language, that's -

THERAPIST: There's so much more to share.

CLIENT: Yeah, that's totally different. But there's something about a spoken language, especially when it's not like French, you know what I mean? It's such a unique language, there aren't that many Assyrians in the world, so it is, it's like a secret language kind of. [0:32:23.0]

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: And there's something about that that complicates things. I mean, Kelly is from West Virginia, she grew up in England, her dad was super eccentric, like I mean she's got a whole... obviously, you know? But, because we both speak English, I can relate on that level, that yeah, I grew up in American too and that's awesome. You have a unique history, I have a unique history. It's more about how's it going to work when we're hanging out certain places and I want to speak Assyrian?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Is she just going to sit there and be like oh, that's cool, you speak you know what I mean? Or, I'm going to constantly have to translate what I'm saying, which just always kind of just comes out lame, generally. I don't know. Or, I'm just over-thinking it.

THERAPIST: That's not what I actually expected you to say, because that brings it more to the level of what will it be like if I'm myself.

CLIENT: That's what I'm saying. [0:33:24.4]

THERAPIST: This was part of -

CLIENT: Yeah, that's what I'm worried about. That is what I'm worried about, yeah, taking her to family get-togethers.

THERAPIST: Are you worried about what she would feel?

CLIENT: Of course, sure.

THERAPIST: She would feel left out?

CLIENT: Yeah. I'd want her to feel totally comfortable and feel like okay, they're not just saying things in Assyrian. Like, I don't know, that's a little, you know?

THERAPIST: But what if she were interested in it?

CLIENT: That's the thing, I mean I think a lot of this is about personality. Some people will be like that's awesome, you know what I mean? Maybe this is my mom's side, I don't know, the worrying, kind of. Maybe I worry that down the road, she might be like listen man, I get the Assyrian, you know what I mean? Like enough.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Now you've got to come to my side, you know?

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: Because you can't force it, that's just got to be from her. I can't be like listen, I want twice a week, for there to be Assyrian ba-ba-ba-ba-ba. I mean I could, but then I can't be upset if one day she's like all right, now, I just feel like we've been doing this for a while and I'd rather do -

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm. [0:34:30.5]

CLIENT: You know? It's human nature. It's like if she said, I want us to learn Gaelic and Polish, because that's my heritage. I don't know. I'm actually taking it to a practical, that's kind of what I'm worried about.

THERAPIST: Yeah. Like, could it be something she could be fine with on the surface, in the beginning, but then it grows old and she's tired of it.

CLIENT: Exactly, exactly.

THERAPIST: Like any part of a person.

CLIENT: That's right, that's right, except that this part, I think can cause even more resentment.

THERAPIST: It's really important.

CLIENT: It's really important and there is a tribal, like you and I are speaking this language that this person doesn't know. I would feel that way. It's not impossible, it's just something that's a reality. [Pause] But like George said, he's like, "That stuff, you've got to let go of." And, I mean, he's a super realist. He's like dude honestly, what your mom, I mean, they're not going to be around forever. That little cocoon that you're feeling, even a lot of these they're all older than me, you know, I mean God forbid, whatever, but his whole thing is that at the end of the day, you're coming home to this person. [0:36:05.0]

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: So, he's like that's got to be the he's like, "Things have a way of sorting themselves out if you're completely comfortable when it's just you and her, nobody else, just you and her." I think he's right in that way.

THERAPIST: It's interesting, as much as you're thinking that I want to be with someone Assyrian, it also sounds like underneath that is will she get tired of my being Assyrian.

CLIENT: Not of my being Assyrian but of my interacting in Assyrian.

THERAPIST: Of the language, yeah.

CLIENT: And in a way, I think that is over-thinking it, only because it's not like every single day I'm, you know? I think it would be stuff she would enjoy. I do like going to the November bazaar, it's fucking awesome. And I don't go there like marching with a flag, like, I just like it. I like it in a way -

THERAPIST: But she might too. [0:37:14.3]

CLIENT: Exactly. I would like it if you go to church or whatever, probably your bazaar. I just like the little old ladies making knickknacks and selling pickles and I don't know, little kids running around. It's a community and I think that's healthy. I'm lucky that I have that, just like anybody. It doesn't have to be an Assyrian thing, just any sense of you know. So yeah, in that way, I think I'm over-thinking it. Yeah, I'm over-thinking it.

THERAPIST: Not that it's not worth thinking about, but I think you would even be picking up already if it were something she was turned off by.

CLIENT: That's true.

THERAPIST: You know?

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. I mean, she clearly knows.

THERAPIST: You'd know that on some...

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah.

THERAPIST: Or it might be something over time she's fine with most of the time, and then maybe one time every now and then she gets frustrated.

CLIENT: True.

THERAPIST: And you deal with that.

CLIENT: True, true.

THERAPIST: But it's not it doesn't mean being out the door either.

CLIENT: Yeah. No, no, no, absolutely. Also, the more I think about it, on a week to week basis, what am I doing that's so Assyrian?

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: I mean, you know, it's really -

THERAPIST: Are you talking holidays like that? [0:38:16.2]

CLIENT: Exactly, get-togethers once in a while, and even at those get-togethers, we mostly speak English.

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Because all my dopey cousins speak English.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: So, yeah, I mean, and I have an Assyrian cousin who doesn't speak Assyrian, so it's not like she would be alone. So yeah, no, I think I'm just over-thinking it.

THERAPIST: You sound like you're feeling better than last week.

CLIENT: I do, yeah, my jaw mostly feels better.

THERAPIST: Your jaw too, even?

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah. In the mornings when I wake up, it's still a little bit tight, but not any where near, no, way better. Sleeping better. I don't know, maybe just coming back here, maybe now that the holidays are over, or maybe I finally really kind of separated myself a little bit from the grandmother, whatever, ordeal. I don't know. Yeah, something definitely feels... I've been thinking about my book more, kind of trying to organize it in my head and actually having a theme. I have a title, I have some ideas, whatever, I don't know. I don't know, you know? I went today and I bought some of those gay black, tight things you wear when you run outside, I did that. [0:39:57.6]

THERAPIST: Inspired to be yourself more.

CLIENT: Yeah, you know, I think just and I have worked really hard here. I think things are just kind of paying off in different ways. I think it helps also, that I don't get too caught up one way or the other, in how I'm feeling on a particular day. Like in a way, I don't feel that different than I felt last week. I mean, I know there is a big difference, but in some ways I feel like yeah, I mean, I was just a little bit more down, but I wasn't in a panic. I was more anxious, but I wasn't letting it go to the point of like do you know what I mean?

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Like I was managing it much better than I would in the past. [0:40:58.8]

THERAPIST: Mm-hmm.

CLIENT: Yeah, no clearly overall, just something is definitely just kind of moving in the right direction.

THERAPIST: I think it can also be relieving and a little unnerving, to feel like it actually matters to be here, that it makes a difference.

CLIENT: It could be what? Believing?

THERAPIST: Relieving.

CLIENT: Oh, relieving, yeah.

THERAPIST: To notice that it can help, but then it can also feel like it's a little scary when there's a week break, with your being sick.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: That losing that connection...

CLIENT: Yeah, no it's true, I mean I really look forward to being here, it's really true, like I get excited that I'm coming here. I was even thinking about this and I was like fuck, if I go away for like a month or two, you know? Oh, and then, I was like holy shit, I don't know if I can leave my cat. Then I couldn't believe that I was thinking that, but she was like I was like I don't know how, fuck, you know? [0:42:22.6]

THERAPIST: The connection can matter, people or cats. I wondered that when you first brought up the idea of going to Assyria, but at the time it first came up, I don't know that you knew what this would eventually feel like, and that it could continue to change over time, what that would the reality of what that would actually feel like, to have a month break from doing this. [0:43:22.7]

CLIENT: I did think about it, yeah, no I did think about it, because I don't do stuff like I mean, I don't take vacations.

THERAPIST: I know.

CLIENT: You know? So yeah, no I definitely did think about that, because I thought about everything, like I was like oh, I'm becoming one of those well, I'm not becoming, I am one of those people. I like my routine, I like that I know my little Dunkin Donuts and my spots, and here, all that. I was like it's kind of it will be unnerving a little bit. But there's something telling me it's kind of like going to England the first time. I just feel like what the fuck, I mean come on, a month, two months even, whatever. It's not you know, I don't want to be one of those people that's like... Because I think that can become a bad if you don't challenge yourself, even if you're not feeling comfortable initially, I don't like that. Otherwise, you just kind of, you know, you'll get stuck in a rut and then you become more and more hesitant to travel or whatever. I don't want to be like that. Also, I think the biggest reason I'm nervous is because I'm worried that not worried. I feel like I'm going to go and I'm going to play songs for people and people are really going to respond, and it's going to be odd. Do you know what I mean? I mean, think about my whole life, I've never other than put out these one or two or three records, whatever, and yeah I've played shows, but I've never really taken it out there, like I've never... And that's... [0:45:11.1]

THERAPIST: What if you get a really good response?

CLIENT: Yeah, yeah.

THERAPIST: It's about time.

CLIENT: At 10:00?

THERAPIST: Tomorrow, we're at 11:30.

CLIENT: At when?

THERAPIST: Eleven-thirty.

CLIENT: Oh, nice. Is that the regular time?

THERAPIST: That's the regular time until March, we can switch back to a later time.

CLIENT: Okay, awesome. Thank you, Tricia.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: So, 11:30.

THERAPIST: See you then.

CLIENT: See you then.

END TRANSCRIPT