TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: So...

THERAPIST: Sorry (inaudible at 00:18)

CLIENT: (inaudible at 00:20) Yesterday after we met Ashby and I talked about whether we thought, you know, he was done with all the repairs (ph) and we wrote the letter, et cetera, et cetera. And we wrote a letter saying, like, (inaudible at 00:53) my rent," blah blah blah, signed check. And then he came by our house at 7:00. Basically he rang the doorbell, shoved two letters in Ashby's hands and left, which was horrible. Like, A, we had really just been like, "OK, we're all set. I think this is all done."

THERAPIST: Oh, you thought the work was done?

CLIENT: We thought all the work was done.

THERAPIST: Oh, that's great.

CLIENT: Except that it's not.

THERAPIST: Oh, that's not.

CLIENT: So he came over at 7:00 to give me these letters, one of which was to say he's going to come over tonight at 7:00 to inspect Ashby's bedroom door, which we don't see the point of that but we were kind of like, "If he hasn't repaired it, fuck it, whatever."

THERAPIST: Right, it's not worth it.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: I'm sorry. You gave him your check...

CLIENT: We wrote the letter and we, like, put the check in the envelope. We hadn't given it to him yet. So, like, you know...

THERAPIST: Did you give it to him when he... [00:02:08]

CLIENT: No, because he just showed up. He just showed up, shoved the letters in my hand and left. So at that point, I was like really glad we didn't give him our rent check yet because (pause) and so he says [he will return] (ph) at 7:00 to inspect. He's going to start working Wednesday morning at 8:30 on the apartment and also wrote a letter complaining that we were using the dryer in the basement. (pause) Yeah. Like, we've been using the same dryer the entire time. And he said, "These dryers are very clearly labeled. It's very obvious which one you should be using and you're not," blah blah blah. So that was just really weird and kind of like, why are you obsessing over the dryer? And he removed the one he doesn't want us to use. And the dryer that he does want us to use is the one that he's always insisted was for his personal use. So we don't know what that's about. Kind of letting it ride a little bit because (pause) so, yeah. [00:03:46]

That sent me, like, right back to being really scared, really nervous and just like, for a while after he left I was totally convinced that his car idling outside because he does that sometimes. And so I checked and it wasn't. (pause) So Ashby left this afternoon to fly back to New Mexico.

THERAPIST: Oh,(inaudible at 04:21).

CLIENT: Yeah. So, like, the first decision was that I wanted someone to come over tonight and then that I wasn't going to spend tonight in my apartment or any time tomorrow until, like, evening. And maybe not Thursday, depending on whether he's done. (pause) And it was (sighs) it was really hard to I ended up asking the same friend who's husband came over last week if, you know, you could come over (inaudible at 05:17) and just be like, someone, please, and could I spend the night.

THERAPIST: At their place?

CLIENT: At their place, which I didn't the problem is that they have the giant dog, a cat and a really excited six and a half year old, so, like, that's not the most...

THERAPIST: That's quite a (inaudible at 05:42)

CLIENT: Yeah, and so I'm talking to Ashby. I'm like, "That's not the most restful thing." But (pause), like, kind of running to my other friends I was like, I think it makes the most sense because I want someone at my house at 7:00, I should just then it felt easiest to have a friend come over, be there for the inspection, then leave together. Also, I was immediately just so wound up that I just thought, well, you know, yes, it's a noisy six and a half year old but, like, it's just happening.

THERAPIST: Would you rather be in a hotel?

CLIENT: No, mostly because they're weirdly quiet.

THERAPIST: (laughter) You sound like (inaudible at 06:54)

CLIENT: I know, which is kind of what I actually wanted (inaudible at 07:00) tomorrow tonight, is one of my friend's has she splits a really big house. It's got, like, six bedrooms and it's all adults there's no small children. So I think I'm going to do that. I mean, she said yes, I could come over. It's less convenient. And she's up by Salem so I'm sure, like, real quiet. And also Cambridge has screwed up my paycheck such that I can't afford to stay in a hotel overnight. I'm going to get probably 4000 in back pay on the 24th, which is not helpful at all. It took them over three weeks to approve the six week leave, which is why I was getting short checks. But I'm still thinking about it. Like, I could break into a vacation (inaudible at 08:30) I have a few other things. I also really resent spending money on a hotel (pause) when, like...

THERAPIST: You're also paying rent.

CLIENT: Yeah, like, I'm also paying rent. Any hotel I could get too easily is probably going to be a lot, if they have a vacancy. And (pause) yeah. And also, staying with friends just feels like (pause) less intrusive, like they're would be someone there to talk to if I wanted to or if I, I don't know. While I don't really want to be surrounded by the small children I also don't really want to just be alone.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 09:37) there's one six and a half year old.

CLIENT: She's really (inaudible at 09:40) but...

THERAPIST: Oh really?

CLIENT: I mean, I really love her. I think she's adorable.

THERAPIST: Did she sleep well?

CLIENT: (laughter) Did she sleep well or did I sleep well?

THERAPIST: Oh, did she?

CLIENT: Sort of. She reads until she's made to turn off the lights and then she's going to turn off the lights again. (inaudible at 10:02) often climbing into her mother's bed and waking her up and then saying, "OK, I'll read a book." (laughter) So, I'm like, well, I guess if she woke me up and then read a book that would be OK. And the dog mostly just, like, makes whoopy (ph) noises on the ground.

But yeah, last night was just really, really hard. Like, it was really hard, like, for me to talk to Ashby about it. When we were like, "What should we do? What should we plan?" (inaudible at 10:49) I was like, "I don't want to be here. I don't want to be here." And she's apologizing that she couldn't be here because she's flying.

THERAPIST: Yeah, I imagine you were incredibly anxious.

CLIENT: Yeah. I didn't really sleep very well. Like, I probably fell asleep around 2:30 or so and then woke up around 6:00. At that point I was like, "Oh, screw it" and took Valium, slept a little bit more. But it was not relaxing. I'm not tired but I certainly don't feel like, oh, that was a well rested evening. And then, like, our other big fear with Ashby and I is well, what if he wants to come in while we're gone for a (inaudible at 12:00) emergency, what do you want to do. (sighs)

The other thing is, like, part of me is like, "I would just like to go home for Christmas right now, except that I don't want to be home with my parents right now." And, like, a friend of mine who's driving to upstate Pennsylvania. (inaudible at 12:29) can I just stay at your house? (inaudible at 12:31) she's having a really anxious week. So that's not good either but (pause) it's I don't know. I think everything is disrupted and I just want to, like, do normal things at my house and I can't. Like make lasagna. But that whole process just seems like (pause) I don't know. I was going to do that last night because I [wrote the letter] (ph) it sounds, like, OK now. And I was thinking maybe today and [I was just too mentally wiped out] (ph), so no.

One of the things I was talking to Ashby about is I feel like (pause), you know, we're both, like this [isn't going to completely make sense] (ph) but I'm like, we're both grown adults. We're responsible adults. Why is there a landlord? Like, why do we have this ridiculous landlord? Like, it feels like this is the landlord you have when you're, like, 24 and living in Manchester (ph), you know? (laughter) Not like actual adults doing adult things and paying real rent. And we talked about this, you know, how quickly can we move, which is (pause) I don't know. Unfortunately it's probably still March, but maybe February if we were...

THERAPIST: You just don't think they'll be enough available by then? [00:14:52]

CLIENT: There's two things I don't know if there would be anything available and we'd have to pack. So there's that. What we'll probably end up doing is at that point, like, find a friend in unemployment and give him (ph) some money to help us pack, like, during the day or something.

THERAPIST: Wait say that again.

CLIENT: Well, (inaudible at 15:25) thinking is I'm sure, like, I know someone in unemployment who would like some cash. Have them, like, pack for us. Like, we can pack some but, you know, there's only so much you can do. It's just very overwhelming.

THERAPIST: Sure. And [I sense that] (ph) you're, like, really, really keyed (ph) up.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: You just don't feel safe at all in your apartment I think.

CLIENT: No, I really don't and there's that ultimate between wanting to (inaudible at 16:20) on something, to kind of make some, like, sound so I don't think about, like, what's that noise outside? What's that other noise? And then feeling like I don't really want to I would rather, like, do something less, like, stimulating and more relaxing and quiet, except that it's really hard to do that too. Like, if I turn off the TV or turn off the music I just sit there being anxious. Like, I'm just sitting there with my eyes closed (inaudible at 17:05). I'm really worried, I'm really scared. I don't want to do this. What do I have to do next?

And also thinking that I really don't want to tell my, like I just so don't want to tell my parents about this, so very much. And I don't know. Like, I'm moving so that's going to be relevant. But I also, like, don't want to talk about it with them. I've already (inaudible at 18:02) experience. I cannot have my mom help me pack. (inaudible at 18:06)

THERAPIST: Yeah, I imagine that would be horrible, yeah.

CLIENT: Yeah (inaudible at 18:11) when I was 23, [because I was so mad] (ph). (pause) (inaudible at 18:29) Like, buying Christmas presents is also really annoying. (inaudible at 18:38) I don't know. Like, what do you want? (sighs)

THERAPIST: Like you can't think straight?

CLIENT: Yeah. (pause) I also can't like, my brother and sister-in-law gave some really specific items so it's kind of like, OK, I can go click (ph) that, sort of. I feel like it's just, like, hard to think straight and it's hard for me to think like, OK, well, let's say I want to get, like, a stocking stuffer off (ph) list. What would they want? And then I just start thinking about my landlord and, like, that I'm really stressed and that (pause) like, my other worry is sometimes when I'm visiting (ph) (inaudible at 19:42) I sort of just spend money and not really pay attention. So I don't so then I'm also obsessively thinking about that. Like, I shouldn't just buy things, except for I need to buy a few things. But I shouldn't. So that's also. And then also thinking, "Oh god, we have to pay to move."

THERAPIST: Do you have...

(silence)

THERAPIST: Do you have anything fantasies or bad dreams or intrusive thoughts about what he's going to do or what could happen? [00:21:09]

CLIENT: I'm worried that he's going to yell or be mean tonight, when looking at Ashby's room. I worried that he's going to go, like, through our stuff either, like, tomorrow or Thursday or while we're gone. I'm worried he's going to come into the apartment and just (sighs) like, I don't even really (pause) I think, you know, when I come back from vacation I'm probably going to just walk around [for a while being] (ph) like, does anything look like it moved? Do I think he touched this? [Do I think he touched this? Do I think he touched this?] (ph) And while the biggest ticket items that Ashby and I own are laptops and she took hers and I'm going to take mine, there's still just, like, you know, our stuff.

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 22:26) it's really more the intrusion than sort of the dollar value that you're concerned about.

CLIENT: Yeah, like, I...

THERAPIST: Like he's going to sort of break or steal something that's worth a lot and more, like, knowing he could get in there and you have no control over it. It might even be hard to know is sort of the scary part.

CLIENT: Yeah. So when he was more amusingly eccentric, [one time] (ph) he had someone over he was trying to sleep with and...

THERAPIST: He had someone over he was trying to sleep with?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Like, he had somebody over that he was interested in? Like, (inaudible at 23:22) happen?

CLIENT: Oh, so this was when he was still living on the first floor below. (inaudible at 23:31) a gay man (inaudible at 23:31) age, he has pickup sex [with some regularity] (ph) and tells us about it. So he picks someone up and, like, I was out [watering the garden] (ph) that night or something. Yeah, I was [watering the garden] (ph) and he sort of came up and was like, "Hey, I have this friend and he's really stressed from the long week and (inaudible at 23:52) drink," and like blah blah blah blah. "Do you have any clear liquor because he doesn't like whiskey." And I just said yes, you know. I was (inaudible at 24:03) I was like, "Yeah, you can" I offered to bring it down to him. He said, "No, can I just go down up and get it from your apartment?" I said sure. And the next morning I woke up and the bottle of Vodka was just sitting on the kitchen floor. So he'd come in and returned it. And so, like, I imagined that, like...

THERAPIST: Did that freak you out at the time?

CLIENT: It didn't really. Like, I thought it was weird that he (pause) the weirdest part to me was that he left it on the floor. Like, I just assumed that he would, you know, leave it in the back staircase or maybe, like, open the sort of back door, put it right inside and shut the door. (pause) I don't know. Like, there's a context where I was like that was completely weird. I would prefer you not do that again but now I would say no and be really upset if he did that. And so I think, you know, it's going to be Christmas. He's going to have a fight with his family at some point and (pause), you know, the house that we rent is his family's house. It's the house that he grew up in and I think that's part of why he's so weird about it. [00:25:47]

Like, I think he's basically, like, "This house is mine. All parts of it are mine," even though, you know, he's renting it out. When we first moved in, at one point he'd told us that he'd shown his mother Ashby's bedroom because he was impressed with how well it was set up for a small space and that's where I think his parents lived in (ph). I don't know but Ashby and I both were like, "What? OK. What?" [So I'm just thinking of him] (ph) having a fight with his parents, coming over our house to, like, drink, smoke pot, whatever and I completely see him deciding to do that inside rather than outside. Because right now, periodically well, in the summer he would just drink beer in our side yard and smoke, which was a little weird but (inaudible at 27:03) I don't know. Like, (inaudible at 27:13) weren't too freaked out by it. We just didn't like it. And now I really don't want him too. Like, it feels very...

THERAPIST: You asked him not to come into your apartment while you were away?

CLIENT: That's what I needed to tell you. (pause) So the thing is I don't think that would stop him at all.

THERAPIST: Yeah, sure.

CLIENT: I know the first floor people already a huge back and forth with him over not wanting to come in when they're not there, after he used their shower.

THERAPIST: Right, and snagged (ph) their towel.

CLIENT: Yeah. And (inaudible at 28:00) he's like, "But this is my house." I'm also afraid that he's going to like, what his reaction to that will be. And then also, like, my other worry so right now, things are kind of messy, mostly due to me. Like, I was in the middle of, like, washing and folding and putting away some of my clothes and then all of this happened and I was just like, I can't do anything. So I also feel like, well what if he tries to, like I don't even know. Like, insists the apartment needs to be cleaner or whatever weird ass reason [it is] (ph). Or like I feel like what if he comes in and takes pictures of our apartment?

THERAPIST: It sounds, from the things you've said so far, like he does stuff because it's convenient for him and because he feels entitlement, like irrespective of appropriate boundaries or whatever. But it doesn't sound like he does stuff that's sort of particularly intrusive like that.

CLIENT: My thought is that he would do is part of, like, "I'm going to get back at you for making" like, the removing of the dryer and his letter of demands...

THERAPIST: I see, so (inaudible at 29:45) retaliatory?

CLIENT: Yeah, like, both retaliatory and strange (inaudible at 29:54). And since we hit him with, you know, sanitary violation for the house I worry he's going to try to come back with sanitary violation fire hazard, which he can't because it's not a fire hazard. So yeah, I worry about that. I worry that he's going to try to evict us, which he can't. Like, legally he just can't. And I also really doubt he could successfully give us a legal eviction notice but (inaudible at 30:56).

THERAPIST: Yeah, I guess that's another (inaudible at 31:03) of, like, how scary you feel is how helpless you are. Like, you really can't control what he does when you're away, (inaudible at 31:16) or not. If he's going to show up he's going to show up. Or if he's going to make some ridiculous sort of demand he's going to make a ridiculous demand and, you know, there's something he can't do, like evict you, but...

CLIENT: But he can try.

THERAPIST: He can try. He can show up to your apartment. He can make other strange demands with like the one that he made on the dryer.

CLIENT: Yeah. I mean...

THERAPIST: You do sound (inaudible at 31:43).

CLIENT: (inaudible at 31:44)

THERAPIST: You do sound a little calmer as we're kind of at this part of it. Is that right or am I completely misperceiving it?

CLIENT: Oh, I don't feel calmer I just sound calmer.

THERAPIST: OK. You feel about as keyed (ph) up or even more keyed (ph) up?

CLIENT: More keyed (ph) up.

THERAPIST: More keyed (ph) up. Why do you sound calmer?

CLIENT: Just, like, (inaudible at 32:09) stress reaction and just feeling (inaudible at 32:14), like, OK, I don't really want to (crosstalk) right now.

THERAPIST: All right. (inaudible at 32:22) Yeah, I had the sense as you were talking like maybe you were feeling sort of a little more active and a little more (inaudible at 32:33). You had that (inaudible at 32:34) and remembering a time when he wasn't so scary and some of that was settling you down. But it doesn't sound like that's what was happening at all it sounds like you were just sort of stuffing into a closet all the, like, the (inaudible at 32:47) that you could, or at least from what you're presenting, what you were thinking.

CLIENT: I mean, part of talking about the other thing, like previous things, is that (pause) I don't know. Like, Ashby and I talked about, like, had we set a bad precedent in letting him being, you know, really chill about things in the past and, like, not getting on his case when he kind of would wonder upstairs and whatever or having him come in when we weren't there.

THERAPIST: I think it's a creepy (ph) fucked up situation, exasperated by PFT.

CLIENT: Yeah. I mean, like that's part of why so Ashby had wanted to withhold, like, (inaudible at 33:48) withhold for not being able to have, like, use of our apartment. And what tipped me over to saying yes was I'm like, "You know, I can't be comfortable in this house because of you and this is totally reducing my ability to, like, be in the place that I'm renting. I spend money on this and I would really not like that." And that was my other concern about [friend with child] (ph), is that (pause), like, I don't know if I should do it but, like, sort of the idea of her sort of, like, running and jumping into bed while I was sleep. It just makes me feel, like, already (ph) scared of it.

THERAPIST: Would it help (inaudible at 35:00)?

CLIENT: I'm going to and also probably she's a (inaudible at 35:10) six year old so I will probably talk to them (ph) as well. But (pause) I just also feel bad for imposing on my friends. (pause) And I very much feel like I can't do this by myself. And Ashby's helped but she's not in the state anymore.

THERAPIST: Yeah, I really don't think it's (inaudible at 35:57) for you to stay there, I mean, being as you're [at this mental health] (ph) threshold. I mean, like you're really symptomatic from this, kind of, you know, (inaudible at 36:11) is really feeling scared and awful and having less sleep and being preoccupied and not being able to concentrate (inaudible at 36:17). That's bad and I rather, like, being somewhere that feels safe. It's very important for settling down.

CLIENT: Yeah. The other thing which is going to be unhelpful is my mom loves to just open doors, all the time. So that's going to also suck. Like, she's gotten somewhat better a little bit but she still feels there's no problem. Just, bam. And I'm also really worried that this won't be done by, like, the time I leave or the time I come back. And even if, like, the repairs part is done, him just appearing like in the basement, which he's semi-living in. That's where we do our laundry.

THERAPIST: Yeah, [you need to] (ph) get the fuck out of there.

CLIENT: Yeah. (pause) (inaudible at 38:04) that I just don't feel safe in the apartment with the doors locked. I mean, I just I really don't and I really don't want, like we (inaudible at 38:25) laundry, washer in our unit and then the dryer's in the basement. And I don't want to do my laundry but nor do I want to (inaudible at 38:36) to the Laundromat, because that sucks. (pause) I mean, it's just being really it's also super hard to ask friends for help, partially (ph) because I don't want to explain everything. (pause) And then, like, right now this sort of overlap with (inaudible at 39:09) going back to work. I don't want to be back at work right now. And while I have some time I really don't want to (inaudible at 39:23).

(silence)

CLIENT: And (inaudible at 39:44) one of the things that's so frustrating last night and this afternoon I wanted to just, like, lie in bed with my cat and just, like, [play the white noise] (ph) and, like, just pet her or kind of close my eyes and rest. And it was just like I couldn't. Like, I tried her because that's usually very relaxing. And I could rest a little bit but then I would get nervous and, like, I couldn't get relaxed enough to sleep. Like, I know I slept and that, like, time passed but (pause) that's it. I also really don't like taking Valium to not be completely freaked out but on the other hand I'm saying, well I just can't spend the whole day being really freaked out.

THERAPIST: That's awful and it's very wearing (ph).

CLIENT: Yeah, and (inaudible at 41:24), like, I was debating (ph) if I wanted to call on any of my friends. If I wanted to call Zoe or really anyone and (sighs) I kind of (inaudible at 41:44) don't want to talk about any of this. Like, I would like to hear someone else talk to me about something. But...

THERAPIST: (inaudible at 41:55) something else?

CLIENT: Yeah, like, I reserved (inaudible at 42:03) to do tomorrow for most of the day. So that...

THERAPIST: That'd be good.

CLIENT: It's not at my house. It's something that's, like, kind of descending (ph) without being mentally (pause) whatever. It will be good. I just really wish that I was doing that because I wanted to.

THERAPIST: Right, and (inaudible at 42:47) the two things that they (ph) go to do tomorrow that would help get your mind off how scared and awful you feel.

CLIENT: And also just to get me, like, out of the area for a big chunk of time.

THERAPIST: Yeah. (inaudible at 43:08) for now.

(inaudible background conversation)

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