TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: I survived today mostly. (chuckling)

THERAPIST: Why did you survive today?

CLIENT: Yea. It was interesting is all the anxiety that I had been having before we got an apartment about our landlord being there and Ashby (ph) had been really calm. Suddenly Ashby (ph) developed all of my anxiety and was a nervous wreck. Yea. I guess we traded. And then what's really surprising to me, she was very concerned that the movers would be mad at us or annoyed. And I was like, "I don't think they care." And she said, "But we have so much stuff." I'm like, "We're paying them." And then she was like, "No. They will be mad about this and that." And I was just like, "Ashby, we give them money." [0:01:01] But she said, "We should be helping them." I'm like, "No, we pay them money. It's great."

THERAPIST: Right, right. And in proportion to how much stuff you have.

CLIENT: Yes, exactly. And also we're going to give them a cash tip at the end.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And also you're deranged. She couldn't sleep at all the night before we moved.

THERAPIST: Oh, poor thing.

CLIENT: Yea, I felt bad. So the other thing about moving though is it definitely reinforced that I am not as physically able as I used to be. The new apartment is a third floor apartment and walking up and down [just taking a flight of steps] (ph) a couple times. And then up to the third floor was it just became so painful. [0:02:01] And it's kind of like, ha, yea, right. Maybe they've got to be paid movers.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: Because there is no way I've could have done that. And…

THERAPIST: While we're talking about it, I think I should probably get the address.

CLIENT: It's in Ball Square. It's I, too, lived on that street about eight years ago. [0:03:04] (chuckling) Yea, it's nice. It's right near this little convenience store. Right by a couple friends of mine and a coffee shop.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: So yea, I'm pretty happy with it. And our new landlord is friendly and fixes things competently.

THERAPIST: That's great.

CLIENT: Yea. When we first moved in, he was like, "Oh yea, I need to replace these light bulbs for you." And just replaced them and fixed the smoke detector and one other thing. [0:04:00]

THERAPIST: Oh, good.

CLIENT: Yea. So it's very nice to have a landlord that's competent and does things.

THERAPIST: Good.

CLIENT: So as my first day back at work which was I guess…

THERAPIST: I think that was before…

CLIENT: It's before I moved. It was Monday.

THERAPIST: I thought we talked after your birthday.

CLIENT: We talked…

THERAPIST: Back… yea, there was like a thing for new people working at the library so you could go.

CLIENT: Yea. That's still annoying me a lot.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: Yea, it's very… I don't know. For whatever reason, like it's that I went to work and having sort of like rehired a bunch of white people what about it is very frustrating right now. [0:05:07] And it's also very discouraging in terms of sort of finishing off my own library degree. So the jobs they hired for are term… like they're one year contract positions. So even the contract positions nationwide job search, blah, blah, blah, blah it's prestigious. It's Cambridge and that's what they came up with. And no one… well, that's not true. None of my coworkers that are white are at all surprised or like have noticed or anything. [0:06:05] So that's really frustrating to me.

But also I think like, OK, so I hit the job market and what? And so I'm just having a hard time sort of thinking beyond that. And thinking, well, but I know people. And I know a guy who knows a guy. And I probably have contacts at various places. Mostly I just feel super discouraged and frustrated. (pause) So yea, and I don't know.

The other thing that's super frustrating to me is… I mean, it's not new. [0:07:05] But Chet (ph) is frustrating me a lot. His… so Chet (ph) always says he's very, very busy and has (inaudible at 0:07:16) things to do. And I've always been like that's not true. And now that I'm sharing office space with him, I'm just like yep, that's not really true. But you do a good job of looking very busy. So he's on my case. He's always been on my case about making sure I do enough multimedia work and IT work. And I'm always like, OK, can you… I do all the multimedia work I'm given. I'm not really sure where I can go from here.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And he's like, "Well, but I need you…" and so his fixation is if I… he wants me to account for all my time every day…

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: …in 15 minute increments. [0:08:04] And I really, really don't want to. I remain really not wanting to. And I remain asking him for work that he won't give me. Though he does say, well, I should feel free to use the student workers if I'm too overwhelmed with multimedia work. And I'm just like, "But you won't give me any."

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: So I don't know. It just… it's so frustrating. I feel like when we're speaking face-to-face, I'm just like, well, but I am asking you for work. [0:09:04] And you don't respond or give me an hour of work. But you're worried that… I don't know. I guess even the ten minute of conversation isn't coherent which is maddening. And so if any other thing of that, it feels, to me, micromanaging and infantilizing to allot for my time that way.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And I really want to such say no but I'm not sure. That feels like a little bit of a nuclear option to just refuse. [0:10:06] Yea. And the other thing was on what was it Monday yesterday just finished moving and was already feeling stiff and uncomfortable. And towards the end of the day, I was feeling really physically miserable. But it was kind of like, well, nothing I can do. And at one point I accidentally left my ID card inside a closet that you open with an ID card. And I was just like…

THERAPIST: It was locked (inaudible at 0:10:49)?

CLIENT: Yea, exactly. So I called him on my phone. I was like, "Could you please come down and get… release my ID?" And I get out and he walks aside of me and I'm walking super slowly and carefully because I'm in a ton of pain. [0:11:04] And he's kind of… and he's starts commenting like, "Oh, you seem to be moving a little… is everything OK?" "Nope, I'm in a lot of pain." And he said, "Well, I seem surprised." He's like, "Oh, I'm so sorry. Is there anything I can do?" "No, I'm not really sure." I'm like, I thought that I'd already conveyed that periodically I was going to be like one of the reasons to work part-time and take breaks is to avoid being in excruciating pain. But…

THERAPIST: So is more like his not having made the connection.

CLIENT: Yea, it was weird because I felt like… I don't know.

THERAPIST: You mean like it's a, "Oh gosh, it looks like you're moving a little slow is now one of the times in the day that you're hurting a lot." [0:12:01]

CLIENT: Or people went, "Oh, right. I forgot."

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: "That thing."

THERAPIST: I see. It just seemed like de novo. What they do and it's unconnected to until a link before.

CLIENT: Exactly. And also sort of oddly I had at the beginning of the day it was… my allergies had gone crazy in part due to moving. And as I was sneezing, sneezing and sneezing. And I'm like, "Oh, I'm sorry. My allergies are crazy moving." And his response was like, "Oh, yea." And I was like, "Moving causes a lot of dust." And he's like, "Yea, I kind of sense you're not the kind of person who really keeps up on vacuuming or is just really obsessive about that." And I was just going like… I mean, that's true. But I was like the response is supposed to be, "Oh, that's too bad that you're sneezing continuously."

THERAPIST: Right, right.

CLIENT: Not, "I hear that you're a crappy housekeeper." [0:13:00]

THERAPIST: Right. Although…

CLIENT: Right.

THERAPIST: …I guess he wasn't saying you're crappy.

CLIENT: Well, he was saying that it's just like, "Oh, you're not somebody who keeps… who vacuums a lot and keeps up on the housekeeping."

THERAPIST: Oh, I probably misunderstood.

CLIENT: Oh, yea.

THERAPIST: I thought you were saying he said that he thought you were somebody who did vacuum a lot.

CLIENT: No, he said, "You strike me as someone who doesn't vacuum and really keep up on dusting."

THERAPIST: Oh my God.

CLIENT: Yea. It was… I was very flustered.

THERAPIST: That's stunning.

CLIENT: Yea. Because that's not what you… in a round of empty social things that one says…

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: …that didn't fit.

THERAPIST: No, not at all. That seems really uncouth.

CLIENT: Yes. Not suitable for an (inaudible at 0:13:55). (pause) Yea, it was very weird. I was just… it did… it was sort of… I don't know. It was… it just ended up being rude. It was so out of like the empty…

THERAPIST: But the thing is it's like impolitic in a way that I wouldn't have imagined from him.

CLIENT: Yea. (pause) Yea, yea, because partly because he's usually so smooth and polished and I'm just like where the hell…

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And also… I don't know. I just think I could do social niceties on auto pilot.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: Once you've met a lot of people are just like you're not even paying attention. You're just like, oh, excuse me, blah, blah, blah. You don't even listen really to what the other person is saying but you know what the correct response is. (pause) So that surprised me. [0:15:00]

THERAPIST: I wonder whether there are also two aspects to it. One in which like both of these examples with what he said. You have (inaudible at 0:15:11) puts you in pain. I mean, those are both bad. But… or and I think they're also made worse by the fact that you're (inaudible at 0:15:27). (chuckling)

CLIENT: Yea.

THERAPIST: I mean, just really enraged…

CLIENT: Yea. I just…

THERAPIST: …for a hundred things but the most recent in which is like making you move to his office, trying to get you to account for your time.

CLIENT: Yea. And I've tried doing a lot of like, "So, I hear that you're concerned about how I spend my time. Can we do it this other way?" [0:16:00]

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And the response is, "Yes, I want you to do it… see, we want you to do it in your own calendar if you don't want to. But you still have to account for it in these increments." I'm like, "OK, but how about this?" And it's like I'm not… it does surprise me that he's this fixated on it being that way. So his stated goal of me managing my time better is not going to be very well accomplished by me being incredibly pissed off all the time.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And as someone put it… mentioned, "So you get to have a slot that is at accounting for my time like time spent accounting for my time?" [0:17:07] Because that's basically how I feel at the half hour at the end of every day which I might yet do. Although it's… I mean, it's very passive aggressive but this is how I feel. And it is what I'm going to be doing. So…

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: Yea. And for a while I'd felt… I had e-mailed FAS ph personnel about diversity and I got this appointment next week.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And I've been feeling kind of exciting about that.

THERAPIST: This is with the dean of the university?

CLIENT: This is actually with not the dean for the university. This is another foray. This is a… someone in HR who works in… not the dean of the university but works with diversity. [0:18:02] Because Cambridge College is having a year of discussions about diversity to improve diversity. (pause) He'd been inviting a lot of white people to talk. And I'm like, yea, all right. And the last person that they invited it was in December or maybe in January was when Peggy McIntosh who like 20 years ago wrote this essay called, "Unpacking the Invisible Knapsack of Privilege," that is now just sort of like oh, it's a classic of… it's not new.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: It's not a classic of understanding various forms of oppression, blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, wow, that's not cutting edge, guys. I mean, no. [0:19:02] And just like breathing through… like all through the topics. I was like, wow. I think the most important message that FAS is conveying here is that no one is racist at our college.

THERAPIST: That's depressing.

CLIENT: Yea. So with me being really depressed and grumpy about that is why I e-mailed and said, "Nah, nah, nah." And now I'm feeling like, oh, this appointment I'm going to have with him is just going to be for show. Nothing is going to happen.

THERAPIST: Hold on. I'm sorry. Who is it with?

CLIENT: It's with a random… it's just…

THERAPIST: Oh, it's just the HR person.

CLIENT: A Cambridge College HR person. That is not… it's not my designated HR person. It's someone else in HR.

THERAPIST: Yea, right. (pause) [0:20:00]

CLIENT: And the other thing sort of with Chet (ph) being so… just kind of rude on Monday, one of my thoughts was like I just… I was feeling like… especially at the end of the day I was really… I was just very uncomfortable and snappish.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: And this… I just sort of chilled the conversation. I don't think I really need to be chatting with anyone anymore right now because I'll probably kill someone. And I was thinking I really… to Chet (ph)… I kind of want to send Chet (ph) is like remedial manager-ness. I actually don't think that he was given any instruction on how to be a manager. I think they just sort of like, ding.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: And he got another report. [0:21:02] One of the new librarians they hired… which is also frustrating in that for many reasons including that he, at one point, got in trouble for sexually harassing one… a female student worker a while ago. And when I mean trouble, I mean it was a bit of a scandal but nothing really happened. And that he's still supervising female students. (pause) I think one of the reasons he got away with it is that he eventually ended up… let's see. I don't remember. Someone else was telling me about it and I'm just like that's gross. Not appropriate. But it's (inaudible at 0:21:57) just I agree. (pause) I don't know. (pause)

I think one of the reasons why I'm so frustrated and mad at Chet (ph), as I sort of sit here thinking, I just know more than you and it's really irritating that no one cares. And there's only so much I can keep myself entertained doing other things. And by entertained, I mean like, yea, I can definitely do some (inaudible at 0:22:57) whatever. But there's only so much of that that will distract me from how much I can't stand you. And now when I sit, we're kitty-corner across from each other. So I'm just kind of staring at you all day which is not… it's really terrible. I am getting some nice natural light from the window. And I'm also staring at it a lot.

And the other thing in which I can't stand is the way that my cube is set up. People can come up from behind me. I'm like there's a combination of people can come up from behind me and look at my screen which I don't like. But they also they can just up from behind me and I hate people who come up from behind me. And the office is super distracting and just everything. [0:24:03] (pause)

And unfortunately my library ethics class is driving me a little bit crazy. (pause) I don't know. It's just sort of… this week's assignment we were talking about… specifically about library ethical codes and guidelines for librarians like the American Library Association. And we had a bunch of readings about that and readings about… I mean, it's a voluntary code. It's not like a law. [0:25:01] Nothing really… whatever. It's not like a lawyer's code of ethics or a physician's code of ethics.

And so there was some discussion of how to encourage discussion of how these apply in the workplace. There are discussions of how the Patriot Act has affected librarians in that with Patriot Act a lot of librarians felt… the Patriot Act allows the… our government to theoretically look at patrons' library records which are supposed to be confidential. And library guidelines say that patron library records and information that they request, whatever they ask the reference desk, et cetera, is supposed to be confidential. You're not supposed to tell other people. [0:26:00]

And so there have been sort of ongoing issues with what books did that person check out? Has anyone come in to ask about something suspicious like Islam? And so there's a lot of that going around. There's also been a lot of, like, is there Internet filtering software on the public computers? And what if someone accesses controversial materials from inside the library and blah, blah, blah? And so there's all these things going on.

And one of the rules we read sort of cracked me up in that it was written in like I think the 19… was written in the 30s. It was written between World War I and World War II by a Spanish author. And it was this very like it reads of the times. It was kind of a grandiose… like, "The profession of the librarian." [0:27:06] And it was like you're going back and like "as in Caesar's time." And it's very… I'm like, oh, my God. Except for if you move past the structure and things like that, it was a pretty interesting article. Also being of its time it is the men… it's like the brotherhood of… it's basically like librarians who were totally men. Maybe there's a woman and talking a lot about that. And so the language also bogs you down a little bit or bogs me down a little bit because it's very manly.

And part of what he talked about was that when you are a professional when you're in a profession you have to surrender some of your individualism to be part of the group. [0:28:00] And I was going, that's phrased weirdly. And people were kind of talking about that and the professor was like, "I think what he means… I don't really know. But I think what he's trying to say is that as a librarian, you might say, well, ALA's guidelines say you don't promote your personal beliefs at the reference desk, for example.

So if someone comes in and is pursuing a topic that you find offensive, you… someone is like, "I really want to learn more about the KKK because they're so awesome." You're just like, "Well, OK. This is where you find those books." Or if you're like, "I think someone else can help you better with this." But you don't say, "I think you're an asshole." [0:29:00]

And so I was like, yea, so I can see that. And blah, blah, blah. And one of the things… and people was talking about the importance of looking professional. And there's this ad campaign which has this image that's very striking is that it shows the same person in two pictures. And in one of them is it's this guy with a shaved head. He's wearing this sleeveless shirt and he's covered in tattoos. You could see from… all just tattoos, tattoos. And he's wearing jeans and this cut off shirt. And then the next picture is this same person wearing a lab coat and he's a doctor. So he's a doctor and he this little stethoscope on. And they picked the campaign as you should look past your own personal prejudices. This guy that you may perceive as being a thug in this one photo if you saw him in this other that you'd be like oh, my God, is this a trusted professional? [0:30:02] It's like, yes, that's so true. And some people were like, "Oh my God. What? No. That's not even true." But it is…

THERAPIST: What [are you saying?] (ph)

CLIENT: So someone had said that they were so shocked and amazed that this was the same person.

THERAPIST: OK. Gotcha. I got it.

CLIENT: And I was a little bit like, well, I mean, it is a dramatic photo. But I'm not really sure what to tell you. A lot of people have tattoos and other things. I guess I was kind of surprised by that in 1997 when I have heard of it but… and I tried to be kind but I wasn't feeling very compassionate. Anyway, so in discussing that, there was sort of this discussion of the importance of looking professional. [0:31:02] And that this doctor should definitely cover all his tattoos at all times because otherwise you just… it was kind of this odd argument where they were like on the one hand, they were like oh, it's really interesting. And it shows me that I shouldn't harbor these prejudices against somebody's appearance. But I also think that they should cover their tattoos at work because otherwise other people might feel uncomfortable having a tattooed doctor.

I was like, by other people, do you mean you? And then there's this sort of like this flow of discussion of still talking about like, well, on the one hand this doctor might make some patients feel more comfortable because they're like, oh, this doctor is like me. [0:32:01] He's… whatever. But it's still bad because it's not a professional image and I don't know demeans or degrades the profession as doctoring. And I found that very frustrating.

And so… and people were just kind of like… and so one of the things that I've… I think I've have thought about it more than some of the other people is what it means… like what… how… the ways in which like looking professional can be used as a way to impose control over people and how they look and over their bodies. And who people hire for receptionist jobs often part of… they use language that basically means we would like a young, pretty secretary. [0:33:11] That puts a good friendly image for the office. I'm like you mean young and thin.

And then also there's been… I've read this really interesting article about libraries in the southwest and public libraries that allowed staff and volunteers to wear clothing that indicated some amount of ethnic pride. And so it would be OK if you wore a Dominican pride flag or something. If you wore something that was like that's a little small, ethnic accessory, then that made the community feel much more comfortable coming into the library. [0:34:03] And the things they suggested were so mild that I was kind of surprised.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: Because there were things like wearing a checkerboard wristbands and having a wallet chain and few other things. I'm just like…

THERAPIST: Relatively subtle.

CLIENT: Yea, things where I'm like, why would you even complain about that? I don't understand where we're going here?

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: The other one was letting men have long hair which, again, I was like I thought that was OK. I just thought that would be OK but… and so they were talking about how this really improved things. And then in the Teen Room, if your Teen Room volunteers can also either do or wear something that indicates they're like, yes, there are Latinos in the area. And this makes you feel much more comfortable.

And so I had mentioned that and then I was saying, part of the problem is that we're thinking of sort of like… sort of the things some might have been the individual to be part of the group library professionals. [0:35:10] There are some people for whom this is… might be easier than some people think. So some people have visual indicators that make people think they're not part of the group. You can cover your tattoos but you can't cover your skin color.

THERAPIST: Right. I see.

CLIENT: Or I think I said… I was like, gender expression raised ethnicity, disability, a few other things. I was like these are all things that make it… that someone might feel like they have to suppress or be a part of the group. Or someone who's part of the group might say, "I don't know. You just don't look very professional to me." Meaning, you seem to be using a wheelchair.

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And so I was kind of like I didn't really flush it out because I was… didn't have Internet until today. And I was in a rush but I'm like (inaudible at 0:36:05). And one person responded in this way that was… so her response was first to say that people with disabilities can be librarians which was not what I was asking. (chuckling) And it was weird because she's like, "Well, they may not be able to participate fully or be really as 100 percent as normal people but…" or I think it was just regular people. "But it's still really important to have their presence." And I was like, "I really… wait? What? I wasn't… OK, that wasn't my argument. But OK." And I was, well, I mean, like whatever. I didn't make an effort because we may have been thinking in different directions. [0:37:05] She also mentioned cognitive disabilities. And I was like, oh, I wasn't really going there. I was going wheelchair user or something like that.

THERAPIST: Something apparent.

CLIENT: Yea. And she seemed to be going Downs Syndrome.

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: And I'm like, oh, I think what you're… yea, I was like… I mean… and then she commented that she didn't think that in this day and age that gender discrimination existed anymore. And so that, therefore, female librarians didn't need to worry about not being able to be a member of the boy's club.

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: And I said, wow. No. So she's one of the younger students in the class. And by younger, I mean she's under 25. And it was such a… I read it and I was like, wow. I don't… I mean, I set aside disabilities. I think we're just really not communicating well. [0:38:08] But how do you not… gender discrimination still exists. I'm not really… I don't really know what to say because it's a female student telling me that she doesn't think gender discrimination exists. But she's also… there's also someone who pretty clearly… she has not yet worked in a library or maybe at a full-time job (inaudible at 0:38:39).

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And I don't know. I'm still not sure. I found it incredibly… not just off putting but I felt… I just… I'm like I don't really know what we can talk about because I feel like I… for someone who says gender based discrimination (inaudible at 0:39:13), I'm like I think that's a fact that it exists and you're saying it can't. And I don't know how like… I don't… A, I don't actually want to get in a prolonged argument about whether or not gender based discrimination exists because I don't want to. But also I don't know how… I'm like, how did you miss this? [0:40:00] I just… I guess I feel like I thought that we, as people, especially women had noticed or accepted or agreed or something that women still make less than men per dollar or… (pause)

THERAPIST: I guess I sort of wave my arms (inaudible at 0:40:50). I think this is one of those case where you're from the way you're talking about it kind of anticipating or maybe I'm wrong or that I'll respond like, oh my God. That's so fucking crazy. [0:41:05] How annoying to have somebody A, not listen to your point and make a totally different point that's kind of ridiculous. And B, to assert something like that which is so sort of factually evidently false and also, I imagine, feels kind of like a betrayal.

CLIENT: Yea.

THERAPIST: But I think your sort of tone is on one end it's sort of conveyed that in such a way that it pulls, I think for that kind of response from me. But also in a way where it's like you're kind of stunned or kind of can't imagine not can't imagine or sort of taken aback or surprised or a bit incredulous about how she's being. [0:42:06] When I think you actually… how it kind of makes sense to you. It's just really annoying, frustrating, marginalizing. Yea.

CLIENT: So I guess there's sort of two parts of how I feel about this girl. So the part about people with disabilities I was like… yea, I was kind of like (inaudible at 0:42:29).

THERAPIST: Right.

CLIENT: And so I'm sort of trying to set that aside because I'm just like I really… I shouldn't have… I mean, in a way, why did I bring that up knowing that? But the part about in this day and age there's no gender discrimination in addition to like…. I actually am shocked. In part, because her… the language that she uses in talking about… as used with her message or posts in talking about these things is the language of vaguely liberal progressives. [0:43:13]

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: So her language is probably when she phrased things sort of led me down as like, oh, OK. Well, she's probably… she's aware of progressive issues.

THERAPIST: I see. So a total mismatch between that and...

CLIENT: Yea. I mean, even when she was talking about people with disabilities and how she was using very progressive language.

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: And she could mean… she was like… it was weird. Part of what was weird is that she was using the right words and phrases that you would... like, "People with cognitive disabilities," and like…

THERAPIST: Right. Yea and I think it does sound very different that it wasn't as though you were surprised that a young woman even without experience working at a library could not know this. [0:44:05] But more that this particular person who has sort of shown other signs of being more I don't know educated or sophisticated sort of thing wouldn't have.

CLIENT: Yea, and it's also like she'd written this whole kind of interesting thing about copyright and how that affects people in our countries the ability to get information and was very concerned seemed to be like she's expressing concerns about information bottlenecks. So if you'd have to pay to get access to… if you copyright everything and you rigorously enforce copyright, it can be really hard for people who have lots of money to get access to information. And I was like, yes, that's really true. That's very… I'm like, that's very interesting. [0:45:03]

THERAPIST: I see.

CLIENT: And so I was like, this is good and OK and then some few other things. And I'm like, oh yep, yep, I see where you're going here. And she was very much using all the words and the language of, "I am a progressive nice lady."

THERAPIST: This is a very different thing.

CLIENT: Yea.

THERAPIST: We'll also have to stop. Yea.

CLIENT: I guess I felt kind of like I was at a feminist bookstore chatting with someone about food insecurity. And so she's like, "Yea, but feminism is stupid." And I was like, wait. (chuckling) Wait, I thought we were together on that. Yea.

THERAPIST: That sounds weird. Yea, that makes sense. Yea. Right. We should stop for now. I'll see you tomorrow.

CLIENT: Yes.

THERAPIST: OK. I'm glad you survived your move. [0:46:02]

CLIENT: So am I. I didn't get peed on by my cats.

THERAPIST: Good.

CLIENT: See you tomorrow.

THERAPIST: Yea.

CLIENT: Oops.

THERAPIST: That's fine.

CLIENT: OK.

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