TRANSCRIPT OF AUDIO FILE:

BEGIN TRANSCRIPT:

CLIENT: Hey. (pause) I didn't write in the number but [here it is] (ph).

THERAPIST: Okay.

CLIENT: I've got a pen, I can do it.

THERAPIST: Yeah. (pause) Thank you. (pause)

CLIENT: (sigh) Can I find a reason to do good? That's my question. [00:01:07]

THERAPIST: Hm.

CLIENT: Do something that [I think is good] (ph). (pause) (sigh) I feel like a slug lying down here. I don't know.

THERAPIST: A slug, huh?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Huh. (pause) Anything about being late? [00:02:20]

CLIENT: Yeah. That's a good way to phrase it. (pause) I was selling some milk crates and I had to mount a rack onto the back of my bike so I could do [shot cords] (ph) to put the milk crates on so I can deliver them. But the rack, I didn't allow myself enough time.

THERAPIST: Hm.

CLIENT: I also had to pack for a family reunion this weekend, so I (pause) ended up just hailing a taxi. Which of course, I forgot. I was like, "Oh, I messed up. I'll hail a taxi." But then somewhere in my mind it's just like, "The taxi will get me there and fix my mistake." But really taxis are a lot slower than bicycling. [00:03:20]

THERAPIST: Mm.

CLIENT: So I ended up being dropped off at like the south end of Amherst at like two thirty five. So it took a lot longer in the cab than I thought it would. And so I just walked the rest of the way here.

THERAPIST: Ah. Okay.

CLIENT: (inaudible at 00:03:42)

THERAPIST: Oh, why? Did you have to drop something off first?

CLIENT: Yeah, the milk crates that I was selling, I just -

THERAPIST: [You had to drop them off in Amherst before.] (ph)

CLIENT: Right. Yeah.

THERAPIST: Oh, I see. Did you forget about the times. Did you just mention that?

CLIENT: Did I forget about what?

THERAPIST: What time, because I know we've been switching around the times. Did that?

CLIENT: No, I knew what time it was.

THERAPIST: Okay.

CLIENT: But as it happens it's exactly less convenient now that we've switched.

THERAPIST: Is that right?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Mm. Well, are any days? Tell me about what your schedule is like these days.

CLIENT: I don't have a schedule any more.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: I just, I make it up.

THERAPIST: Oh, okay.

CLIENT: My schedule for today, I mean if we had met earlier I would have been able to I wouldn't have been able to do the milk crates probably. Either that or I would have got my act together earlier. But I would have been able to leave to take my bike back and then leave for a family reunion sooner or easier. [00:05:00]

THERAPIST: Because I might have a three fifteen on Wednesday if that works any better.

CLIENT: Yeah, that sounds kind of cool.

THERAPIST: Let me get back to you next week?

CLIENT: Yeah. Sounds good. Sounds good.

THERAPIST: Yeah. That will work fine actually, I think. I've just got to check with one person.

CLIENT: Is that better for you?

THERAPIST: It's the same.

CLIENT: Okay.

THERAPIST: Well, maybe a little bit better for me but not a huge difference.

CLIENT: Yeah, because today wasn't really because of the time at all.

THERAPIST: Okay.

CLIENT: I tried to arrange my day around this but I just failed.

THERAPIST: Yeah. Hm. (pause) Yeah. I'll let you know. I'll let you know next Friday. I don't think it will be a problem.

CLIENT: You'll let me know whether it's an option?

THERAPIST: Whether it's a go. I mean, whether I can do it for sure. Okay? [00:06:04]

CLIENT: Sure. (pause)

THERAPIST: And what were you saying about doing good or the slug?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: What are you feeling? I guess I'm more curious about the slug.

CLIENT: Oh, the slug. I just feel like a vile creature.

THERAPIST: Really?

CLIENT: Yeah, sort of.

THERAPIST: Being on the couch.

CLIENT: Sort of.

THERAPIST: A vile creature, wow. [00:06:56]

CLIENT: I'm holding on to some nebulous and, you know, dark, meaningless questions as a cover for a failure to act. Yeah. Someone who is fundamentally just a coward really and devises all sorts of narratives to sort of obscure that fact. (pause)

THERAPIST: Hm. What's the act? Is there one that you have in mind?

CLIENT: The act?

THERAPIST: Yeah. You said, "failing to act."

CLIENT: Oh.

THERAPIST: So I was thinking about the woman from last week.

CLIENT: (laughs) Yeah. Who? June?

THERAPIST: June, right, yeah.

CLIENT: Okay.

THERAPIST: I was just wondering if you meant [00:08:11]

CLIENT: Yeah. I think I just pick fights. It's like I said, she's fixated on negative things and complaining, and I'm fixated on picking a fight. I mean she like gave me her whole schedule, like via text message. I just said, "How's your work," and she gave me a weeklong schedule in exactum, or some Latin word. (laughs) Like she gave me the exact schedule. It's like twenty lines long.

And so it would be like, "Huh, well, it looks like you have time here." I somehow turned the conversation into like a I just doubt her authenticity.

THERAPIST: Hm.

CLIENT: I brought it to a place where, you know, she said, "I'm only thinking now." So our day comes up and I'm like, huh, maybe she wants to do something or maybe I can get her to do something. So I pose and then she says, "I can't. I have work." And then I call her out on that and she says, "Well, you're right. I want to but I can't." Or, "I want to but school is more important." Law school. [00:09:15]

And so then I just, I said something weird like Not weird but something I meant but which isn't really productive, which is just like, "At some point you're going to have to stop pushing me away." And I said, "I'm fine with being a friend." Which is true -

THERAPIST: Hm.

CLIENT: in this case.

THERAPIST: Hm.

CLIENT: But at some point you're going to have stop pushing me away.

THERAPIST: Mm.

CLIENT: And then I said Oh yeah, I said, "You know, losing you to these listless alibis is almost like the Hamptons is gone forever," or something like that. Because we connected on that point about our childhoods on the Hamptons.

THERAPIST: Oh. Uh huh.

CLIENT: So -

THERAPIST: That's a good way to put that. It's poetic.

CLIENT: I'm glad you think so. (laughs)

THERAPIST: Yes. (laughs) It's very poetic. I was just thinking that's very I wonder what she thought of that. [00:10:19]

CLIENT: Yeah. But, I mean, the obvious approach I think I'm fundamentally ambivalent about intimacy with women. I think I might be terrified of them on some level. Or more the fact that, at a certain level it's (inaudible at 00:10:39) anxiety. Like I won't be able to control myself.

THERAPIST: Huh.

CLIENT: Or I won't be able to check myself. Or more, I guess, just that I'll be hurt beyond measure and there is nothing I'll be able to do about it. I think that's what you do.

THERAPIST: Yeah. Yeah.

CLIENT: Like if you've been hurt before -

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: you just try and prevent that in the future.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: I think that's counterproductive in my case. I recognize that just recognizing the fact isn't enough to change things really.

THERAPIST: Well, I think, I mean there's the ambivalence, I think. I mean, you've fallen for women in the past and you felt very burned by it.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: I mean, certainly you want that and you don't want to be burned though. I think you've grown more kind of protective, self-protective. [00:11:41]

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: You know, you're not going to give all of yourself until you get something back, kind of thing. Or get some sort of sense that they're going to be, that they've got skin in the game.

CLIENT: Yeah. (pause)

THERAPIST: Yeah, at what point though is it also you feel you end up being like you're not going to stick your neck out either. You know?

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: I'm wondering too whether it's connected to pornography. Because, I mean, I've had thousands of sexual experiences and most of them involve porn. And it makes me wonder, well there is like a manipulation inherent in that genre, where like everything is staged just to It's sexual manipulation basically. It's a manipulation of man's animal instinct. And so I wonder whether I sort of react to that as well without realizing it. You know? (pause) I Yeah. [00:13:07]

THERAPIST: What?

CLIENT: I need help with that. I need help with pornography because it's something I can't control.

THERAPIST: What do you think? How does it impact you? What do you get -

CLIENT: I jacked off twice today. That's why I'm late.

THERAPIST: Hm.

CLIENT: There's like all kinds of Like I had a really interesting week, but when things get stressful or when I perceive something of personal importance, instead of going for it now I just jack off and it sort of goes away. It's like an escape.

THERAPIST: Oh, okay. Uh huh.

CLIENT: But it always involves pornography. It's like I get like a little tingle in my head or my gut, and I need satisfaction instantly. And it's available instantly.

THERAPIST: Uh huh. Is there something about it being like a way that you can kind of be a bit self-sufficient given that you've got pornography as an outlet?

CLIENT: Can you rephrase that?

THERAPIST: Well, yeah. Do you end up feeling like, "Well, why stick my " In other words, and this is an over simplification, but like, "Why stick my neck out sexually if I can just, you know, jerk off to porn and get some of my needs satisfied." Yeah, it's not the real deal. You know, is that? And then it makes you less kind of motivated to [00:14:30]

CLIENT: Absolutely. It's a check on my emotions which would be much more difficult to manage otherwise. It may be not be clear the way I'm phrasing, but it's like a credit to me. It's leverage against -

THERAPIST: Mm.

CLIENT: Against women. (laughs)

THERAPIST: Mm hm.

CLIENT: You know?

THERAPIST: Yeah. I see what you're saying.

CLIENT: Yeah.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: But, of course, probably over time it's sort of skewed my outlook due to so much exposure. It's like if someone couldn't help from going to the circus all the time. I know you would probably turn out kind of weird. (laughs)

THERAPIST: You wonder what kind of affect it's had to, what, you're outlook about women?

CLIENT: Sure. I used to I tried to stay away from it before when I was younger because I recognize that it turned the opposite sex into a sexual object, and would make it difficult to see them in another light. [00:15:36]

THERAPIST: Mm.

CLIENT: Just like if I read up on body language, that's what I'm going to see. I'm going to read body language -

THERAPIST: Oh. Uh huh.

CLIENT: just over and above everything else. But I guess I can always read something else and just layer it on. It's still, it's something I need help with. I don't know what to do about it. Because it's not so much, I think with any addiction, it's not the effects of the substance itself, it's the fact that you can't control yourself that is detrimental.

THERAPIST: Mm.

CLIENT: Or that you I mean, yeah, everything stems from that. You can't control yourself.

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: It's frustrating. I mean, you resolve to do something and then some part of you is just not in alignment with that.

THERAPIST: Yeah, well, maybe we need to kind of jump at that a little bit more.

CLIENT: Hm.

THERAPIST: Yeah, I got to stop for today, unfortunately. I've got to be somewhere. But, no, I hear you. You know? You want me to help with it. [00:16:54]

CLIENT: Yeah. Three thirty five. Oh, we are done, huh?

THERAPIST: Yeah.

CLIENT: It's a wrap.

THERAPIST: Yeah, yeah. I'm sorry I can't meet any later than that. I just, I have to be somewhere.

CLIENT: It's okay. I do too.

THERAPIST: Yeah. But, yeah, I hear too that I kind of kept you from being here too, you think?

CLIENT: Yeah. I otherwise would have been maybe ten minutes late.

THERAPIST: Okay. Yeah.

CLIENT: I don't know. Are these fifty minutes or fifty five minutes?

THERAPIST: Fifty. But, you know, we didn't have much time I just wanted to flesh something out a little bit.

CLIENT: Gotcha. Okay.

THERAPIST: Okay, Brandon, see you next week.

CLIENT: Sure.

END TRANSCRIPT